To get out of ULF or not?

[Tin Can]

I must admit, I also chose practicality at an early age. I realized by 1970 I was not happy with many things, including claustrophobic colleges.

So I became a self taught mechanic, choosing a trade I knew would be in demand for most of my life.

However not all mechanics make decent money, luckily I found my way into engine testing laboratories enabling a good career and above Union wage. And fancy pants engine wrenching, no cars necessary. I hate cars.

This plan worked until 2008. Then the it died and I had to find a new plan. Earlier...

By 1996 I knew my initial plan would fail at some time, so I tried to cover my bases, by getting a college education late in life. Maybe teach. I was teaching everyday anyhow. Still do.

I enrolled junior college with zero credits, used CLEP to gain maximum learned credit by testing, saved a year. Then took exploratory classes and whoopee I liked Art, so I ran full speed through 6 years of college from age 46 to 51, gaining MFA SAIC 2001 while working full time at night. My 2001 MFA Thesis project addressed Student Loans. I was before the curve and got beat up about that. I saw the death spiral earlier than some.

Now I am 65 and retired, but not tired, so I keep real busy doing whatever the hell interests me, for once in my life. Twice divorced during all the this with a lovely daughter and 2 teenage grandchildren. They are a joy. 2 deceased wives. 4 deceased girl friends. Sad but true.

You cannot plan your future. Just make sure you never sign college loan papers for any reason.

I still have my tools and only draw my weapons when absolutely necessary.

[papercam]

Sell off everything you have: lenses, bodies, film, film holders. Keep only your small or digital cameras and don't look back.
There will be plenty of cameras and lenses and film if/when you return.
Don't do what so many photographers do, obsess about gear, when you should be
grinding out and obsessing about fantastic photographs. 8x10, 4x5 or ULF are great conversation pieces
but in all reality one can take fantastic photographs with anything that works with your "chi".

Best wishes for your AMA, BA,MFA

[StoneNYC]

My personal opinion, which I may have said before, is that you should go to a different undergrad program. That's messed up. Also, many MFA programs are 3 years now, if not most.

The hard truth to post public ally is... My step dad died 2 years ago so I'm supporting my mom by continuing to run my step-dads business, and my Dad-dad is dying of cancer and I'm living at home with mom and really can't leave my area.

Sell your equipment and get back into it at the correct time. Just put two kids through college and the best advice I could give you (as I gave my kids that they used) was to get a degree that you have an 80% or greater chance of making a living/saving for retirement wage at. They took the advice and are on their own and are on a secure path. Five years of college to get a degree that is (honestly) not worth much (experience is as valuable in this regard when we chose to be perfectly honest) is highly suspect if we want to be perfectly honest. The real world we live in is cold, hard and intensely problematic and needs to be accepted for what it is rather than what we hope it could be. The pressure of paying back a student loan when you are working your ass off just to make a living let alone cover the ancillary obligations redefines the term stressful. This is the reason that college enrollment is going through a complete stem to stern transformation resulting in much lower college enrollment. No longer can college students get a "degree" and assume they are secure. The degree you pursue is absolutely critical to your future and chasing a dream or your heart is immaterial to the realities of the market value of said objective. Finance, economics, the sciences are the core of employment. There is nothing wrong with managing this risk.

I chose to stay aside from photography / and architecture as a profession to pursue an engineering degree and participate in photography as a sideline and I can honestly say that it was the best decision I could ever make. The ability to not be concerned about saving for retirement and the flexibility to make images I want to make when I chose to make them. Just buy $0.02. I wish you well.

Well my grandfather did this and set aside painting for engineering and helped make Sikorsky what it is today, without his patent designs the blades would have shaken off and the space shuttle would have had damaged parts (see elastomer load bearing device). So I get what you mean. I've always valued your advice.

There are also a bunch of distance learning programs, and programs with concentrated residency (like in the summer) with the remainder distance.

I'll be doing some summer courses to make things go faster for sure.

You don't know how your work is going to evolve over the next 5 years. Sell the gear you are not using and if you can set the $ aside so you can explore what evolves during your education. And yes explore some of the limited residency programs out there. Some have really good reps like Hartford and SAIC. SCAD's online MFA is pretty demanding and great for working guys, I have a friend in it now. It is not a bullshit degree-he works his ass off.

Thanks, I do hope I can get into the new Hartford program, that would be amazing, close enough to home. Only thing better would be Yale, I'm told it's not as good a program but the contacts are better so you end up in a better spot, however at this point I'm not that good. Working on it.

Size isn't everything. I'm sure you can do good stuff with your smaller equipment. Good luck on your education!

Thanks Brian

I must admit, I also chose practicality at an early age. I realized by 1970 I was not happy with many things, including claustrophobic colleges.

So I became a self taught mechanic, choosing a trade I knew would be in demand for most of my life.

However not all mechanics make decent money, luckily I found my way into engine testing laboratories enabling a good career and above Union wage. And fancy pants engine wrenching, no cars necessary. I hate cars.

This plan worked until 2008. Then the it died and I had to find a new plan. Earlier...

By 1996 I knew my initial plan would fail at some time, so I tried to cover my bases, by getting a college education late in life. Maybe teach. I was teaching everyday anyhow. Still do.

