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View Full Version : Lenny comes through....again



Kirk Gittings
23-Jan-2013, 20:15
I have a fair amount of experience scanning and have access to both the new Imacons and an IQSmart 3 (I also own a 750 and a Jazz+). When I need speed and a medium size print (not larger than 24x30) on a good sharp well exposed and processed negative I find the Imacon adequate. When I have the time I use the IQSmart 3 which does a fine job once you learn its quirky software for even very large prints. But when I have a problem negative say with somewhat underexposed shadows and very bright highlights I always spring for a first rate drum scan.

On a recent landscape I used a red filter (and with rapidly changing light) and where I should have given more exposure to lighten open up the green grass in the foreground and paired it with minus development to hold the detail in sunlit thunderheads, instead I gave it the usual filter factor and normal development resulting in the foreground shaded grass being nearly clear on the film-like big globs of nearly pure black looming large in the foreground. Anyway my attempts to do a good scan of this neg didn't solve the problem, but Lenny pulled it off extracting more detail and separation from those areas than I thought possible.

Thanks as always Lenny!

Bill_1856
23-Jan-2013, 20:54
I have a fair amount of experience scanning and have access to both the new Imacons and an IQSmart 3 (I also own a 750 and a Jazz+). When I need speed and a medium size print (not larger than 24x30) on a good sharp well exposed and processed negative I find the Imacon adequate. When I have the time I use the IQSmart 3 which does a fine job once you learn its quirky software for even very large prints. But when I have a problem negative say with somewhat underexposed shadows and very bright highlights I always spring for a first rate drum scan.

On a recent landscape I used a red filter (and with rapidly changing light) and where I should have given more exposure to lighten open up the green grass in the foreground and paired it with minus development to hold the detail in sunlit thunderheads, instead I gave it the usual filter factor and normal development resulting in the foreground shaded grass being nearly clear on the film-like big globs of nearly pure black looming large in the foreground. Anyway my attempts to do a good scan of this neg didn't solve the problem, but Lenny pulled it off extracting more detail and separation from those areas than I thought possible.

Thanks as always Lenny!

Who's Lenny?

Merg Ross
23-Jan-2013, 21:24
Who's Lenny?

Just a wild guess.

http://www.eigerstudios.com/

Lenny Eiger
24-Jan-2013, 20:17
Kirk, you are most welcome. Its always a pleasure working with you.

I have also had the pleasure of working with many others here. It is always nice to scan photographs from excellent photographers. There is nothing like this Large Format Group. It's the best.

Lenny
eiger@eigerstudios.com
707-763-5922

Bruce Watson
25-Jan-2013, 12:57
...resulting in the foreground shaded grass being nearly clear on the film-like big globs of nearly pure black looming large in the foreground. Anyway my attempts to do a good scan of this neg didn't solve the problem, but Lenny pulled it off extracting more detail and separation from those areas than I thought possible.

Yep. People talk about how drum scanners do with a really dense negative, and with good reason. But what I like about a drum scanner is how well it does with the really thin regions of the film. I often pull image detail out of the shadows of B&W films that look perfectly clear on the light table under a loupe. Drum scanning is amazing technology, as is film itself. I can't believe I get to use both, at least for a few more years.

pozzello
27-Jan-2013, 21:34
I 'discovered' Lenny recently when I needed some high end scans for my current project. I tried dealing with some local service bureaus in Montreal but just kept getting crappy scans. After a little research on the net I decided to give Eiger Studios a try and I couldn't be happier with the results.

Here are some comparisons between my first scan done locally on a Heidelberg Primescan 7100 by Photosynthese, one from my old Epson 3180, and one from Eiger Studios. Each one is 100% 8x10 crop of a 40"x40" scan of a 6cm x 6cm black and white negative.

http://www.paulozzello.com/scans/epson.jpg
http://www.paulozzello.com/scans/HeidelbergD7100.jpg
http://www.paulozzello.com/scans/eiger.jpg

And the full image:

http://www.paulozzello.com/images/slider/square.jpg (from my epson)

I can't wait for Eiger Studios to start printing !!


Paul


Who's Lenny?

Zaitz
27-Jan-2013, 22:46
Wow that Heidelberg scan is terrible.

Tobias Key
28-Jan-2013, 05:31
Wow that Heidelberg scan is terrible.

It's been specifically calibrated by Luminous Landscape for film versus digital tests!

Zaitz
28-Jan-2013, 19:56
It's been specifically calibrated by Luminous Landscape for film versus digital tests!:D Too true...

