Page 1 of 11 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 101

Thread: 7x17 lenses?

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    White Lake, Ontario.
    Posts
    339

    7x17 lenses?

    A lens expert I am definitely not. So what are "standard" lenses for the 7x17 format anyway? I am considering going to that format and some of my lenses may fit well while others would surely vignette.

    I have a 355 G-Clarron, 360 Commercial Ektar, 480 Apo Ronar, and 165 Super Angulon.

    Ideally, what would work on a 7x17 among these and what else would I want to fit on the camera to provide good movement etc...

    Thanks

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Harbor City, California
    Posts
    1,748

    7x17 lenses?

    Unless I've messed up on the math - always a distinct possibility - the diagonal of 7" X 17" is 18.38" or 466mm. That's a really big diagonal. Your present lenses have image circles that are rated at less so are inadequate for 7" X 17" if you accept the makeers' figures.

    What does work? Fujinon used to make a huge 300mm super wide. That would do it with lots of room to spare, but I think it would be hard to track one down. Schneider and Rodenstock both make a few lenses in this image circle range, up to 500mm. It's my impression that people working in this format often use very old lenses originally intended for use on huge studio cameras. Most of the familiar "classic" lenses were made in large enough sizes, though big ones can be hard to find.

  3. #3

    7x17 lenses?

    Regardless of maker's figures, the 355/9 G-Claron and the 480 Apo-Ronar will both easily cover the format. I understand that the 14" Commercial Ektar will just cover, but the corners are soft.

  4. #4

    7x17 lenses?

    [pre]
    This is a list of "modern" lenses for 7x17.

