Dating an unusual Darlot Hemispherique

[thegreatcornholio]

Hi all,

I came across an unusual Darlot Hemispherique (or wide angle hemispherical) No. 6 (16" FL) with serial number 999 that has not the typical levers but a waterhouse slot. It doesn't have a BF & Co stamp on it so it was built for the European market I guess.
So I have two questions about that lens:
1/ Does anyone ever see a Hemispherique lens without levers?
2/ What year of manufacture would you suppose? (I already looked at the glass and there is just written 'haut' and 'bras' and the number 8 on both edges)

Thanks in advance, here are some pictures:

[Steven Tribe]

D'Agustini (page 143) shows one which appears not to have the 3 lever diaphragm - serial number 1192. - a wheel system, perhaps? Could there have been a wheel system on yours - the slot would have looked the same? There is a P et P booklet on Darlot - which I don't own! Darlot serial numbers about this time (1865 - 1867) are not be trusted! I have seen duplicate numbers.

[Louis Pacilla]

This if from a 1885 catalog Indermill St Joseph Mo

[thegreatcornholio]

Hm there is nothing unusual in the waterhouse slot so I don't think there was a wheel. But anyhow maybe it was a custom order - or a budget one? What is a P et P booklet, Steve?

[Louis Pacilla]

I believe the two largest WA Hems took water house stops. I've seen this on a #5 WA Hem and read in print but it's been awhile.

[Steven Tribe]

P et P (Pont et Princelle) are making a series of booklets - up to about 30 pages - covering French early companies from 1849. No. 14 covers Jamin and Darlot. Based on my experience with other booklets from them, it will give full details of size numbers made, focal lengths of each series.

This tradition about smaller lenses using one system of apertures, whilst the larger sizes revert to WHS is quite common. Voigtlander used it for some of his series.

D'Agustino talks about differences in the front/rear cells which suggests it is quite a lot different from the Globe lens which is reported to be the basis of the design!

[thegreatcornholio]

Wow I did not know about the Pont et Princelle booklets, but it seems I don't have access to that one through libraries here unfortunately.

I just know about the wide angle hemispherique with the lever stops, see here: https://www.facebook.com/hansdekort....type=3&theater

Maybe the waterhouse slot could indicate a very early lens?

[Louis Pacilla]

I believe the two largest WA Hems took water house stops. I've seen this on a #5 WA Hem and read in print but it's been awhile.

Wow I did not know about the Pont et Princelle booklets, but it seems I don't have access to that one through libraries here unfortunately.

I just know about the wide angle hemispherique with the lever stops, see here: https://www.facebook.com/hansdekort....type=3&theater

Maybe the waterhouse slot could indicate a very early lens?

Like I said the 2 longest WA Hems #5 & #6 had waterhouse slots. I owned a #5 WA Hemispherical as well as #4 at the same time & the 4 had lever stops & the #5 had waterhouse stops which had the complete set of 5 stops in the leather case stamped Darlot made in France inside.

[Steven Tribe]

Here is the link to P et P.

http://lereveedition.com/fr/dossiers-collectors-11-a-20

They are still active and no. 24 (Laverne - Lerebours et Secretan) has just come out. In theory, these are only released in 100 numbered examples - but I have a few without the number written in. They cost about €35 each. I consider them worthwhile as they reproduce a lot of original catalogue data, which would cost a fortune to acquire individually.

I post data from the booklets I have when relevant. The early booklets I have seen are less useful than the later ones which have a lot more photos of different versions and detailed images, patent data etc. I have just ordered the Lerebours booklet!

You can be pretty sure that your lens is around 1866-8, based on the nearness to the other serial numbers in the D'Agustini book. Darlot's Universal casket set came out at the same time and also had 3 digit serial numbers.

[j.e.simmons]

I’d try something old fashioned. Pick her up at home, meet her parents and take her to a nice restaurant.