Marty Knapp
29-Jan-2013, 18:20
As far as I know, there's only one Lenny-

Although I now do much of my own scanning, I continue to have Lenny make all the "critical" scans I need to make prints for discerning collectors of my work or for making much larger than normal prints. Lenny has produced excellent scans for me since 2007. It's always a pleasure when I get home and can see the fabulous nuances he and his Aztec pull out of my medium format negatives. I unabashedly endorse Messieur Eiger especially so for those of us who are transiting from film to digital in fine black and white work.

ericpmoss
29-Jan-2013, 19:11
Wow that Heidelberg scan is terrible.

I'm trying to figure out what happened. Is the operator, or some auto-focus algorithm, focusing on the texture in anti-newton-ring glass because it's easier to see than the film grain, effectively masquerading as grain? If they were focusing on the grain, I would have thought that the image sharpness would come along for the ride.

Zaitz
29-Jan-2013, 22:35
When you zoom in on the Heidelberg scan it looks like a lot of things are double image. Like the film moved over a slight bit during scanning. A lot of the branches you can see twice. I think that is accounting for the blur.

austin granger
5-Feb-2013, 14:39
I'd like to join in and say a good word about Lenny as well. I recently sent him two tricky 5x7 negatives of snowy scenes. The negs were over exposed and over developed but Lenny managed to make some beautiful scans-the highlights are reined in but still full of life, there's great detail in the shadows, and the overall sharpness is just terrific. I couldn't be happier. In addition, Lenny proved to be very generous with his time; we spoke at length on the phone and he was more than happy to answer my questions and offer much good advise. He even called me afterwards as a follow up to see how things went. One word of caution though; if you're a lover of HP5 or Tri-X, be prepared to defend yourself! :) Seriously though, the man knows what he's doing and he's kind to boot. I wish I could send him all of my negatives.

perfectedmaya
24-Feb-2013, 22:54
I'd like to join in and say a good word about Lenny as well. I recently sent him two tricky 5x7 negatives of snowy scenes. The negs were over exposed and over developed but Lenny managed to make some beautiful scans-the highlights are reined in but still full of life, there's great detail in the shadows, and the overall sharpness is just terrific. I couldn't be happier. In addition, Lenny proved to be very generous with his time; we spoke at length on the phone and he was more than happy to answer my questions and offer much good advise. He even called me afterwards as a follow up to see how things went. One word of caution though; if you're a lover of HP5 or Tri-X, be prepared to defend yourself! :) Seriously though, the man knows what he's doing and he's kind to boot. I wish I could send him all of my negatives.

just curious, what will he say of hp5 and tri-x? and what does he recommends? :)

Lenny Eiger
24-Feb-2013, 23:59
just curious, what will he say of hp5 and tri-x? and what does he recommends? :)

OK, I'll bite. This is scanning we are talking about - and not contact printing. In scanning, the results I seem to like best come from film/development combos that create densely-packed grains, and a smooth tone. I used Tri-x in my early years and have great respect for the smooth tones of the original version. However, I find the grain is unnecessarily large in both the films you ask about. We have samples (in a drum scanner) that are the pixels that get generated (more or less of them than we need) and we have the dithering pattern of a printer. There is enough patterning that happens. I prefer to leave grain out of the mix if I can.

A person asked me earlier today about D76. It is a solvent type developer that is called a fine grained developer. That's because the high amount of Sodium Sulfite eats away at the edges of the grains, making them smaller. They are therefore farther apart and the resulting print will appear more grainy. False advertising at its best.

In my last test I worked with TMax, TMY2, Ilford Delta 100/400 and Efke 25, in about 20 different developers. Using rotary development in the Jobo, Xtol 1:1 was the best developer. (We did not include Pyro because there were so many variants and we already knew Pyro would be excellent. (Those tests will come later this year.) Delta 100 came out on top, by a hair. Both TMax and TMY2 were excellent but more expensive, the Efke was also good but the slower speed made us go back to the Delta. All of these films are excellent. We chose Delta because of its price and because Ilford has made a public commitment to B&W. Acros is a good film as well but we had no idea what Fuji was up to and we were looking for the film we could buy a bunch of going forward.

All of these films have very tight grain and were perfectly sensitive in the sensitivity tests. None of the 400 speed films worked well with the exception of TMY2. There was enough of a difference to dismiss them for our purpose.

One important footnote. In our development methodology the Xtol had a very short range from N-3 to N+2. Where D-23 went from 3:45 to about 14 minutes or so to cover the development range, Xtol's range was from 4 to 7 minutes. When we went over 8 minutes of development, the grain literally exploded. Take care to not overdevelop with Xtol. We used a tight concentration 1:1 vs 1:3 to make sure that developer exhaustion was not a factor and if you don't have this issue you can move to a lesser dilution.

I make no claim that this was a perfect test, or that these results are for everyone. It's just what I found...

