Conundrum - Ebony SV45U2 or Linhof MT 2000

[newtolf]

Hi! I'm so glad to have found this site! I'm new to LF (as my name suggests), and have mainly been working in MF with my Hasselblad up until now. I have been thinking about going to LF for a long time, and have decided to take the plunge. I do mainly landscapes, and as you can see from my subect line, I am facing a dilemma. I understand that the Ebony has a lot more movements, but my question is, what would those extra movements allow me to do that I wouldn't be able to do otherwise on the Linhof? (I have already decided against buying a used, cheaper LF camera to "try it out" and then upgrading later - the reasons are lengthy so I will spare you guys.) I am (perhaps stupidly) attached to the Linhof, but a few people have advised me to go with the Ebony b/c it has "lots more movements. I'm just not sure whether I would actually need these extra movements.

Thanks in advance!!

[Juergen Sattler]

I guess you didn't like the answers on the APUG forum?

[windpointphoto]

It is hard having to make these decisions. I know I just couldn't decide between a Burke and James 4x5 and a Calumet. In my med format days I would lay awake nights; do I get the Yashica Mat or the Seagull. Good grief! It's just a light tight box that holds a lens on one end and film on the other. Rent a camera from Calumet and go make some pictures. You're only going to know by doing. Spend all the extra money you seem to have on film and paper or traveling.

[newtolf]

Juergen,

If you read my question here, you'll see that I'm asking whether the "extra movements" available on the Ebony would be missed if I bought the Linhof. It has nothing to do with not liking the answers on APUG! Please don't think that. I just happened to be on this forum when this question came to me.

[jerry brodkey]

I have the 5X7 model of the ebony you are considering. These 2 ebony cameras each have

asymmetrical tilts and swings which the Linhof doesn't have. I came to love this facility

on the Sinar and it truly makes setting up the focus much easier. In my mind that would be the most

important deciding factor. The Linhof is certainly more robust and hand holdable which could be factors in your case.

If it is not, I would personably opt for the Ebony........

[Steve Hamley]

Usually more movements are needed when you're close to your subject. For example macro, tabletop, or "semi-macro". There are of course, given situations at disatnce where more movements are more better, but in landscapes at least they really don't occur all that often.

The Linhof is a fine camera; if that's what you want get it and don't look back. Many fine photographers use one because they're solid, dependable, and support is available. If you like that "machined by German elves" feel, the Linhof is your camera.

I personally use an Ebony and happy with it, but some folks are wooden camera people and some are not.

Here's a shot taken with the Ebony SV45U and a 135mm lens. The camera movements were maxed in the rear and I had quite a bit of front movement too. The lens was about 18" from the front of the flowers and a lot of movement was needed (mostly tilts but some swings) to get the flowers sharp. I doubt the Linhof could have done it.

http://www.pbase.com/sahamley/image/40398350

Steve

[Brian Ellis]

I don't know that the Ebony has "lots more movements." The Linhof doesn't have front fall or base tilt and of course doesn't have an asymetrical back. Apart from the asymetrical feature, the movements on the Ebony back are done in more conventional field camera fashion than the Linhof but I don't think it has any back movements that the Linhof doesn't have though they operate differently and may be more extensive (i.e. move farther) than the Linhof.

I owned a Linhof Technika V, then for not very good reasons I replaced it with an Ebony 45 Ti (mahogony wood), after being used to the metal Linhof I found it too loose, imprecise and "unsmooth" so thinking that one with ebony wood would be better in those respects I replaced it with a new 45 Te. It wasn't any better than the Ti in those respects so after a couple months I replaced it with a Linhof Master Technika which I still own. I didn't get the SV45U because I seldom use back movements so for me the asymetrical back wasn't worth the extra $1000. By wood camera standards the Ebony certainly isn't "loose" or "imprecise" or "unsmooth," it's just not the same as a metal camera in those respects. But if I had never owned a Linhof I probably would have been thrilled with the Ebony.

As to whether you'd need the extra movements of the Ebony, who knows. Front fall isn't a big deal to me, on the rare occasions when I would use it if I had it I just point the camera down and brint the front and vack to vertical. Base tilt is there only to allow the use of certain wide angle lenses, I don't know of any other reason to use base tilt when you have axis tilt available. The back movements of the Ebony are easier to use than the Linhof and are more conventional but I don't know that the Ebony can do things with the back that the Linhof can't in terms of movements, they're just operated differently.

If it were me I think I'd try to evaluate the importance of the asymetrical movements of the Ebony, with which I have no experience, and the otherwise more conventional back of the Ebony, vs the firmness, precision, and smoothness of the Linhof. Not an easy thing to do without any large format experience but one thing is for sure, either way you're starting at the top when it comes to field cameras.

[David A. Goldfarb]

I use front fall quite often on my Linhof Tech V (I guess I like elevated vantage points). If I need a little, I just drop the bed and tilt the front standard back to vertical. If I need a lot, I just remove the accessory shoe and mount the camera upside down with the tripod socket on the top. If you have a strong tripod head, you can also rotate the camera 90-degrees on the tripod, rotate the back to the desired orientation, and use the front shift movement for front fall.

[newtolf]

Steve, you have quite the portfolio. Were all these made with your Ebony? Very nice!

Thanks guys, for your help. I'm definitely going to give it some more thought. At this point, it really only comes down to whether I will need the asymetrical back. What I've read about it mirrors what Jerold said - that it makes focusing so much easier. So Brian, you're absolutely right - I do need to evaluate the importance of the asymetrical movements. I just wish I can actually try out the cameras before I buy them!

[Danny Burk]

My primary camera is an SV45U2, and I've used a Linhof belonging to one of my workshop participants. While it takes time to become comfortable using any camera, and I'm first to admit that I used the Linhof for only a short time, for my money I'd choose the Ebony in a heartbeat. Why? Ease of use, for one thing, and it does everything I want. I'm completely pleased with everything about my Ebony.

But another big reason is for the asymmetric tilt. Those who haven't tried the latter are at a disadvantage, since it really *is* a great benefit and it's one of those things that may be hard to imagine until you actually see it for yourself. I'm a believer in streamlining view camera operation, and asymmetric tilt (and swing) lets me do that in the same way that using Quickload film and a bino reflex viewer do.

You can't use asymmetric tilt on every shot. If you need perfect perpendiculars, for example, you'll want to use front tilt. But for 75-80% of what I do (which is nearly all landscape), I'm able to use asymmetric tilt/swing very effectively.

Another plus of the Ebony is that you can use much longer lenses than the Linhof allows. I'm a long lens fanatic and use a Nikkor 720mm (telephoto design) frequently; I wouldn't be able to use anything close to that on a Linhof.

Regards,
Danny www.dannyburk.com