I enrolled junior college with zero credits, used CLEP to gain maximum learned credit by testing, saved a year. Then took exploratory classes and whoopee I liked Art, so I ran full speed through 6 years of college from age 46 to 51, gaining MFA SAIC 2001 while working full time at night. My 2001 MFA Thesis project addressed Student Loans. I was before the curve and got beat up about that. I saw the death spiral earlier than some.

Now I am 65 and retired, but not tired, so I keep real busy doing whatever the hell interests me, for once in my life. Twice divorced during all the this with a lovely daughter and 2 teenage grandchildren. They are a joy. 2 deceased wives. 4 deceased girl friends. Sad but true.

You cannot plan your future. Just make sure you never sign college loan papers for any reason.

I still have my tools and only draw my weapons when absolutely necessary.

You are an outlier, but good thoughts on how life changes.

Sell off everything you have: lenses, bodies, film, film holders. Keep only your small or digital cameras and don't look back.
There will be plenty of cameras and lenses and film if/when you return.
Don't do what so many photographers do, obsess about gear, when you should be
grinding out and obsessing about fantastic photographs. 8x10, 4x5 or ULF are great conversation pieces
but in all reality one can take fantastic photographs with anything that works with your "chi".

Best wishes for your AMA, BA,MFA

Thanks, no digital cameras, sold them off last year.

But image making advice is sound. That's for sure.

I should mention that I'm going for an MFA because I plan to teach, but specifically traditional techniques. Most of the teachers who are well versed in the old ways are retiring or frankly dying off. There's a need at some fancy fine art colleges for people who know those techniques and I plan to fill a void now that traditional photography (film, wet plate, etc) has taken a seat along side the "fine arts" like paining and sculpting etc at colleges that are focused on fine art and charge a lot to students. So the need for me will be kind of small, but at the same time the competition will not be so bad, most WP guys don't have a masters etc, at least that's my thinking.

I'm also doing a minor in women's studies I think, at least I've considered it when I transfer. All state schools, so money is low until the MFA.

Perhaps I'll try to do something this summer before I give it up entirely? Give myself a time limit to make images on 14x17 and then if I cant make my own deadline, it's gone?

I'll need the 8x10 etc gear for my MFA for sure so I'm not getting rid of everything like it's been suggested. But it's time I guess to realize I may not have the resources to do ULF right now to any worth while success anyway.

[peter schrager]

Follow your heart stone..photography needs you
I met some of the Hartford people at the l.a book fair last month
Yale might take you further. .good connections. .

[Kodachrome25]

You have gotten some really sound and yet compassionate advice Stone, so all I can add is by all means, trim the fat if you have to trim the fat.

A more relaxed and stress free state of mind is a far more productive place for creativity to live than under loads of gear and stress.

[Winger]

You have gotten some really sound and yet compassionate advice Stone, so all I can add is by all means, trim the fat if you have to trim the fat.

A more relaxed and stress free state of mind is a far more productive place for creativity to live than under loads of gear and stress.

+1
And you'll use your brain more because you'll find a way to do what you want with the gear you have. Better than having GAS all the time and thinking "If only…"

[Alan Gales]

I recommend to get out of the ULF. You can always buy the stuff back in 5 years if you are still interested. I doubt prices will go up on equipment. As mentioned earlier film probably will.

It sounds like between helping your mom and going to school you have a full plate. Make your life as easy as you can. I wish you the best!

[DennisD]

Hello Stone,

I arrived late to this thread and would have written more. However, there's little I can add to the excellent and thoughtful advice provided to you in the posts on the first page #3,4,7,8,9. A few quick thoughts:

Trim what you don't need, especially the ULF, especially if that's not your best. "Focus" on (one) large format 4x5, 8x10 that provides the most satisfaction and where you can do your best work. Don't be distracted by other "stuff", i.e. get the clutter and unnecessary expenses out if the way.

You are at a time in your life where you must carefully evaluate your options - what you do, your priorities, and how you manage time. Know that Your decisions made now, will have lifelong effect. Be realistic - play out in your mind and with a trusted advisor or mentor,the different directions / avenues you might consider and the results those choices will bring (pos/ neg). That should help in your decision making. Once decided, set the priorities for your work / education and family responsibilities carefully. Stick with your plan, modifying as needed, to maintain your goals.

One final thought. You mentioned the Yale program. Examine it carefully. If it suits you and you're accepted, you will be forever grateful for the level of education and affiliation the program and degree will provide.

Very best wishes to you as you go forward.

Dennis

[GG12]

Hello Stone,

One final thought. You mentioned the Yale program. Examine it carefully. If it suits you and you're accepted, you will be forever grateful for the level of education and affiliation the program and degree will provide.

Dennis

Agreed. The level of stimulus and challenge will be top-tier. Don't get bogged down with equipment at this stage in your life. Go for the best challenges, and the highest level of inquiry - the format and equipment really don't matter now, you can always pick them up later. I'd recommend 4x5 (small and light) and keep moving forward amid all the challenges you have on your plate. Time is the one irreplaceable element in all this, and learning as much as you can is paramount at this stage.

Geoff

[DrTang]

keep your stuff..in fact..buy more.. stop going to school, and instead..with that money..go and shoot...a lot

it's all about the prints.. and not the paper