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Thread: First time using movements

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jan 2017

    First time using movements

    I'm photographing a sculpture. The tripod is set for a slight upward tilt to capture the top of the scene.

    I'm using a Sinar P rear standard and what looks to be a Sinar F front.

    Would I be correct to assume that a slight equal forward tilt on both the front and rear standards would compensate for the tripods upward tilt? I'm trying to keep a vertical Dof with the tripod titled upward.

    I don't trust the gears yet as I'm new to this. I'm using a measuring tape to make sure the front and rear standards are the exact same length from each other from top to bottom.

    What would happen if I rose the height of the front standard and kept the back neutral? How about the same with each standard tilted equally forward...

    Lots to learn

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Chichester, UK

    Re: First time using movements

    If you can, I would keep the bed level and move the front standard up - that's the best way to do what you want. The only way to really understand movements is to use them, so experiment. Otherwise get a small spirit level to check the standards rather than a tape measure, it will be quicker and more accurate.

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Jan 2017

    Re: First time using movements

    Great! Thanks for the response. That looks like the correct way to handle this. I feel like I understand some of the movements. The movements involving rise and fall I don't grasp yet. Don't understand how the image could look normal with each standard on a different y axis point! Lots to learn.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Sep 1998
    Oregon and Austria

    Re: First time using movements

    +1 for leveling the camera and using front rise.

    As for rise movements in general: The position of the back relative to the subject determines how perspective is rendered. For example, when you point the camera up to get a tall building in the scene, the back is no longer parallel to the building facade. The light projected by the lens is a cone, so the the image projected onto the part of the ground glass/film furthest from the lens will be the largest. The top of the back is farther from the plane of the facade. Since the image is upside-down on the ground glass, this makes the bottom of the building larger than the top and results in keystoning (converging verticals).

    If, however, you set up the camera with the back parallel to the front of the building with the camera in zero position, the verticals on the facade will be parallel, but you won't get the top of the building in the shot with the camera in zero position. Fortunately, the lens projects a much bigger image circle than the size of the film, so we can just move the lens up (front rise) and use the part of the image circle that does have the top of the building in it. Voilą! Parallel verticals and the framing we want.

    This is a basic way to deal with tall objects and still retain "realistic" perspective, i.e., verticals the are parallel with buildings, or no objectionable size differences from top-to-bottom with things like sculptures, trees, etc., etc.



  5. #5
    8x10, 5x7, 4x5, et al Leigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Maryland, USA

    Re: First time using movements

    Hi 1er Cru,

    A few basics (learn to walk before running a marathon)...

    The camera you describe was called the model C by Sinar. It's a standard version, though less commonly found.
    It's described in the F/C/P document. It was less expensive, since most folks don't need the fancy P front standard.

    Basic camera terminology:
    In any camera, you're dealing with three planes... the film, the lens, and the subject.
    The strength of a view camera is the huge variety of ways these planes can be combined for the final image.

    The film and subject planes are obvious, the lens plane somewhat less so.
    Every lens has an optical axis, a line through the middle, front to back, extending to infinity. The lens plane is perpendicular to that line.
    In the simplest case, the lens plane is the lensboard, where the lens and shutter are mounted.

    In general, all three planes must be parallel. In a roll-film camera the lens plane and film are fixed in that relationship and can't change.

    You should start a view camera task with the film and back parallel, both perpendicular to the rail, which should be horizontal.

    First lesson in perspective...
    Take a 35mm SLR and point it at your building, horizontally. Now swing the camera up to view the top of the building.
    The top is narrower than the bottom. That's called "keystone" distortion.
    If you rotate your view camera rail up, you get exactly the same keystoning. The optical effects are precisely the same.

    Here is where a view camera differs from an SLR.
    Leave your view camera rail horizontal and the film back vertical.
    Now RAISE the lensboard with the camera's vertical shift. Usually you loosen thumbnuts and raise the board.
    If you watch the image on the ground glass while doing this, you'll see it move down, hopefully enough to see the building top.

    If you can't shift far enough to see the top, increase the range by tilting the base rail up in front while keeping film and lensboard vertical.
    (This assumes you lens' image circle is large enough for the task. if not, back the tripod up and start all over.)

    The "front drop" is obviously the opposite, lowering the lens from its neutral position.
    This is used sometimes for landscapes, like shooting canyons and such.

    Focusing is done by moving the lens forward and back along its optical axis, which is perpendicular to the film.

    This short note covers all the adjustments available for "front rise" or "front shift" on any view camera.
    The objective is to move the image up or down on the film without distorting it.

    - Leigh
    If you believe you can, or you believe you can't... you're right.

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