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Thread: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

  1. #121
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    I presume you're mixing your own shellac recipes fresh. It's a little different with products right out of a can now, because proprietary solvents are now being used in certain shellac formulations to greatly extended shelf life. And due to both shellac expense and tightening screws of air quality regulation in key markets (CA and NY), there are also new hybrid products using other film-forming ingredients than pure shellac. And the MSDS won't tell you what's in it. You might think a major competitor would try to unravel this, but the key chemist/CEO actually controls both mfg doing this kind of thing, and deliberately keeps one side blind to what the other is doing. It's fun just walking into the R&D vaults of some of these big companies - hundreds and hundreds of jars of experimental resins with numbers on them, maybe 2% of which will actually be commercially used. But no, they're not about to tell anyone specifically what's in those little jars.

  2. #122

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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    FWIW the Gibson guitar polish with the gray Scotchbrite makes easy work of removing the black stain/goop/whateveritis. A very light touch on the Scotchbrite however as it will start stripping the varnish!
    Fresno Ag was out of white Scotchbrites.
    I steal time at 1/125th of a second, so I don't consider my photography to be Fine Art as much as it is petty larceny.
    I'm not OCD. I'm CDO which is alphabetically correct.

  3. #123
    Tracy Storer's Avatar
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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    "The finish started peeling off like rubber" Yikes.... I fear the years of butchers wax(solvents therein) may have done in the original finish, or perhaps someone else did something before you acquired the camera. Sometimes, complete strip and refinish is what's called for..... not to be entered into casually.

    EDIT: reminder, I use the Gibson polish very sparingly, on a soft cloth, never directly on the camera (or guitar), and don't let it sit. Seems the finish on your V8 is just going to need what it's going to need.....
    Tracy Storer
    Mammoth Camera Company tm
    www.mammothcamera.com

  4. #124

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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tracy Storer View Post
    "The finish started peeling off like rubber" Yikes.... I fear the years of butchers wax(solvents therein) may have done in the original finish, or perhaps someone else did something before you acquired the camera. Sometimes, complete strip and refinish is what's called for..... not to be entered into casually.

    EDIT: reminder, I use the Gibson polish very sparingly, on a soft cloth, never directly on the camera (or guitar), and don't let it sit. Seems the finish on your V8 is just going to need what it's going to need.....
    Thank you for the recommendations!
    I ran the movements out all the way and went over her with Gibson polish and a well laundered cotton cloth diaper---well laundered cotton diapers won't leave lint, which is why I always keep a few around. I sprayed the polish on the cloth, but where there was a black tacky mess I sprayed the polish on the gray Scotchbrite, went to work and then wiped dry with the diaper. I also used an old toothbrush to get into the grooves and corners. I'll wait a week and see if the tackiness returns (keeping my fingers crossed) If it doesn't I'll try matching up the base with Blue Deft, otherwise it may well need a complete refinish.
    The Butcher's Wax is getting banished to the garage.
    What I found interesting about the stain is that I don't think most of my 'dorff was stained. The color of the sanded mahogany base jives with the color of the lens boards I refinished several years ago, which really blended in nicely when they were lacquered or Tung oiled. The inside of the bed, however is heavily stained or possibly painted. It is pretty much out of sight but it is very much an opaque reddish brown color. Is that how Deardorff finished their cameras in the 50's-60's?
    I don't know.
    I steal time at 1/125th of a second, so I don't consider my photography to be Fine Art as much as it is petty larceny.
    I'm not OCD. I'm CDO which is alphabetically correct.

  5. #125
    Randy Moe's Avatar
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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    Speaking of stain. How do we touch up stain? I feel the need in chips, scratches when the original finish is fine.

  6. #126

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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Moe View Post
    Speaking of stain. How do we touch up stain? I feel the need in chips, scratches when the original finish is fine.
    I think you first have to figure out exactly what the original finish is.
    That's really one of the beauties of a Tung oil finish though.
    On my camera it looks like sometime during the course of it's adventures a bit of black paint was rubbed into some minor blemishes for camouflage.
    I steal time at 1/125th of a second, so I don't consider my photography to be Fine Art as much as it is petty larceny.
    I'm not OCD. I'm CDO which is alphabetically correct.

  7. #127
    Randy Moe's Avatar
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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kasaian View Post
    I think you first have to figure out exactly what the original finish is.
    That's really one of the beauties of a Tung oil finish though.
    On my camera it looks like sometime during the course of it's adventures a bit of black paint was rubbed into some minor blemishes for camouflage.
    I'm guilty of using a touchup marker on my S11. It had lot's of little scratches and chips. I run the marker lightly over the scratch and as quick as I can, I wipe it off, which puts the stain in the scratch and not all over the unscratched area. Works for me and this camera will never be outside.

    As far as I can tell, it's never been waxed. I will use Renaissance wax when I around to it.

  8. #128

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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    I'm going to suggest something that's just a bit unconventional, a little dangerous. Get a tube of Rembrandt (only!) transparent oxide brown oil paint, https://www.dickblick.com/items/00417-8914/

    Take a little dab of it and rub it into the wound, as much as necessary to get to the right color density, and let it dry. Don't do this if you intend to spot repair the varnish over it--the spot repair won't stick.

    If you like oil finishes on wood, or oil finished lens boards, this is a great color base for that, too. It's an unusual color in that it starts out a warm yellow when thin, then goes through all of the various reddish wood colors as it gets darker. I haven't found a camera color yet that it won't match pretty closely. Not for walnut, though. When you look at a varnish on mahogany and see that it is basically red-brown but flashes yellow, that's what this color does. I have also used it on darkened cherry furniture for scratch repairs. It's a great one-stop color. The difference between it and other colors and stains is that it's more sophisticated--it can be different colors depending on how darkly you lay it on. That's usually anathema for an artist's paint, which is expected to start out a dilute version of the same color and just get darker, and that's why it's so useful, because usually woods start yellow when light, getting redder when darker, which is exactly what this color does. For comparison, you'd usually expect red paint to start pink when thin, right?

    This is the color I use for lens boards, under varnish or shellac.

    If you want to varnish over it, oil varnish would be the thing to use. It will mix with that and dry fine. It will actively prevent Deft from drying and make a gunky mess. It will shed modern plastic varnishes, which probably won't bond to it at all. It's somewhat compatible with shellac overcoats if you alternate thin color layers with thin shellac layers and build slowly. If transparency is required with oil varnish, mix it with the varnish, or build thin alternate layers as with shellac. Allow a couple of days of drying after the color coat, unless you are spraying varnish, which can be done right away. Otherwise, brushing will disturb the color. Generally, you'll find that adding varnish lightens the color, so you will somewhat naturally end up layering on up to the color you need.

    Safe touch-up markers include Tombow dual-brush markers, which are archival water colors.
    https://www.dickblick.com/products/t...pens-and-sets/

    The thing I like about them is that their colors are terminal: they go to their designated color and no farther, so you won't end up with a dark stain if you start with the lighter versions and work up to the color you need. Also, if you make a minor mistake, they mostly wash off. I use a lot of #946 and 947. They wash away off varnish with water, so they really don't work on varnish, and the are darker on bare wood than on varnish. I repeat, start with the light color and work up, since the lighter colors will seal a bit and keep the darker ones at bay. But these aren't really as universal of a solution as the paint.
    Thanks, but I'd rather just watch:
    Large format: http://flickr.com/michaeldarnton
    Mostly 35mm: http://flickr.com/mdarnton
    You want digital, color, etc?: http://www.flickr.com/photos/stradofear

  9. #129
    Randy Moe's Avatar
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    Re: What finish did Deardorff use in the 50s-60s?

    Thanks, Michael, good specific advice with links!

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