Stand and semi-stand development...is there a primer?

[Kimberly Anderson]

Do your methods and materials give you the results you desire?

Well, yes...and no. I am getting some really nice gentle pt/pd prints from my negs. The PMK makes printing everything so easy and I never have to worry about taming contrast. I have plenty of shadow detail and the highlights come in nicely.

The thing that I really don't see is that when I want to do a N+1 or N+2 I'm not getting the really punchy contrast out of the film the way that I would like. I do like HP5+ in that the speed allows me to get an extra stop or two (my personal EI is 200 with it).

I've used HP5+ exclusively (except for the random batches of extremely old expired 8x10 film), for about 4-5 years and I am happy with the negatives. The nice thing about them is I can contact print them in gelatin silver very easily as well. So...allegedly the PMK is doing it's job well, that is allowing me to make negatives that can both alt print and gelatin silver print well.

After a stack of negatives almost 8 inches tall I think I can say it's safe to explore other types of films.

BUT...the main reason I am asking about stand development is that I have run into a large supply of 8x10 hard rubber tanks and all the film hangars one could want. Previously I had been processing in the JOBO and loved the results. I am tired though of the limitation of only processing 5 sheets of large film at a time (8010 drum). If I could process 20 sheets at a time then the stand development starts to really look appealing, even with it's extended processing time.

Thanks for EVERYONE'S input. I have learned a lot in this thread. I haven't made any decisions yet, but it's starting to come together.

[Peter De Smidt]

My experience with HP5+ and PMK was that it wasn't a good combo for expansion development, at least with VC silver gelatin papers.

[Jim Noel]

Well, yes...and no. I am getting some really nice gentle pt/pd prints from my negs. The PMK makes printing everything so easy and I never have to worry about taming contrast. I have plenty of shadow detail and the highlights come in nicely.

The thing that I really don't see is that when I want to do a N+1 or N+2 I'm not getting the really punchy contrast out of the film the way that I would like. I do like HP5+ in that the speed allows me to get an extra stop or two (my personal EI is 200 with it).

I've used HP5+ exclusively (except for the random batches of extremely old expired 8x10 film), for about 4-5 years and I am happy with the negatives. The nice thing about them is I can contact print them in gelatin silver very easily as well. So...allegedly the PMK is doing it's job well, that is allowing me to make negatives that can both alt print and gelatin silver print well.

After a stack of negatives almost 8 inches tall I think I can say it's safe to explore other types of films.

BUT...the main reason I am asking about stand development is that I have run into a large supply of 8x10 hard rubber tanks and all the film hangars one could want. Previously I had been processing in the JOBO and loved the results. I am tired though of the limitation of only processing 5 sheets of large film at a time (8010 drum). If I could process 20 sheets at a time then the stand development starts to really look appealing, even with it's extended processing time.

Thanks for EVERYONE'S input. I have learned a lot in this thread. I haven't made any decisions yet, but it's starting to come together.

The slower the film, the better it expands. You are fighting an uphill battle when trying to expand HP5+ or any other film in that speed range. FP4+ expands beautifully with essentially any developer. It is my standard film since 90-95% of my images are printed with any one of several alternate processes.

[Steve Sherman]

Well, yes...and no. I am getting some really nice gentle pt/pd prints from my negs. The PMK makes printing everything so easy and I never have to worry about taming contrast. I have plenty of shadow detail and the highlights come in nicely.

The thing that I really don't see is that when I want to do a N+1 or N+2 I'm not getting the really punchy contrast out of the film the way that I would like. I do like HP5+ in that the speed allows me to get an extra stop or two (my personal EI is 200 with it).

I've used HP5+ exclusively (except for the random batches of extremely old expired 8x10 film), for about 4-5 years and I am happy with the negatives. The nice thing about them is I can contact print them in gelatin silver very easily as well. So...allegedly the PMK is doing it's job well, that is allowing me to make negatives that can both alt print and gelatin silver print well.

After a stack of negatives almost 8 inches tall I think I can say it's safe to explore other types of films.

BUT...the main reason I am asking about stand development is that I have run into a large supply of 8x10 hard rubber tanks and all the film hangars one could want. Previously I had been processing in the JOBO and loved the results. I am tired though of the limitation of only processing 5 sheets of large film at a time (8010 drum). If I could process 20 sheets at a time then the stand development starts to really look appealing, even with it's extended processing time.

Thanks for EVERYONE'S input. I have learned a lot in this thread. I haven't made any decisions yet, but it's starting to come together.

Im sorry I don't have time to expand on this with a more detailed answer, quite simply, Semi-Stand, Extreme Minimal Agitation or Reduced Agitation schemes of developing film rely on extremely dilute chemistry for the actual effect to take place, therefore each piece of film needs to have an excessive amount of solution of continue to benefit from the technique. My benchmark for amount of solution is each sq. inch of film needs 15 ml of solution, one 8x10 needs approx. 1200 - 1400 ml of solution Sandy King says that solution can be used for one more sheet of 8x10 film. My results have not been successful the second time around.
More on Film Characteristic Curve later.

[murphy]

I believe I understand expansion development, having been taught Zone system perspective, how do you view, or explain expansion when preparing a negative for Alt processes?

[Ken Lee]

I believe I understand expansion development, having been taught Zone system perspective, how do you view, or explain expansion when preparing a negative for Alt processes?

You might find this article helpful: http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/PCat/pcat.html