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Thread: Basic filter question

  1. #1

    Basic filter question

    I am scheduled to take a workshop with Dykinga in a few weeks. The materials suggest that I bring a grad ND and a polarizer. My only lens is a Schneider 210 APO-Symmar with a 72mm thread. I use color transparency film only. I have never used or owned any filter other than a B+W KR1.5 that I keep on the lens at all times. My meter is a Pentax Digital Spotmeter. I do not use any other formats (35mm or MF) for "serious" photography. If I ultimately buy more lenses I would think they would be a 110mm Schneider Super-Symmar and a Nikon 300mm/f9.

    My questions: What kind of polarizer? If I want to meter through the polarizer am I required to use a circular polarizer, or will a linear one work just fine? Kaesemann or warm? Is there such a thing as a warm Kaesemann? If so who makes it?

    As to the grad ND, from what I have read on the forum I was thinking about a Lee 2 stop grad ND (which would also require me to buy an adapter ring and a holder - or would I be better off with a hood with a filter slot) - am I on the right track? Any other options?

    Thanks -Josh

  2. #2

    Basic filter question

    Josh:

    Most of the warm Kaesemann filters are circular. I think Heliopan still makes a warm linear Kaesemann, but it's pretty pricy ~$200 or more.

    I don't find that metering through the polarizer helps much. I meter the scene, then apply the appropriate filter factor. Thus I stuck with the B+W warm top polarizer, which has the same KR1.5 as your filter, and have been very happy with the results.

    The circular polarizers add a 1/4 wave plate (film) which theoretically can reduce the optical quality. Having talked with folks at B+W though, it seems that circular Kaesemann filters are quite good these days. It is mostly a matter of budget. B+W does sell warm linear and circular filters with the KR1.5 factor, but they aren't Kaesemann.

  3. #3

    Basic filter question

    Since you are contemplating buying additional lenses, I would strongly suggest that you purchase the filters to fit something like a 77mm lens, then all you have to do is buy step-up rings for each of your lenses to fit the 77mm filter. That keeps you from buying filters for all of the different lens sizes and gives you the added comfort of knowing that the filter will not vignette the corners since it is oversize.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    217

    Basic filter question

    My understanding is that circular is required where a beam splitter is used in a SLR (or meter) as this polarizes the light itself, resulting in incorrect readings due to cross-polarisation. If this is the case with the Pentax, I have no idea but in any event, the polarising effect is the same so you may as well go for the circular regardless.

    I also think from past reading that the Kaesemann filter's main advantage is that it is of better quality build - selected pola film and glass & sealed edges. Optically there is unlikely to be any detectable difference between them and any other good quality filter - but that's just "book knowledge" - I've never compared them myself...

    Lee seem to be the people to go with for the grad. Don't forget they do soft and hard graduation versions - the hard is favourite for landscape to darken the sky. Also, sets of 3 grads are available for a slight discount price.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Nov 2003
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    1,219

    Basic filter question

    I echo two comments previously made.

    I have a Pentax Spotmeter, and I believe it does have a beam splitter. So you would need a circular polarizer to have a hope of getting an accurate reading through it.

    You are probably better off not trying to read intensities through the filter but to apply an appropriate filter factor instead.

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Knoxville, Tennessee
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    1,789

    Basic filter question

    If you want only one, 77mm Heliopan Kaesemann warm tone. I've used one for years and it's great. Pricey but great. The price per shot is negligible.

    Steve

  7. #7

    Basic filter question

    Thanks all. A few more questions: If I were to buy a regular polarizer and screw it onto the KR1.5, would I have the equivalent of a warm polarizer? Does multicoating make a difference for a polarizer? Regarding the Lee filters, would I want to buy the adapter and holder, or buy the adapter and the 1-slot or 2-slot lens hood? Finally, if I had to choose between the polarizer and the grad ND, for color landscape/nature, what would I pick?

  8. #8

    Basic filter question

    Josh:

    Stacking a pol and your KR will work, but you get extra glass/air interfaces that increase light loss and flare. Plus, if you try this approach on a wide lens like the 110mm Super-Symmar, you will get mechanical vignetting.

    As for your "future" lenses, the 110mm has a 67mm filter thread...but given the design of the front element, most like to use a spacer to keep filters from possible contact with the front element. So if you get a 72mm filter for your 210mm, it will work fine with a step-up ring on the 110mm. The 300M Nikkor has a 52mm thread. While you could use the 72mm filters with a big step up ring, I find it more convenient to get a dedicated filter for that lens (which I own!).

    Traditionally, most pol were not multicoated... but B+W is now using their MRC coating on many of their pols. I have the warm linear Top pol with the MRC coating. It is a very nice coating, and very durable.

    I played around with grads, but found them difficult to use except in ideal cases of flat horizons, which I almost never had! If I have a situation I can't handle in one exposure, I now take two and blend digitally in Photoshop. Given that, I would highly recommend the pol for color landscape work.

    If you get the pol, be careful not to overdo it! I usually turn the pol until the effect looks good on the groundglass, then back it off a bit for a more subtle effect on film.

  9. #9

    Basic filter question

    Linear pol works fine on a view camera. Don`t get warm unless you want to warm up transparenies. There is no difference on film between circular and linear, just behind the lens metering with certain cameras. Use step up ring and buy a large pol to fit all lenses. I have a used 77mm tiffen for 20 bucks that works just fine.

    Kasseman pol are sealed on the edges to withstand humidity better. I never has a reg pol separate though and I have a ser 6 one that is 50 years old and is fine. I bought it new.

  10. #10

    Basic filter question

    Glenn, I can't seem to find a B+W KR1.5 polarizer with MRC in the Schneider catalog. Do you have a model number? Also, thanks for the info on the 110mm and 300mm lenses.

    Since every sheet of film that I have ever taken on the view camera has been exposed through a KR1.5 and I am used to seeing everything with the slightly warmer tone, and if there is indeed risk of flare if I stack my skylight with a plain polarizer, isn't skylight/polarizer combo the answer?

    Finally, one last question, if I go with just one grad 2 stop ND for the 210mm lens, should I get a hard edge or soft edge?

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