Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Hemel Hempstead, UK
    Posts
    465

    What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    I've posted previously regarding the difference in focal plane between my ground glass and the film holder - the glass is 0.45mm behind the film - the net effect of which is to move the focus further from the camera than expected. Here's a lovely and extremely annoying example... the wall and door are pin-sharp, but the headlight of the moped is where I focussed. Meh.



    Neil

  2. #2
    Unwitting Thread Killer Ari's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    4,987

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    I hate when that happens.
    If you're not a technical kinda guy, best to send it to someone who can adjust the GG precisely to line up with the film plane.
    What camera are you using?

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    533

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    What f stop ?

    Quote Originally Posted by barnacle View Post
    I've posted previously regarding the difference in focal plane between my ground glass and the film holder - the glass is 0.45mm behind the film - the net effect of which is to move the focus further from the camera than expected. Here's a lovely and extremely annoying example... the wall and door are pin-sharp, but the headlight of the moped is where I focussed. Meh.



    Neil

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Hemel Hempstead, UK
    Posts
    465

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    I'm a techy sort of guy and the only solution is a replacement ground glass carrier, sadly. It's designed (they're not exactly difficult) and just looking at getting it made now, Ari. It's an MPP press camera, 1940s vintage, and it's not right for modern film holders. It *could* be machined off, but it's tricky to get right and I'd rather not risk butchering the original.

    John, that would have been f16 or f22.

    Neil

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Concord, MA
    Posts
    16

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    I ran into this problem with my Cambo. I used a toothpick rigidly attached to some straight, unbending rod (I must confess I cannot remember what it was), and adjusted the 'depth' of the toothpick so it *just* kissed a sheet of film in a holder. (I tried this with multiple holders, and the film plane was surprisingly consistent between holders, and across the plane of the film). I then did this with the GG, and the GG was below the plane of the film. I shimmed the GG (using thin cuttings of film, of course) until the toothpick *just* kissed the GG.

    Now, what I focus on is actually in focus on the film.

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    319

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    Quote Originally Posted by sdynes View Post
    I ran into this problem with my Cambo. I used a toothpick rigidly attached to some straight, unbending rod (I must confess I cannot remember what it was), and adjusted the 'depth' of the toothpick so it *just* kissed a sheet of film in a holder. (I tried this with multiple holders, and the film plane was surprisingly consistent between holders, and across the plane of the film). I then did this with the GG, and the GG was below the plane of the film. I shimmed the GG (using thin cuttings of film, of course) until the toothpick *just* kissed the GG.

    Now, what I focus on is actually in focus on the film.
    THIS!! I think LF'ers are original McGuyvers.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Sep 1998
    Location
    Oregon and Austria
    Posts
    1,917

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    Wait...

    If the actual focus on the film is farther away than the focus on the ground glass, then the film is closer to the lens than the gg; meaning that the ground glass needs to be moved closer to the lens, not shimmed farther away from it. This would involve machining the ground-glass seat; not so easy as shimming.

    @OP: One alternative, if you could get it to be light-tight, would be to shim filmholders back by the appropriate amount. Maybe some dedicated holders with adhesive shims or a shim on the filmholder mating surface? Alternately, one could accurately measure the right distance to compensate and simply adjust focus by the correct amount after inserting the filmholder, much as is done with IR film. Of course, having the camera machined to the correct measurements would be most desirable, but down-and-dirty might get you shooting more quickly.

    Doremus

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Madisonville, LA
    Posts
    1,402

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    Probably wouldn't see it at f/45!

  9. #9
    ic-racer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    4,767

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    You can use the simple lens equation to figure out the required ground glass displacement for coincidence with the film plane.
    1/p + 1/q = 1/f

    For example if 'p' is the distance your focus is off at the subject plane and 'f' is your focal length lens, then you can solve for 'q' which would tell you how far your ground glass needs to be shifted.


    Also, a 1mm focal error at the film plane is can be, in theory, absorbed by an aperture of f16 assuming this, that, and the other thing, etc...

  10. #10

    Re: What a difference half a millimetre makes...

    Half millimeter is HUGE in optical terms. This illustrate the significance of front and rear camera standards alignment, film holder area on the rear standard to ground glass alignment and all related. Problem increases with shorter focal length lens and increasing film format size.

    As an adder, this illustrates the importance of film flatness inside the film holder. Problem of film flatness grows increasingly significant with increase in sheet film size.

    Keep in mind the lens has a very small point of actual focus and depth of field_depth of focus is an illusion of being in focus. This is why if high definition images are desired, camera and film holder precision can make all the difference along with using the largest lens aperture possible for a given image creation need. The belief that "stopping down" is the focus cure-all does not always apply and is not always the ideal solution to the problem.

    Optical performance of a lens becomes less an less relevant if the camera, film flatness (this is where a Solid State imager has an advantage, these devices are quite flat and stay that way), overall camera image system alignment is not of proper precision and accuracy.



    Bernice

Similar Threads

  1. Half tone screens and half tone negative reproduction
    By senderoaburrido in forum Darkroom: Film, Processing & Printing
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 8-Oct-2016, 19:41
  2. Half of a Durst Componon 240...the front half
    By Kimberly Anderson in forum Darkroom: Equipment
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 21-Nov-2014, 15:35
  3. Who makes this?
    By Jfnphotography in forum Lenses & Lens Accessories
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 17-Mar-2011, 05:59
  4. Sigh...Half Rant, Half Question
    By Pawlowski6132 in forum Style & Technique
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: 15-Sep-2010, 17:46
  5. More RAM really makes a difference
    By Scott Kathe in forum Digital Hardware
    Replies: 34
    Last Post: 28-Feb-2008, 18:00

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •