Film Price Increases

[B.S.Kumar]

I have no idea whether your estimate of "7% yearly growth" in the film market includes Instax, which certainly is a very large component of Fuji's film sales. As to your other questions, I'm sure he'd be delighted to have your views. Having worked in Europe, he probably speaks at least one western language reasonably well.

"Amazing" kind of photography? You can do that with collodion, Jason's dry plates, or Arista film.

Why the LF slide market isn't growing? I sold around 200 boxes of Velvia 50 8x10 last year. How many boxes of any LF film (not just Fuji products) did you and your friends buy?

I wish you wouldn't look on Fuji's policies as a "failure". They're giving up loss making (or low yielding) products to concentrate on growth sectors. Ilford is making 5% before tax, and is struggling. Hats off to them for the effort, but can your employer survive and provide you with a steady job if they make only so much? Would you be happy working for such an employer, not knowing when the company might fold?

[koraks]

Well Pere, I think there's only one solution: you start your own photographic materials company and produce color materials in sheet film formats. If you manage to sell a decent C41 film in 4x5 and 8x10 at a cost of, say, € 5 per sheet for 8x10, I'll be sure to order some from time to time. After all, you're complaining about the companies not being fair to LF users, but since you know all this and you are also a capable person, it's not exactly fair that you're not contributing to a solution. In fact, I think it's a failure on your part that you haven't started yet. It's really 3rd rate MBA behavior not to start today, given the 7% annual growth in this market segment.

[Pere Casals]

I have no idea whether your estimate of "7% yearly growth" in the film market includes Instax,

"We’re seeing film growth of 5% year-on-year globally,” says Giles Branthwaite, the sales and marketing director at Harman.

Other sources say 7%.

"Amazing" kind of photography? You can do that with collodion, Jason's dry plates, or Arista film.

We are captive customers of Fuji for LF color slides, an amazing kind of photography. WP and DP are also amazing but this is another kind of photography compared to Velvia. Fuji can kill the velvia kind.

Why the LF slide market isn't growing? I sold around 200 boxes of Velvia 50 8x10 last year. How many boxes of any LF film (not just Fuji products) did you and your friends buy?

This is my slide asset (one year ago) https://www.flickr.com/photos/125592...posted-public/

Last year I bought 4 4x5 boxes, first is that I'm starting to shot Velvia LF, as a Velvia 8x10 box of 20 is $464 (ebay, add 25% total taxes in my case) (and I cannot pay the price of a DSLR every time I put the CAMBO SC on the tripod ) I'm enlarging 4x5 and MF to CDU II 810, 50 sheets (expired, unsealed, good and frozen for $40).

I want to shot a lot of Velvia LF, but I find 240% LF overprice over MF is nasty and unbearable for me. So Fuji pushes me to use the RB 67 and enlarging the good images to 810 CDU II.

But I'm discouraged because I feel that Fuji is to f*ck me and is to do the same than with Acros.

If Velvia 8x10 was at the same per surface price than MF (Ilford policy) you would have been selling 700 boxes perhaps, while ensuring a long term business.

Ilford is making 5% before tax, and is struggling. Hats off to them for the effort,

Yes, because the effort in investing in efficiency and flexibility for the long term. A nominal 5% profit is not that bad, see NYSE corporations.

The news I have is that Ilford is presently re-investing profit, this is a way to deliver profit to shareholders, a very common one.

I wish you wouldn't look on Fuji's policies as a "failure". They're giving up loss making (or low yielding) products to concentrate on growth sectors.

Fuji made a very good transfomation to digital, compared to Kodak. Well done

But there is no reason to kill their roots and heritage. LF 230% overprice (compared to MF) is a way to end killing LF slides like they killed Acros LF. IMHO this is painful and nasty.

Here I explain my view: http://www.largeformatphotography.in...=1#post1440786

With next I've said all, I've nothing else to add to that:

What I'd like is that Fuji was planing a long term business for LF slides, because it's a critical vendor for us, like ilford did with BW paper.

I feel they are squeezing present captive customers and preparing to execute LF velvia by firing squad, like acros. I'm worried, I'm sad, and I want to be mistaken.

[Nodda Duma]

Companies can’t operate divisions at a long-term loss, even if the executive leadership desires to pump money into the losing business for sentimental reasons. Kodak’s management made that mistake and destroyed the company. More importantly, tens of thousands of employees lost their jobs and Rochester was gutted.

