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Thread: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

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    Lightbulb Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    Here is an idea for a Kickstarter boutique business, as follows: make “Kickloads” with 400 Speed 4x5 black and white film like Ilford HP5. These would be film in sleeves with end clips that would fit into all those existing Fuji Quickload and Kodak Readyload holders that we have. $60 for a box of 20

    Another idea is a 4x5 Polaroid back that will accept the current Polaroid (formerly Impossible) instant film in “One-Step” or “SX-70” type film. It would not show the whole 4x5 frame but would allow an smaller proof positive check for key shots. Could be a hacked One-Step -type camera mechanism in an international Graflok size. $185 for the back.
    Dallas Texas HABS / HAER / HALS Photography
    Photographer/Author Marfa Flights: Aerial Views of Big Bend Country (Texas A&M University Press)
    Represented by Michael Duty Fine Art

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    Re: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    Before it shut down, the New55 project sold sleeved HP5 Plus at $8.50 per sheet, TMY at $11, TXP at $10. Sure, it was in part intended as a fundraiser for New55. But it's doubtful anyone would be able to come anywhere close to $3 per sheet. The equipment that was used to package Kodak Readyloads was destroyed with the demise of the Polaroid factory, so someone would either have to build a new machine from scratch at substantial capital cost, or else load the sleeves with labor-intensive manual processes as New55 did.

    There have been a couple of Kickstarter projects for an Instax Wide back. Both of these failed; not enough people were willing to spend ~$200 for one. One of the projects, Rezivot, still survives and seems close to offering some other products, and I think hasn't entirely given up on trying to find some way to bring the Instax Wide back to fruition. We'll see.

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    Resident Heretic Bruce Watson's Avatar
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    Re: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    Quote Originally Posted by pchaplo View Post
    Here is an idea for a Kickstarter boutique business, as follows: make “Kickloads” with 400 Speed 4x5 black and white film like Ilford HP5. These would be film in sleeves with end clips that would fit into all those existing Fuji Quickload and Kodak Readyload holders that we have. $60 for a box of 20.
    You know that Kodak spent a fair amount of R&D trying to put both Tri-X and TMY into Readyload packets and failed, yes? The problem (as I understand it, and I could well be wrong) was light coming through the sleeve -- too many photons got through the sleeves and the film was sensitive enough that it fogged a bit. And no, I don't have details. The 100 speed films didn't have this problem however. Go figure.

    Apparently it was going to take a redesign of both the sleeves and the holders (to accommodate the slightly thicker sleeves) and projected sales didn't look like doing the work would pay off. Plus it would probably have made for a lot of equipment rework at Polaroid (who actually made the Readyload packets).

    If it wouldn't pay off then (with a lot more film being used), will it pay off now?

    Bruce Watson

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    Re: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    1. I would go for 100 speed film if that would simplify the sleeves. With Quickloads and Readyloads, there are models to be had; perhaps the wheel does not have to be completely reinvented. Oh right, patents. Perhaps a Chinese company will have an idea.

    2. What would it take to get a One-Step camera to act as a 4x5 proofing device albeit with the smaller film?
    Dallas Texas HABS / HAER / HALS Photography
    Photographer/Author Marfa Flights: Aerial Views of Big Bend Country (Texas A&M University Press)
    Represented by Michael Duty Fine Art

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    Re: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    1. The wheel doesn't have to be reinvented, but the packaging machine still has to be built, at great expense relative to the likely sales volume.

    2. Instax Wide would be a better choice for proofing than Impossible/Polaroid Originals. Not only is the image quality far superior from a technical perspective, it develops much faster - 90-120 seconds to completion vs 15 minutes claimed for the latest version of Polaroid Originals. It's a lot cheaper, too. If you want to hack an instant camera to attach to a 4x5, the problem is getting the film near the plane of the ground glass. Adaptations of the late, maybe-or-maybe-not-lamented Lomo Belair Instax Wide back to 4x5 Graflok ended up requiring an extender. Nate Weis (instantoptions.com, Option8 on Facebook) may be able to tell you whether a CB-70 or CB-72 for SX-70 type film can be adapted to Graflok. It won't be cheap. OTOH, if you're not looking to put the instant film in the same place as the camera's ground glass, I'm not sure what you mean by proofing.

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    Re: Kickstarter film ideas: Kickloads 4x5 ! One-Step proofing back for 4x5

    Quote Originally Posted by Oren Grad View Post
    1. The wheel doesn't have to be reinvented, but the packaging machine still has to be built, at great expense relative to the likely sales volume.

    2. Instax Wide would be a better choice for proofing than Impossible/Polaroid Originals. Not only is the image quality far superior from a technical perspective, it develops much faster - 90-120 seconds to completion vs 15 minutes claimed for the latest version of Polaroid Originals. It's a lot cheaper, too. If you want to hack an instant camera to attach to a 4x5, the problem is getting the film near the plane of the ground glass. Adaptations of the late, maybe-or-maybe-not-lamented Lomo Belair Instax Wide back to 4x5 Graflok ended up requiring an extender. Nate Weis (instantoptions.com, Option8 on Facebook) may be able to tell you whether a CB-70 or CB-72 for SX-70 type film can be adapted to Graflok. It won't be cheap. OTOH, if you're not looking to put the instant film in the same place as the camera's ground glass, I'm not sure what you mean by proofing.
    Yes, Instax Wide would be the logical choice. Just recently if I recall there were Instax Wide backs available from some outfit in Italy, but they were $300 each I think and are now gone, no longer available. Perhaps the folks who brought you the Jollylook Kickstarter project will consider an Wide version for their next KS campaign. If they do, and have learned a lesson from this last one they will set the ship date at least 1 year from the close of campaign.

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