    Focal Length, Aperture, & Maker E/G Shutter Rise - Fall - Shift
    inches (cm)
    84 mm f/22 Wisner Hypergon 2/2 n.a. 0.1, 0.2; (0.3, 0.5)
    200 mm f/6.8 Rodenstock Grandagon 8/4 3 0.7, 1.6; (1.8, 4.1)
    200 mm f/6.8 Rodenstock Grandagon N 8/4 3 0.7, 1.6; (1.8, 4.1)
    210 mm f/8 Schneider Super Angulon 6/4 1, 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    250 mm f/6.3 Kodak Wide Field Ektar 4/4 n.a. 0.0, 0.1; (0.0, 0.3)
    270 mm f/6.8 Kyvyx APO-Kyvytar n.a. 3 2.7, 4.6; (6.9, 11.7)
    273 mm f/6.8 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 1.2, 2.4; (3.0, 6.1)
    300 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar 6/2 n.a. 0.9, 1.9; (2.3, 4.8)
    300 mm f/5.6 Rodenstock APO Sironar 7/5 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    300 mm f/5.6 Rodenstock APO Sironar W 7/5 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    300 mm f/5.6 Sinar Sinaron WS n.a. 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    305 mm f/6.8 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 2.5, 4.4; (6.4, 11.2)
    305 mm f/9 Computar F9 6/4 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    355 mm f/7.7 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 4.5, 6.9; (11.4, 17.5)
    355 mm f/9 Schneider Graphic Claron 6/2 n.a. 0.4, 1.0; (1.0, 2.5)
    360 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar 6/2 n.a. 3.0, 5.1; (7.6, 13.0)
    360 mm f/9 Kyvyx APO-Kyvytar n.a. 3 1.4, 2.6; (3.6, 6.6)
    360 mm f/6.8 Calumet Caltar SII n.a. n.a. 1.0, 1.9; (2.5, 4.8)
    360 mm f/10 Fujinon AS 6/4 1 1.0, 1.9; (2.5, 4.8)
    360 mm f/5.6 Schneider Symmar 6/4 n.a. 1.0, 1.9; (2.5, 4.8)
    360 mm f/5.6 Nikkor W 6/4 3 0.8, 1.6; (2.0, 4.1)
    360 mm f/6.8 Schneider APO Symmar 6/4 3 0.8, 1.6; (2.0, 4.1)
    360 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar S 6/4 3 0.8, 1.6; (2.0, 4.1)
    360 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar S MC 6/4 3 0.8, 1.6; (2.0, 4.1)
    360 mm f/6.5 Fujinon CM-W 6/6 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    360 mm f/6.3 Fujinon NWS 6/6 n.a. 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    360 mm f/6.3 Fujinon W 6/4 3 0.6, 1.2; (1.5, 3.0)
    360 mm f/6.8 Rodenstock APO Sironar S 6/4 3 0.2, 0.5; (0.5, 1.3)
    375 mm f/6.3 Calumet Caltar n.a. n.a. 0.2, 0.5; (0.5, 1.3)
    420 mm f/7.7 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 6.9, 9.9; (17.5, 25.1)
    420 mm f/5.6 Fujinon FS 3/3 3 1.0, 2.0; (2.5, 5.1)
    420 mm f/5.6 Fujinon SFS 3/3 3 1.0, 2.0; (2.5, 5.1)
    420 mm f/4.5 Schneider Xenar 4/3 n.a. 1.0, 2.0; (2.5, 5.1)
    450 mm f/8 Fujinon CM-W 6/6 3 1.3, 2.5; (3.3, 6.4)
    450 mm f/8.5 Fujinon C 4/4 1 0.6, 1.4; (1.5, 3.6)
    450 mm f/8.5 Fujinon CS 4/4 1 0.6, 1.4; (1.5, 3.6)
    480 mm f/7.7 Goerz Dagor 6/2 n.a. 9.2, 12.5; (23.4, 31.8)
    480 mm f/9 Kyvyx APO-Kyvytar n.a. 3 4.9, 7.5; (12.4, 19.1)
    480 mm f/4.5 Schneider Xenar 4/3 n.a. 2.5, 4.3; (6.4, 10.9)
    480 mm f/8 Goerz Gotar 4/4 n.a. 1.1, 2.2; (2.8, 5.6)
    480 mm f/8.4 Rodenstock APO Sironar N 6/4 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    480 mm f/8.4 Rodenstock Sironar N 6/4 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    480 mm f/8 Schneider APO Symmar 6/4 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    480 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar S 6/4 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    480 mm f/6.8 Schneider Symmar S MC 6/4 3 0.9, 1.8; (2.3, 4.6)
