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Geraldine Powell
3-Feb-2013, 10:09
Does anyone know of a manual, book, or some written instructions so that I can understand how to set the Dmax and Dmin of my negative on the scanner?
I keep seeing that I should do this, but I don't know how to do it and I am not a bit intuitive when it comes to figuring these kind of things out. I am looking for basic simple instructions. It is just for black and white negatives that I print using piezography inks.
Geraldine

Jon Shiu
3-Feb-2013, 11:26
In professional mode, click on the icon that looks like a histogram. If needed, move the black and white points outwards so they don't clip off tones.

Jon

edit: yes do a pre-scan first and crop to image area

Walter Calahan
3-Feb-2013, 11:29
Depends on what software driver you are using. I use Silverfast on my v750.

First I scan all my B&W negatives as if they are color negatives. My personal preference is that I get more information out of the negative as an RGB file. Perhaps this is just wishful thinking, but that's what I do.

Then I zero out the Dmax and Dmin settings. Make a preview scan to see the shape of the histogram. Once I see the shape, I move the Black slider and white slider to match the left and right ends of my histogram. If need be I then adjust the midtone slider to brighten or darken the overall image.

This seems to work for me. I'm sure others do it differently. Hope this is helpful. Good luck.

Best, Walt

Ken Lee
3-Feb-2013, 14:03
You might find this brief article helpful: Scanning Tips (with Epson and VueScan Software) (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/scanning.php)

biedron
3-Feb-2013, 14:26
Ken's page is extremely useful. Straight and to the point. It was my "user's manual" when I got my V700.

Bob


You might find this brief article helpful: Scanning Tips (with Epson and VueScan Software) (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/scanning.php)

Geraldine Powell
3-Feb-2013, 19:19
Thank-you everyone and especially thank-you to Ken Lee. I think I can actually do this! I have been afraid to touch the histogram.
I did not understand what Walter Calahan said about zeroing out the Dmax. Do you mean on the histogram, or is there some other mystery hidden away box that does that?
Geraldine

Ken Lee
3-Feb-2013, 20:14
There are probably several ways to get a linear scan - using the Curve tool for example - but whatever method we use, we are adjusting one curve or histogram (of the negative) to fit another (of the scanner) in order to get the desired image.

If you find a hidden mystery setting which accomplishes that automatically, please let us know. :cool:

photoevangelist
4-Feb-2013, 00:04
Anyone tried this?
http://oomz.net/bw_workflow/
I tried scanning a 4x5 negative yesterday with this method. I make a 30x40 print. Looks like an acceptable method to me. What are your thoughts, Ken?

I've looked over your workflow and want to try it next to the above method.

Ken Lee
4-Feb-2013, 06:11
Anyone tried this?
http://oomz.net/bw_workflow/
I tried scanning a 4x5 negative yesterday with this method. I make a 30x40 print. Looks like an acceptable method to me. What are your thoughts, Ken?


In a quick read I find the following points deserving of your reconsideration. There may be more, and in each case it's the underlying principle that I question.

1) Saving the original scan as a JPG file in order to save disk space.

2) Always setting the white point to the right-most end of the histogram.

3) Performing minimal adjustment during the scanning phase, and doing them down-stream in Photoshop instead.

4) Conversion from one profile to another does not change pixels.

5) Using the Dot Gain feature as a method of tonal correction.

6) The observation that a 25 megapixel image file is huge.

At the end of the article, the author shows something called "Final image with history", and with all due respect I would recommend that you consider both the tonality of final image and the high number of steps required to attain it.

photobymike
4-Feb-2013, 06:35
Geraldine...I dont know if you have ever worked in a "dark" darkroom making silver prints. Its hard to read about how to make a print on an enlarger. And i am sure a scanner is much harder to use than making prints in Dektol. I did trial and error for months and worked at it for years before i got really good. To me thats what made it an art and a craft that made me a magician in other peoples eyes. Now i have read and asked lots of questions and watched to see how it was done...and then it came time for me to just do it..and do it... and do it... What people are not telling you is that your scan depends on what printer and ink you use.... there is where the craft comes in matching the scan to the printer. For instance my 4800 prints dark and my r3000 does not go dark enough....Dmax and Dmin ect.... cuz just like in a darkroom a bad scan, under neg exposure or under develop will close up your Dmax... practice practice practice.... now its the only thing i do well after years of doing it...

Geraldine Powell
4-Feb-2013, 07:24
This forum is great! Now, thanks to everyone, I have a bunch of things to try out. I have an Epson 3880 and I am using Jon Cone piezography inks. I tend to favor the idea of doing as little in photoshop as possible but mainly, I want to develop a workflow that gets reasonable results and that I can tweak as I become more familiar with it. I agree with practice, practice, practice, but I wnt to try to do it intelligently.
G

Ken Lee
4-Feb-2013, 09:12
I have nothing against Photoshop or any other editor, but as someone from the era of large format darkroom prints, I try to maintain an analog feel as much as possible. Therefore I try to make as few adjustments as possible, as early in the process as possible. When making prints from digital capture, I recommend the same approach.

tiggert
15-Feb-2013, 08:07
This forum is great! Now, thanks to everyone, I have a bunch of things to try out. I have an Epson 3880 and I am using Jon Cone piezography inks. I tend to favor the idea of doing as little in photoshop as possible but mainly, I want to develop a workflow that gets reasonable results and that I can tweak as I become more familiar with it. I agree with practice, practice, practice, but I wnt to try to do it intelligently.
G

I undertook the exact same process last year using the 750, a 2880, piezo selenium. It is amazingly easy! My only piece of advice you may find with piezo it actually looks better when the digital "negative" on the screen is a little brighter than you would think it you do silver. To me piezo does an amazing job in the dark values, zone 1 actually prints details! Dont let the scanner chop the blacks and dont crush them in photoshop. Use the histogram on both and you will start pulling great prints in no time...

tiggert
15-Feb-2013, 08:20
I have nothing against Photoshop or any other editor, but as someone from the era of large format darkroom prints, I try to maintain an analog feel as much as possible. Therefore I try to make as few adjustments as possible, as early in the process as possible. When making prints from digital capture, I recommend the same approach.

+1 with Ken's approach. I only do minimal steps:

1) dust/scratch spot layer
2) dodge/burn layer
3) curve adjustments keeping an eye on the histogram, dont crush the blacks....

Basically it is a digital replication of my darkroom process....cool thing is once it is done, no need to repeat...just hit print!

Anything more is.....well i find not needed for what i want