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Thread: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

  1. #1

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    Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    For sometime now, I have been experiencing some issues with my black and white prints from my Epson R3880. The issues are that they appear to exhibit a warmish tone.

    I am quite savvy when it comes to printer settings and programs so I know its nothing I have done in software. I mainly use the ABW but I am getting the same results if I let Photoshop Manage the Colors and print through an Epson ICC profile or one that I have personally created with the X-Rite Color Miunki.

    Just recently, I got a friend to print the same image on his R3800 which he uses ImagePrint by Colorbyte and I was amazed just how neutral everything looked compared to mine. This got me wondering if there could be something wrong with my printer so I downloaded the Demo version of ImagePrint 10 and even under the heavy watermark they plaster over the image, the tones look much more neutral than than my original version.

    Surely, this means that my printer is working does it not ? or does ImagePrint not even touch the Epson driver ?

    I am using a Mac and under system preferences this is what the driver version is reporting.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2017-02-16 at 15.26.21.jpg 
Views:	32 
Size:	41.3 KB 
ID:	161288

    Here is a scan of a test file through the ABW driver using the Dark Tone
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ABW-Dark-Setting.jpg 
Views:	48 
Size:	64.4 KB 
ID:	161291

    Here is the same image printed from ImagePrint by Colorbyte
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ImagePrint.jpg 
Views:	43 
Size:	69.8 KB 
ID:	161292


    At the moment, I am at a complete loss as to why this is happening, and I am at the stage whether to either invest in ImagePrint or whether the new P800 would eliminate this issue.

    Any thoughts

    Ian

  2. #2

    Join Date
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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    The K inks in Epson printers are carbon black and very warm in tone. I suspect that with in ABW mode you are using primarily the warm tone carbon inks with your printing. The Colorbyte software is almost certainly mixing in some of the other colors to produce a neutral tone print. You could do the same thing at less cost with QuadToneRIP, though you would also need the Print Tool to make sure that you are printing with No Color Management.

    I seriously doubt that the P800 would eliminate the issue of warm tones.

    Sandy







    Quote Originally Posted by IanBarber View Post
    For sometime now, I have been experiencing some issues with my black and white prints from my Epson R3880. The issues are that they appear to exhibit a warmish tone.

    I am quite savvy when it comes to printer settings and programs so I know its nothing I have done in software. I mainly use the ABW but I am getting the same results if I let Photoshop Manage the Colors and print through an Epson ICC profile or one that I have personally created with the X-Rite Color Miunki.

    Just recently, I got a friend to print the same image on his R3800 which he uses ImagePrint by Colorbyte and I was amazed just how neutral everything looked compared to mine. This got me wondering if there could be something wrong with my printer so I downloaded the Demo version of ImagePrint 10 and even under the heavy watermark they plaster over the image, the tones look much more neutral than than my original version.

    Surely, this means that my printer is working does it not ? or does ImagePrint not even touch the Epson driver ?

    I am using a Mac and under system preferences this is what the driver version is reporting.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2017-02-16 at 15.26.21.jpg 
Views:	32 
Size:	41.3 KB 
ID:	161288

    Here is a scan of a test file through the ABW driver using the Dark Tone
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ABW-Dark-Setting.jpg 
Views:	48 
Size:	64.4 KB 
ID:	161291

    Here is the same image printed from ImagePrint by Colorbyte
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ImagePrint.jpg 
Views:	43 
Size:	69.8 KB 
ID:	161292


    At the moment, I am at a complete loss as to why this is happening, and I am at the stage whether to either invest in ImagePrint or whether the new P800 would eliminate this issue.

    Any thoughts

    Ian
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  3. #3

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    The K inks in Epson printers are carbon black and very warm in tone
    I thought the oem inks were pigment, is this not the case

  4. #4

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    Quote Originally Posted by IanBarber View Post
    I thought the oem inks were pigment, is this not the case
    Of course. Carbon black is the most permanent pigment. The use of the other pigments gives a print that is more likely to fade over time than using only carbon black.

    Sandy
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  5. #5

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    Quote Originally Posted by sanking View Post
    Of course. Carbon black is the most permanent pigment. The use of the other pigments gives a print that is more likely to fade over time than using only carbon black.

    Sandy
    Ah, so from you are saying, its quite possible that Colorbyte are doing some mixing of other colors which the ABW is not.

    I have looked at the Print Tool but my understanding is that you need to use the QTR curves unless I am mistaken. The supplied curves are quite sparse and I only own the ColorMinki device which is not capable of making such curves I believe

  6. #6

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    Quote Originally Posted by IanBarber View Post
    Ah, so from you are saying, its quite possible that Colorbyte are doing some mixing of other colors which the ABW is not.

    I have looked at the Print Tool but my understanding is that you need to use the QTR curves unless I am mistaken. The supplied curves are quite sparse and I only own the ColorMinki device which is not capable of making such curves I believe
    I am certain that Colorbyte is mixing in other colors. No way to get a neutral tone without the other colors as carbon black is warm black in tone.

    You could use the Print Tool to print with either the Epson driver or with QuadToneRIP. However, to print with QTR you do need a QTR profile. I have used both an iOne and Spyder Print to produce profiles for QTR, but know nothing about the ColorMunki.

    Sandy
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  7. #7

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    Quote Originally Posted by sanking View Post
    You could use the Print Tool to print with either the Epson driver or with QuadToneRIP.Sandy
    Sandy, if I was to use the Print Tool with the ABW driver, am I not going down the same route as if I was to simply use the ABW on its own or is the Print Tool doing something else ?

  8. #8

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    Quote Originally Posted by IanBarber View Post
    Sandy, if I was to use the Print Tool with the ABW driver, am I not going down the same route as if I was to simply use the ABW on its own or is the Print Tool doing something else ?
    The Print Tool has some very nifty features and I prefer to use it even when printing with the Epson driver. The canvas page in particular is useful as it allows you to print several images on the same panel, and size and move them around as you like. However, its main feature for my work is that it allows me to print with No Color Management, essential for printing with QTR.

    In terms of the issue you address, however, you can use ABW through either PS or the Print Tool and the end result is the same. If what you are after is neutral tone B&W prints you will have to get that with a RIP, or by adjusting image tone in PS or in whatever image software you are using.

    Sandy
    http://www.sandykingphotography.com/
    For discussion and information about carbon transfer please visit the carbon group at Yahoo.
    https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...nTransfer/info

  9. #9

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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    I have just rub that test image through QTR Print Tool using the enhanced Matte curve which is what paper I am using to test.

    I need to measure the 51 steps tomorrow with the color munki to see if there are any differences compared to the ABW print but straight out of the printer what I do see is that the print from Print Tool certainly gives better shadow detail, deep shadows are much more open compared to the ABW print.

    This brings me to another crossroads, the paper I use is Epson Cold Press Natural and Epson Hot Press Bright for matte and Canson for Baryta neither have curves shipped with the QTR install so I still need a way to make my own curves easily somehow.

  10. #10
    mitch
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    Re: Epson P800 or Colorbyte Image Print

    My 2 cents
    I have and use image print rip 10 which my friend Dan Burkholder talked me into buying Kicking and screaming about the price, best investment I ever made
    I was using a 3880 now use it with a P800 it rocks

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