    480 mm f/9 Sinar Sinaron S n.a. 3 0.4, 1.0; (1.0, 2.5)
    508 mm f/6.3 Ilex Acutar 4/3 n.a. 2.2, 3.9; (5.6, 9.9)
    508 mm f/4.5 Zeiss Tessar 4/3 n.a. 2.0, 3.5; (5.1, 8.9)
    600 mm f/11.5 Fujinon C 4/4 3 3.5, 5.6; (8.9, 14.2)
    600 mm f/11.5 Fujinon CS 4/4 3 3.5, 5.6; (8.9, 14.2)
    600 mm f/11.5 Docter Apo-Germinar 6/6 3 0.8, 1.7; (2.0, 4.3)
    600 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-Germinar 6/6 n.a. 0.8, 1.7; (2.0, 4.3)
    600 mm f/9 Rodenstock Apo Ronar 4/4 3 0.8, 1.7; (2.0, 4.3)
    600 mm f/9 Sinar APO Sinaron DBM n.a. n.a. 0.8, 1.7; (2.0, 4.3)
    600 mm f/9 Voigtlander Apo-Skopar 5/3 n.a. 0.8, 1.7; (2.0, 4.3)
    600 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-T 4/3 n.a. 0.3, 0.7; (0.8, 1.8)
    610 mm f/6.3 Zeiss Tessar 4/3 n.a. 4.2, 6.6; (10.7, 16.8)
    610 mm f/10 Goerz Gotar 4/4 n.a. 3.9, 6.3; (9.9, 16.0)
    610 mm f/11 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 1.2, 2.4; (3.0, 6.1)
    610 mm f/11 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 1.2, 2.4; (3.0, 6.1)
    610 mm f/9 Nikon Apo-Nikkor 4/4 n.a. 1.2, 2.4; (3.0, 6.1)
    610 mm f/9 Schneider Repro-Claron 4/4 n.a. 1.2, 2.4; (3.0, 6.1)
    610 mm f/9 Rank Apotal 4/3 n.a. 1.0, 2.0; (2.5, 5.1)
    650 mm f/9 Voigtlander Apo-Skopar n.a. n.a. 1.7, 3.1; (4.3, 7.9)
    750 mm f/14.5 Docter Apo-Germinar 6/6 3 3.4, 5.5; (8.6, 14.0)
    750 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-Germinar 6/6 n.a. 3.4, 5.5; (8.6, 14.0)
    750 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-T 4/3 n.a. 2.8, 4.7; (7.1, 11.9)
    760 mm f/11 Nikon Apo-Nikkor 4/4 n.a. 3.9, 6.2; (9.9, 15.7)
    762 mm f/12.5 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 3.9, 6.2; (9.9, 15.7)
    762 mm f/12.5 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 2.6, 4.5; (6.6, 11.4)
    762 mm f/9 Rank Apotal 4/3 n.a. 2.6, 4.5; (6.6, 11.4)
    762 mm f/10 Wray Apo-Process Lustrar 4/4 n.a. 0.8, 1.6; (2.0, 4.1)
    800 mm f/9 Rodenstock APO Ronar S 6/4 3 3.2, 5.3; (8.1, 13.5)
    800 mm f/11 Schneider APO Tele Xenar HM 5/5 3 1.0, 1.9; (2.5, 4.8)
    890 mm f/12.5 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 6.1, 8.9; (15.5, 22.6)
    890 mm f/12.5 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 3.9, 6.2; (9.9, 15.7)
    900 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-Germinar 6/6 n.a. 5.9, 8.7; (15.0, 22.1)
    900 mm f/9 Jenoptik Apo-T 4/3 n.a. 5.2, 7.8; (13.2, 19.8)
    914 mm f/10 Wray Apo-Process Lustrar 4/4 n.a. 2.8, 4.8; (7.1, 12.2)
    965 mm f/4.5 Fujinon Fujinon 6/3 n.a. 6.6, 9.5; (16.8, 24.1)
    1000 mm f/19.5 Docter Apo-Germinar 6/6 3 7.6, 10.6; (19.3, 26.9)
    1067 mm f/14 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 9.1, 12.4; (23.1, 31.5)
    1067 mm f/14 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 6.5, 9.4; (16.5, 23.9)
    1067 mm f/10 Wray Apo-Process Lustrar 4/4 n.a. 4.8, 7.4; (12.2, 18.8)
    1200 mm f/15 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 11.4, 14.9; (29.0, 37.8)
    1200 mm f/11 Jenoptik Apo-Germinar 6/6 n.a. 10.9, 14.3; (27.7, 36.3)
    1200 mm f/15 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 7.5, 10.6; (19.1, 26.9)
    1200 mm f/10 Wray Apo-Process Lustrar 4/4 n.a. 6.9, 9.8; (17.5, 24.9)
    1600 mm f/10 Wray Apo-Process Lustrar 4/4 n.a. 11.8, 15.3; (30.0, 38.9)
    1780 mm f/16 Goerz APO Artar 4/4 n.a. 21.2, 25.2; (53.8, 64.0)
    1780 mm f/16 Goerz Red Dot Artar 4/4 n.a. 13.5, 17.1; (34.3, 43.4)
    [/pre]