Lenny

Hans Berkhout
25-Feb-2013, 07:15
Lenny if you like the grain pattern and tone with your film of choice processed in D23, but not the developing times; why not change dilution and/or temperature so as to arrive at a time you like- anything against that? Apart from being good (for me anyway), D23 is so convenient, easy to mix, cheap.
Always interested in reading your comments,
Hans.

Sal Santamaura
25-Feb-2013, 08:58
...We used a tight concentration 1:1 vs 1:3 to make sure that developer exhaustion was not a factor and if you don't have this issue you can move to a lesser dilution...


Lenny if you like the grain pattern and tone with your film of choice processed in D23, but not the developing times; why not change dilution and/or temperature so as to arrive at a time you like...Lenny will probably jump in and address temperature but, as concerns dilution, exhaustion is a major driver in this situation. D-23 (and D-76, Microdol-X, Perceptol, etc.) require 250 ml of stock solution per 80 square inches of film developed. XTOL needs only 100 ml for the same area, which enables processing more film per run than those others do. This is particularly advantageous with larger sheet formats.

For example, with XTOL at 1+1 (500 ml stock plus 500 ml water), there's enough capacity for 5 8x10 sheets in a 3005 Expert drum. D-23 could only develop 2 sheets at 1+1 while respecting the processor motor's 1 liter rotation limit.

Lenny Eiger
25-Feb-2013, 11:45
Lenny if you like the grain pattern and tone with your film of choice processed in D23, but not the developing times; why not change dilution and/or temperature so as to arrive at a time you like- anything against that? Apart from being good (for me anyway), D23 is so convenient, easy to mix, cheap.
Always interested in reading your comments,
Hans.

Sal and Hans,
Sal is, of course, correct about the reason for the 1:1 vs 1:3. My initial tests with the Jobo and Pyro were a disaster because of developer exhaustion. This was my fault and should not reflect on Pyro at all. It's a very important factor. The idea that you would vary the amt of developer for the amt of film is crazy to me, having been thru this. I now put in the same amt of fluid no matter how many sheets I am developing. I use both the 3005 with 5 sheets of 8x10 and the 3010 with 10 sheets of 4x5.

I used D-23 for many years when I was contact printing 8x10. It is fabulous for that purpose, IMO, smooth and delicious. However, for scanning I wanted tighter, more densely packed grains. The sodium sulfite is too good of a solvent for that.

I have to add that a lot of this depends on who's printing. Some folks like the grainy effect (altho' it looks different on an inkjet printer than it does on a darkroom print). Some people want to print with lots of contrast, shoot with red filters and infrared film. It's all good. Personally, I like a full, very smooth tonal range, like a platinum print. Anyone reading my comments should keep this bias in mind.

Best,

Lenny

geoawelch
26-Feb-2013, 14:15
Wow.

geoawelch
1-Mar-2013, 19:42
Wow.

Wanted to explain this comment so that it is not misconstrued as being underwhelming or sarcastic.

While reading this thread I was struck by Lenny's skill and the quality of his work, especially in the portion of the thread where the three scans were shown.

I also came upon Marty Knapp's endorsement of Lenny's work. Well, let me tell you, that led me to Marty's site, breathtaking images with wonderful words to go with them. I spent over an hour there.

So when I came to the end of the thread, it truly had been a "Wow" experience.

With a fair amount of LF experience, and after a 10+ year hiatus, I am struck not only by the wealth of information on this site during my short time here, but also by the friendliness of the members and discussions conducted in a (usually) cordial manner.

My apologies for hijacking the thread.

perfectedmaya
3-Mar-2013, 23:43
+1

indeed it is great to have people like Lenny who is willing to share his knowledge.. this is a great website

Lenny Eiger
4-Mar-2013, 10:35
+1

indeed it is great to have people like Lenny who is willing to share his knowledge.. this is a great website

Thanks to everyone for their kind words. I think this is a great forum as well, I have learned a lot here, and met some great people.

Lenny

Kirk Gittings
11-Mar-2013, 14:00
I just finally got to opening up that second landscape Lenny. WOW! What always amazes me is how much easier it is to get an expressive print from a top shelf scan-a ton less work.

photodoc
13-Mar-2013, 08:52
I'm sure Lenny will agree that the most important thing in scanning is the human factor. The Heidelberg is a great machine in the right hands, but all too often inexperienced or insensitive people run them more like copiers than tools capable of expression. I find this more in shops where operators come from the press trade rather than custom photo labs. It's a different mind set that's geared for expediency with volume of production and cost being primary considerations over artistry. In some cases it's a valid way to work but not for our purpose.

My point is, don't blame or credit the machines. I've run a hi-end scanning business for decades and I know first hand that good operators make great scans with scanners of all makes, and of course there's nothing better than a real fluid mounted drum scan made on quality equipment whether it's Aztek, Scanview, ICG, or Heidelberg just to name a few that I'm familiar with. In all cases, it's necessary to turn off the intelligence that was programmed into the machine and replace it with human sensitivities.

John Castronovo
Techphoto, llc
Boonton, NJ

Sal Santamaura
14-Jun-2014, 15:38
...One important footnote. In our development methodology the Xtol had a very short range from N-3 to N+2. Where D-23 went from 3:45 to about 14 minutes or so to cover the development range, Xtol's range was from 4 to 7 minutes. When we went over 8 minutes of development, the grain literally exploded...Lenny, you've commented on the time-sensitivity of Delta 100 in XTOL in several threads. This leads to a follow up question.

When developing Delta 100 sheets for scanning rather than wet printing, do you still vary time, i.e. N-3 to N+2? Within reasonable subject brightness range limits, do you think that just developing everything as "N" and adjusting during scanning / file preparation is viable? Or is it still necessary to apply some form of Zone System control during exposure and film development? Thanks in advance for your insight.

Lenny Eiger
14-Jun-2014, 17:36
Lenny, you've commented on the time-sensitivity of Delta 100 in XTOL in several threads. This leads to a follow up question.

When developing Delta 100 sheets for scanning rather than wet printing, do you still vary time, i.e. N-3 to N+2? Within reasonable subject brightness range limits, do you think that just developing everything as "N" and adjusting during scanning / file preparation is viable? Or is it still necessary to apply some form of Zone System control during exposure and film development? Thanks in advance for your insight.

Sal,
It's true that some adjustment is possible with scanning software and photoshop. However, I find that everything works better when the negative is just perfect. It scans easier, it maintains all the tones you had in mind when you took the image. The expressive print is both more possible, and easier to accomplish.

On the low end, you won't have the zone 3 values unless they are exposed for. You aren't going to manufacture detail, no matter what you do. As to the high end, I overdeveloped a series of negs I shot with my Mamiya 7 and there really wasn't anything I could do. I couldn't get rid of the contrast... So, yes, there's a little more wiggle room, but I think it is unquestionably still worth it to apply zone system control. It's easy enough to do... especially for someone as experienced as you.

Lenny

Jim Graves
14-Jun-2014, 21:27
I have commented on this before ... but until you actually watch a skilled scanner like Lenny work, there is no way you can appreciate what they can do ... and how much work and time goes into each scan.

I have an Epson V750 and have become reasonably proficient at using it for negative scans ... that being said ... there is absolutely no comparison to what Lenny does.

I have been fortunate enough to watch Lenny do a scan of a difficult negative with him explaining each step and sampling during the process, to discuss photography and techniques with him (usually over my head) and to visit his studio/home and get a tour of the facilities and equipment ... and his own beautiful photos ... .

All I can say is ... send him a negative ... tell him what you are looking for ... consult with him while he's working on it ... and you will be amazed at what you get.

Kirk Gittings
14-Jun-2014, 22:03
I have commented on this before ... but until you actually watch a skilled scanner like Lenny work, there is no way you can appreciate what they can do ... and how much work and time goes into each scan.

I have an Epson V750 and have become reasonably proficient at using it for negative scans ... that being said ... there is absolutely no comparison to what Lenny does.

I have been fortunate enough to watch Lenny do a scan of a difficult negative with him explaining each step and sampling during the process, to discuss photography and techniques with him (usually over my head) and to visit his studio/home and get a tour of the facilities and equipment ... and his own beautiful photos ... .

All I can say is ... send him a negative ... tell him what you are looking for ... consult with him while he's working on it ... and you will be amazed at what you get.

ditto

Lenny Eiger
15-Jun-2014, 09:35
What a nice Father's Day gift to come here and read this from you guys. You're the best.

Happy Fathers Day to all of you...

Lenny

Bernice Loui
15-Jun-2014, 11:16
Got a chance to visit Lenny some time ago.

This was a VERY worth while time spent, beyond Lenny's skill, art and craft at scanning. There is a wonderful collection of books and images Lenny has created.

Add this to Lenny's willingness to help others in their imaging needs makes him kinda special within the LF community.


:)

Bernice



I have commented on this before ... but until you actually watch a skilled scanner like Lenny work, there is no way you can appreciate what they can do ... and how much work and time goes into each scan.

I have an Epson V750 and have become reasonably proficient at using it for negative scans ... that being said ... there is absolutely no comparison to what Lenny does.

I have been fortunate enough to watch Lenny do a scan of a difficult negative with him explaining each step and sampling during the process, to discuss photography and techniques with him (usually over my head) and to visit his studio/home and get a tour of the facilities and equipment ... and his own beautiful photos ... .

All I can say is ... send him a negative ... tell him what you are looking for ... consult with him while he's working on it ... and you will be amazed at what you get.