Petzval / Dallmeyer (or other) antique lens for glowing SF HALO effects

[Moogie]

Hi Jim,

OK, thanks for the input from your side.

Yes, it is exactly this lens. On the first picture of it, you can see that also on the aperture ring a "Royal"seems to be present.
I think the flange might maybe have just been lost and replaced with the Verito as sizes are same...
Looking forward not only to make photos with it but then also to check it with the pen light for the construction.

So far then probably the B&J will maybe not do what I am hoping for as you mentioned for the petzval designs.
The one from you I am confident the most anyway, having in mind the potential I saw in the photos you made with it.
If they do not come out similar, I know it's me not the lenses cause.

Miguel

[Steven Tribe]

.........If I keep all or sell some again and keep only the best, i will see after a longer testing period.
That's the good thing with the old lenses that you can test and re-sell for more or less same price........

That has been been my philosophy for the past nine years! I have an additional interest in the construction which only "hands on" experience can give and which can add to our body of knowledge about period lenses. There is an awful lot of information which has got lost in the last century.

While I generally agree that the buy/try out/resell strategy usually works, you have to be aware that the market is quite small and subject to quite sudden changes. Numbers of people getting drawn into wet plate adventure influences the demand for Petzval lenses at any given time. At the moment, there is a drop in demand for both Petzvals and dedicated Soft lenses.

Price setting by sellers (both on Ebay and other points of sale/Auction) is mostly a function of how many people have owned it in the last few years. I can identify the following types:

- Clueless sellers. Bad descriptions/poor photos. These often make good prices if there are clues to the identity! I have bought some of these!

- Clueless sellers who think everything with brass and glass is an unmarked Dallmeyer patent portrait.
There is a UK lister at the moment (Actually 2) who relists his items at a round £1,000 at the moment.

- Enlightened private listers, who - because of family ownership or conscientious research - list relevant information and seem to have researched realistic prices. These are falling in absolute numbers, but here is a perfect example of a recent sale of a large French Petzval.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Cam...cAAOSw3ANalstf

- People like us, with a genuine interest. We want to cover our outlay - with an interest in covering some of the high costs of large format! There are occasional and semi- professional versions! There are a few long term collectors dispersing decades of purchases

- There are still a few dedicated saleroom photography based auction houses. They exist in England, Germany and Scandinavia. Some are only interested in high value items, whilst others (especialy the UK) have a wider range. All are internet linked these days. It is a useful experience tp follow these auctions - even if not buying! It provides (like sold Ebay items) an indication of what is available and current level of interest. I can see that the number of large format items "passed" (not reaching the auction house's minimum) has increased a lot the past two years and the range and quantity of LF offer is falling.

- Active dealers with very little real connection with large format. They often write "museum quality" even though there are no museums that are adding to their inventory! Frequently, the large sizes and at prices that no-one is interested in. Their BIN prices have a way of influencing others' listings. Description is often just a few sentences.

[goamules]

I think the Verito will give the poster the best value for his money. And Wollensak used the word "Royal" a lot in their first few years, because it was the name of the lenses of the company they bought out. If I recall....

I'm surprised at how cheap Veritos have become. I remember when a 11 inch would usually cost $750 or more. And an 18" was always a thousand dollar lens. They seem cheaper now.

[Moogie]

Hi Steven and Garret,

Thanks a lot for your inputs.

Yes, for eBay I also experienced it similar. It is not always easy to distinguish between them, who falls in which category, at least for me.
Sometimes I know it starlight away.

So I can hope it is an early Verito?
From the outer appearance it looks very similar.
With the further inspection of the structure it might be possible?

But at the end, the image it can produce together with me it what counts most, not what the name is :-)

[Jim Galli]

But at the end, the image it can produce together with me it what counts most, not what the name is :-)

This is the hardest lesson for all of us to learn. Silver bullet lenses don't produce silver bullet pictures any more than guns kill people. It's the person behind the object.

One more idea for you. On the AJAX petzval, you may love the look it makes, or not, but it has more tricks. If you remove the front group and mount it backwards, by itself, so the curved front faces the film it becomes a 16" soft focus achromatic meniscus. Sometimes a piece of black plastic pipe can make a barrel for it. Doesn't cost a penny more to give it a play. That one may be the softest one of all.

[Moogie]

Hey, that's a cool tip Jim.
Once it arrives I can see about that and give it a try.
Probably it will take longer than I expected as I reside currently in China and always depend on colleagues travelling back home who bring the lenses with them.
As I am afraid of letting the good stuff delivered to China I chose this slower method.
Now only the Verito/ Royal SF is finding a way into the suitcase of a colleague.
As other lenses not arrived yet.

Anyway will keep all of you posted to let you know about the results coming out from all of your excellent support :-)

[Steven Tribe]

I have never had real problems posting to China - except delays! What I find best as a seller is to request an address/phone number in chinese characters from the buyer - which I print and attach to the parcel.

Jim's advice about the usefulness of the Petzval's front achromat is very good. When reversed, and in a temporary mount, it becomes an excellent pictorial image maker - but you will need some sort of front aperture to control the aberations!

There are lots of French Petzvals (Hermagis, Derogy, Darlot, Francais etc) which have a patent barrel construction which allow you to do this without having to resort to plastic tubing and the original mounting flange can be used. Plus there is aperture system provided.

[Moogie]

Ah, OK. I might try this for some next items.
I also let some items already deliver to China, but only the staff with little value, except one lens from HongKong and my ShenHao from Rudi who shipped it from within China.
But for the already ordered SF lenses it's now too late anyway...

I am curious about this front reversing as I always like to try out new things.
Thanks a lot.

[Moogie]

The Wollensak Royal Soft Focus F/4.5 just arrived some days ago and I made some first test images wide open.
The flowers with cap on/off method in relatively dim light for 8 seconds and the portrait with the "Galli-Shutter-Method"for about ⅛ second.
At the vase on the right edge you can see the halo effect of which I am so intrigued. Let's see for the future, if I can create some more strong halos with different light/ objects.
So there is a lot of learning in front of me, but I am happy to be on the hook.
Planning somewhere in summer to try to start with bromoil.

Now how about the structure determination using the flash light?
It seems to be definitely no Verito as only the front can be screwed off.
As of now, I am struggling anyway to get the flange off again as I screwed it too tight and now the ring has some problems fit into my Linhof lens boards adapter...
Ordered two lid openers already.

Happy and satisfied.

Miguel


The last breath by Miguel Buschhauer, on Flickr


Partagasia by Miguel Buschhauer, on Flickr

[goamules]

Beautiful results, you got a good lens!