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    5,171

    7x17 lenses?

    “Regardless of maker's figures, the 355/9 G-Claron and the 480 Apo-Ronar will both easily cover the format. I understand that the 14" Commercial Ektar will just cover, but the corners are soft.”

    For example, one of the most popular lenses for 7X17” is the 305mm G-Claron, which actually covers nicely this format with several inches of movement. But, if you were to rely on the coverage data supplied by Schneider for this lens you would be certain that it would not cover the format.

    Wide angle lenses tend to be very popular with 7X17” users. There are, in addition to individual aesthetics, several practical reasons for this, including the fact that many of the older F&S and Korona cameras of this format have limited bellows draw. If one is looking for really wide angle coverage some of the possibilities in modern lenses, up to 305mm, for 7X17 are:

    210mm SSXL
    210mm Super Angulon
    210mm Grandagon
    240mm Computar
    270mm Computar
    305mm G-Claron
    305mm Computar

    Note that some 240mm and 270mm Kowa Graphics have the same design and similar coverage to the 240mm and 270mm Computars. But not all do, so buy with caution if your intended coverage is 7X17.

    Among older lenses, lenses to consider include the 210 Series V Protar, wide angle Dagors down to 270mm, and regular Dagors down to 300mm. Many other older classic lenses will also cover. Maybe Jim Gali will comment further since he likes to use these lenses on panorama formats.

    Once you get beyond about 350-60mm virtually of the current and last generation plasmats will cover. This includes Symmar and Symmar-S , Fujinon-W, Nikkor-W, and similar lenses by Rodenstock.

    Above 480mm virtually all lenses will cover 7X17” , including most Apo lenses.
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    471

    7x17 lenses?

    Couple lenses to add to the list:

    - 250mm Kodak Wide Field Ektar f/6.3

    - 183mm Bausch and Lomb Protar Series V f/18

    I've used both and they give wide to very wide fields of view on 7x17. The 250WFEktar is sufficiently sharp all the way to the edges to make pleasing contact prints.

    The Protar begins to see a little "softness". But then, mine are mounted in Supermatic #0 shutters and the front elements are somewhat recessed in the mountings. Perhaps a barrel mounted Protar with a more shallow front element set would provide clearer images to the edge?

    Last thing about your question on "normal" lenses for 7x17 - The Schneider 355 GClaron feels pleasingly "normal" to me. The 305 GClaron is very slightly wide. The 250WFEktar feels very wide on the format. The 183Protar Series Vs feel rediculously wide.

    I hope this helps.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    5,171

    7x17 lenses?

    "Couple lenses to add to the list:

    - 250mm Kodak Wide Field Ektar f/6.3

    - 183mm Bausch and Lomb Protar Series V f/18"

    My 184mm B&L Protar Series V vignettes just a bit at infinity focus. So too does the 210mm Computar. Both lenses, however, cover without vignetting at closer focus as might be typical when working indoors.

    We could also add to the list the 210mm Angulon, though the specimen I once owned ws unacceptably soft on the corners.

    BTW, with all of the very wide angle lenses mentioned above you *must" stop down to at least f/45 to get decent performance on the corners.
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  8. #8

    7x17 lenses?

    Chris,

    How much (if any) movement can you get on 7x17 with the 250/6.3 WF Ektar? Towards the end of its image circle does the lens vignette or fuzz out?

    thanks

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    471

    7x17 lenses?

    My 250WFEktar begins to "pull" at the edges if I use any rise/fall movements. So it's pretty much a "straight on" kind of optic, unless you can live with the slight "pull". It doesn't really "fuzz". Once you saw the effect, you'd know what I was talking about.

    The 250WFEktar does not vignette like a Fuji 250 f/6.7 or some of the more recent optics that mechanically limit the field of view.

    I'm looking for a 240 Germinar W f/9 (like the ones Kerry had forsale recently). These apparently vignette the extreme corners and may still give a usable image with a slight cropping. At least it looks like this from the image Jim Galli posted a month or so back. I like the idea of a modern, fairly light, multi-coated 250-ish focal length for 7x17.

    Sandy, what vintage was the 210 Angulon you tried? Was early uncoated or later coated?

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    White Lake, Ontario.
    Posts
    339

    7x17 lenses?

    Well, question answered in spades! Thanks for the great info (extra thanks to you, Mike, for the detailed list).

    Bad news is, I only see one lens I now own that's usable on the camera - the G-Claron. The others would not work out unless I crop the neg or go for the round corners look. That includes my 480 Apo-Ronar (not sironar) which has an image circle of only 396mm as showing on Michael Davis's chart elsewhere on this forum.

    Thanks again, folks. Info much appreciated.

Similar Threads

  1. Why 7x17?
    By Marco Annaratone in forum Cameras & Camera Accessories
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 18-Jan-2006, 11:37
  2. 7x17, shorter versus longer lenses, perspective
    By Robert McClure in forum Cameras & Camera Accessories
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 21-Nov-2005, 11:54
  3. Lenses Longer than 600mm/24" on 7x17
    By Kerry L. Thalmann in forum Cameras & Camera Accessories
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 9-Nov-2005, 16:43
  4. 7x17 coverage
    By ronald lamarsh in forum Lenses & Lens Accessories
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 18-Sep-2003, 20:22
  5. suggestions for 7x17 lenses
    By Erik Gould in forum Cameras & Camera Accessories
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 13-Mar-2001, 17:10

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •