starting again...

[macvisual]

I'm quite new here.

I once owned a Toyo 45C mono rail 5x4 about 25yrs ago, haven't used a large format in a very (very) long time and now have the urge again. Recently bought a Mamiya C330 Pro S with 80mm & 135mm lenses and now ditched my digital set up etc...

Any advice on how to return to large format photography without spending a fortune ? Would love to try a 10x8 but think it would be more costly over 5x4 ? Any advice appreciated with regards to make/model of camera to buy and which lens length to aim for? Something like a wide angle lens would be good as I tend to shoot landscapes photography. Buying second hand would suit me better money wise.


Regards;
peter
Scotland

[Leigh]

Hi Peter, and welcome aboard.

The main problem with 8x10 (disregarding cost) is there are very few available lenses that will cover that format, and they're usually expensive.

In contrast, there's a huge variety of lenses that cover 4x5, available in a wide range of prices.

I shoot both formats. I have about 18 lenses for the 4x5, and three for the 8x10.

- Leigh

[tgtaylor]

Hi Peter,

Since you have already worked with the Toyo's, I would suggest that you consider a Toyo again. As you probably already know, the 4x5 fields and rails are excellent and relatively inexpensive with parts and factory service readily available. The 8x10 rails can be found for about $500 or so but the Field's are much more expensive. I own (and regularly use!) Toyo 4x5 fields and monorails (AX, CF, and Robos) and 8x10 Toyo field and monorail (MII and G). I now have 7 lens for the 4x5's and 6 lens for the 8x10's - all of which can be used with the 4x5 format, and range from 75mm to 610mm in focal length. Two are soft focus lens (Imagon and Wollensak).

To recap, the Toyo 4x5 fields and monorails are relatively inexpensive and readily available. The Toyo 8x10 monorails are also inexpensive but a little harder to come by. The 8x10 Toyo Fields are the hardest to find and the most expensive.

Thomas

[Yo' Vinny]

I recently picked up an 8x10. I really love the challenge and constraints around it, but be prepared for these. It is quite a bit more costly for film and developing. It is also a LOT more work. The results usually make it worth it, but I found with my 4x5 that the results were spectacular, but it was still very portable in a hiking backpack with 3-4 lenses and a full filter set. I am not trying to suggest that you shouldn't do 8x10, just understand that many of the constraints may make you regret the return to large format. It might be a better idea to work in 4x5 for a while since the entry and operating costs are much more manageable. IMHO.

[Brian C. Miller]

"Knowing what I know now, any photographer worth his salt could make some beautiful things with pinhole cameras." -- Ansel Adams

You could see if 8x10 is for you with a pinhole camera. Yes, 8x10 is more expensive, but you don't have to spend a lot of money to have satisfaction with it. First, you need a camera. Just be patient, and keep scouting around. One will turn up, perhaps with a lens. If it doesn't have a lens, keep scouting, and a lens will turn up. 300mm lenses are not rare, not at all. Inquire at camera clubs and shops. Somebody has something somewhere.

Yes, you can get into 4x5 on the cheap, and have an excellent camera. Scout around. One camera, one lens, and use it well. For many years my only LF camera was a Graflex Super Graphic, which I still have and use. There's lots of old press cameras which will still give good service, and the lenses really are good.

[toolbox]

What's your budget? Used 4x5 monorails can be found for next to nothing... You can get something like a CC400 with a lens for $150 or under if you're patient. If you mix your own chemistry, you can develop for next to nothing. And X2 on the press cameras. I'm a huge fan of Graflex equipment...I restore them on the side, and you really can't go wrong with the Optars and Ektars that are usually found on them. They're light, small enough to pack easily, and not that expensive. Only down side is the limited movements...but that's the compromise you make for the very small size you get when they're folded up.

[ROL]

Peter, why are you returning to LF? Knowing that will help you decide on format and direction. IMO, too many wannabe's and neophytes simply become fascinated with the gear or the image of themselves as a "photographer" under the focus cloth. Not that you are either, but you haven't told us what you want to do with either 4x5 or 8x10. Shooting film (?), scanning only (?), DR printing(?) (yourself(?))… all will determine an optimum format or choice of formats. Where is your commitment?

8x10 will be significantly more expensive than 4x5, in film and other consumables alone. Just visit any film thread to hear the constant bitching about that. If you're only planning to contact print your negatives, I'd advise at least 8x10. If enlarging, 4x5 is fine, and will be much much easier to work in the DR. It is unlikely you will see any significant differences in larger formats unless you are able to make huge enlargements. If planning on scanning to the web, 4x5 is likely overkill itself. To sum up, depending on your goals, 4x5 gives you ever so many more and relatively inexpensive options from camera to lens to film to DR, than 8x10.

Of course, you could always split the 4x5 – 8x10 difference with 5x7, attaining the best of both worlds, as many prescient have. There is much room for quality work in that Goldilocks format, as I am intimately aware of only one photographer working 5x7 whose work I both respect and admire.

[Dan Dozer]

Don't be put off by anyone saying that there aren't many lenses for 8 x 10 formats - that is entirely untrue. I have probably 20 lenses for my 8 x 10. If you ever look into taking portrait type of work, the selection is much better for 8 x 10 than for 4 x 5 camera formats.

Finding inexpensive lenses that fit the 8 x 10 format will take a little work, but with a little perseverance, you can find one out there on the auction site. If you want a more modern coated lens, then the price will be higher, but there are plenty of Schneiders, Nikors, and Fujis out there to be had. Regarding wide angle lenses, I sometimes use my 210 Schneider Symmar for portrait work on my Deardorff, but I'm not sure if it will cover at infinity or not. Even if it does, it probably won't have much movement.

One lens that is pretty easy to find is the Turner Reich Triple convertable usually in big Betax shutter. The one I used to have was a 12"/21"/28" size. Finding one in a good working shutter should be less than $200.

One thing you will need to decide is whether or not you need a lens with a shutter. If you are shooting landscapes with 100 speed film at F32, you probably don't need one since your shutter speeds will be slow anyway.

As others have said, probably the biggest cost issue is film. Some photographers out there are now using Xray film which is supposedly a lot cheaper, but I have no experience with that.

[Leigh]

Don't be put off by anyone saying that there aren't many lenses for 8 x 10 formats - that is entirely untrue.

My previous comment about the relative paucity of lenses for 8x10 was based on modern lenses, not old relics.

Yes, old relics can be bought for little money. Sellers know what they're (not) worth.

I was assuming that the OP was interested in making quality photographs.

- Leigh

[Drew Bedo]

I'm quite new here.


Any advice on how to return to large format photography without spending a fortune ? Would love to try a 10x8 but think it would be more costly over 5x4 ? Any advice appreciated

Regards;
peter
Scotland

Peter:

Large format is costly. In the digital world there is instant feedback and no cost fro film or processing.

Not only is LF costly in general; for each step up in format size the cost goes up exponentially by the square of the format area. For formats larger than 8x10, the cost increases by the CUBE of the format area.

Just as with yachting, "If you have to ask . ."