Fuji is managing loss as best they can. They are being smart in trying to avoid killing off tens of thousands of jobs which, in their eyes and rightly so, are far more important than our concerns.

A poster alluded above: where there is demand there will be supply. Conversely, decisions like this do not happen in a vacuum. Without demand, there is no supply.

[B.S.Kumar]

Pere, I followed your earlier posts, no need to repeat them. Fuji is not f-ing with you or me. They're trying to avoid being f-ed themselves, like Kodak.

Roots and heritage? Fuji made glass plates into the 70's. They should continue making a few hundred boxes a year? You came late to the party for Velvia and Acros. That's no one's fault.

Regarding Fuji's price increases, look at it dispassionately. If you know you have a limited stock of product, naturally you'll want to maximize your revenue. There's no sound reason for you to let hoarders make all the profit, at least if you have your investors' interests at heart.

And if you're serious about Velvia 50 8x10, I will sell you any number you want, at a 10% discount from my current price of 40,370 JPY per box. But do note that there is often a delay in shipping from the distributor.

[Pere Casals]

Fuji today is in the digital business, the LF sheet slide business is absolutely irrelevant in their turnover.

The cuestion is if they are to kill LF velvia and to f*ck us or if they want to protect the most impressive imaging product that happened in the photography realm, by planning a long term business as ilford saved us by ensuring quality paper availability.

They even may cut velvia LF from same master rolls then roll film, and we'll use adhesive holders... we can manage that... a solution can be there, but we need a solution.

$500 the box of 20 brings velvia to the firing squad. Do Fuji realize that ? Do we realize it ?

Well, that's all...

[Pere Casals]

Pere, I followed your earlier posts, no need to repeat them. Fuji is not f-ing with you or me. They're trying to avoid being f-ed themselves, like Kodak.

Roots and heritage? Fuji made glass plates into the 70's. They should continue making a few hundred boxes a year? You came late to the party for Velvia and Acros. That's no one's fault.

Regarding Fuji's price increases, look at it dispassionately. If you know you have a limited stock of product, naturally you'll want to maximize your revenue. There's no sound reason for you to let hoarders make all the profit, at least if you have your investors' interests at heart.

And if you're serious about Velvia 50 8x10, I will sell you any number you want, at a 10% discount from my current price of 40,370 JPY per box. But do note that there is often a delay in shipping from the distributor.

You have a fair offer, probably I'll buy from you when I can gather the money, I'm preparing a frezzer.

LF slides are absolutely irrelevant in the Fuji turnover. Velvia sheet price won't make a difference in the Fuji profits, no investor will see a difference. I hope Fuji is to understand that LF velvia is something that has to be protected.

Well Pere, I think there's only one solution: you start your own photographic materials company and produce color materials in sheet film formats. If you manage to sell a decent C41 film in 4x5 and 8x10 at a cost of, say, € 5 per sheet for 8x10, I'll be sure to order some from time to time. After all, you're complaining about the companies not being fair to LF users, but since you know all this and you are also a capable person, it's not exactly fair that you're not contributing to a solution. In fact, I think it's a failure on your part that you haven't started yet. It's really 3rd rate MBA behavior not to start today, given the 7% annual growth in this market segment.

Even a 4th rate MBA, with rudimentary understanding of BCG matrix, would see your sarcasm.

But going to the core, some companies are selling LF film at same (per surface) price than MF, ilford for example, a company that saved us by sourcing quality BW paper because they had a long term business plan.

Other companies have a short term plan, this is overpricing 200% LF products, taking the money, and sending the product to the firing squad, v.g. Acros LF.

If fuji is doing that with velvia LF (we'll see...) I won't be able to source you that product. Color slide photography will be lost for ever. We are facing that.

[koraks]

Conjecture on the short vs long term plans of companies like fuji combined with a tunnel vision scope. Forgive my sarcasm, I feel it is the only sensible response to your intellectual shenanigans.

[B.S.Kumar]

Fuji has been in business since 1934. The current CEO started working at Fuji in 1963 at 24. He became CEO in 2003 at 64, and is still at the helm at 79. Your ideas about "short-term plan" don't apply here.

Instead of ranting at Fuji, perhaps you could encourage Ilford to make LF slide film and see what they think. Be happy that Fuji made some wonderful films, and buy as much as you can afford while they are still around.

[uphereinmytree]

I'm curious at what price point others may give up on sheet film?