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BradS
19-Dec-2012, 16:06
Why even have a feedback section if you're gonna consistently close and delete the feedback?

This is getting crazy. You guys...the moderators....need to chill. You are destroying this forum.

cosmicexplosion
19-Dec-2012, 16:09
That's like saying the Chinese government stop people from talking.

It's simply ----- ------ ----
-------- ------ -- -----

Best
Andrew

BradS
19-Dec-2012, 16:15
It is time for one and maybe two of the moderators to step down before this place is completely ruined.

Ken Lee
19-Dec-2012, 16:28
That was my mistake. I take full credit for that. I have restored the thread. In my haste I didn't see it was in the feedback section.

welly
19-Dec-2012, 16:28
The only problems that occur are in the lounge forum. All the other forum sections run trouble free. I don't recall the last time a thread was locked outside the lounge (although I've not looked recently so could easily have missed some). Possibly some threads in the for sale forum. If you steer clear of the lounge, it's business as usual - some great discussions, wonderful photographs are being shared and fantastic advice for people like myself who don't know what they're doing.

The forum is not being destroyed or ruined, don't be so dramatic!

BradS
19-Dec-2012, 18:55
The forum is not being destroyed or ruined, don't be so dramatic!

ruined as in "you're ruining it for me". Means its no fun anymore. It's lost its shine. It has gone bad. The unpleasantness outweighs any value that there might have been.

You have your perspective and opinion...I have mine. Are you suggesting that mine is less worthy than yours?

welly
19-Dec-2012, 19:01
ruined as in "you're ruining it for me". Means its no fun anymore. It's lost its shine. It has gone bad. The unpleasantness outweighs any value that there might have been.

You have your perspective and opinion...I have mine. Are you suggesting that mine is less worthy than yours?

What? I'm not suggesting anything. You expressed your opinion "You are destroying this forum" and I expressed mine "This forum is not being destroyed". Are you suggesting I'm not allowed to express mine?

BradS
19-Dec-2012, 19:11
What? I'm not suggesting anything. You expressed your opinion "You are destroying this forum" and I expressed mine "This forum is not being destroyed". Are you suggesting I'm not allowed to express mine?

.....


The forum is not being destroyed or ruined...

you've expressed your opinion...fine.


... don't be so dramatic!

You've dismissed mine....

David R Munson
19-Dec-2012, 20:18
It is time for one and maybe two of the moderators to step down before this place is completely ruined.

I've seen forums ruined, and it hasn't been because moderators close threads that are turning shitty and veering away from the focus of the forum. The forums I've seen go bad have done so because of lack of moderation and a small population of the user base becoming dominant yet petulant little pricks who can only stand to have it their way. I've been part of this forum since it was back on greenspun.com and I have no problem with the moderation here. If anything, I think it's been critical in this remaining the interesting, productive community that it has.

rdenney
19-Dec-2012, 20:36
Why even have a feedback section if you're gonna consistently close and delete the feedback?

This is getting crazy. You guys...the moderators....need to chill. You are destroying this forum.

Ken addressed the deletion aspect.

The purpose of the feedback forum is to raise and discuss issues. This one was raised and discussed. I don't think anyone was prevented from expressing themselves fully. In fact, in search of full expression to try and really understand the issue, I was accused of being too persistent. Further discussion was not getting anywhere new. It is beyond me how stopping a discussion that was becoming repetitive and unproductive is destroying the forum.

It was mentioned a little while ago--about the time I was made a moderator--that the mods had gotten a little...brittle, as a result of the banning issue for one popular member and the decision to more actively enforce the guidelines that led to that banning as a means of preventing it from going so far in the future. You'll recall that they agreed. That's one reason I worked so hard to get at what the issues were in the thread I closed--I really wanted to understand it. I think all the issues were aired, but it wasn't easy, and it seemed there was willingness to continue it ad infinitum. So, we have two choices: Close the thread and move on, or leave it open and be accused of ignoring it, which we would have done. I'm not retired and neither are the other mods--there's a limit to how much time we should have to spend just to understand what's behind a complaint. It seemed to me the least destructive to summarize the discussion and then close the thread.

Rick "who could use a little less of the purple prose, too" Denney

polyglot
19-Dec-2012, 20:43
I've seen forums ruined, and it hasn't been because moderators close threads that are turning shitty and veering away from the focus of the forum. The forums I've seen go bad have done so because of lack of moderation and a small population of the user base becoming dominant yet petulant little pricks who can only stand to have it their way. I've been part of this forum since it was back on greenspun.com and I have no problem with the moderation here. If anything, I think it's been critical in this remaining the interesting, productive community that it has.

This. This right here is where LFPF is going, if anything. We don't have over-moderation, we have an excess of opinionated assholes.

rdenney
19-Dec-2012, 20:50
Okay, people. Time to tone it down.

Rick "civility and respect, please" Denney

Eric Rose
19-Dec-2012, 20:57
Remember what your mother said, if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all. ( I just self censored everything I wrote before the last sentence. Taking my own advice.)

Peter Lewin
20-Dec-2012, 16:03
What bothers me here, and in the constantly growing number of threads on the same subject (the moderator's deleting or closing a small number of threads) is that it leaves those of us who believe we are in the "silent majority" stuck. I strongly believe that the vast majority are happy with the forum, appreciate what the moderators are doing, and would just like to get on with the photography discussions. So what are "we" supposed to do? Have everyone who believes the moderators are doing a fine job post something to drown out the relatively few who are feeling suppressed?

Ken Lee
20-Dec-2012, 16:17
The moderators are not oblivious to the trends, and as mentioned before, do not want to spend the bulk of their time policing a very small number of high-maintenance members.

Members who take up too much moderator time will be banned.

Brian Ellis
20-Dec-2012, 18:13
Why even have a feedback section if you're gonna consistently close and delete the feedback?

This is getting crazy. You guys...the moderators....need to chill. You are destroying this forum.

I don't think the forum is being "destroyed" by anyone but it would be a much more enjoyable place, and more in keeping with its purpose of discussing LF photography, if people would quit complaining about the moderators.

BradS
20-Dec-2012, 18:43
....it would be a much more enjoyable place, and more in keeping with its purpose of discussing LF photography, if people would quit complaining about the moderators.

Yes, I agree and I would go further. May I suggest that the place would be much more enjoyable for me if the discussion could be mainly about LF Photography and there were much less squabbling and just generally, much less of the subtle nastiness. It would be wonderful if people would try harder to be nice. Then, the mods would have little to do other than deal with spammers (which, is plenty).


but, OK. I get the message. I will try to keep my opinion to myself from now on.

rdenney
21-Dec-2012, 14:01
Yes, I agree and I would go further. May I suggest that the place would be much more enjoyable for me if the discussion could be mainly about LF Photography and there were much less squabbling and just generally, much less of the subtle nastiness. It would be wonderful if people would try harder to be nice. Then, the mods would have little to do other than deal with spammers (which, is plenty).


but, OK. I get the message. I will try to keep my opinion to myself from now on.

Thank you for your sentiments, and I'm sure everyone agrees with your point.

There's nothing wrong with opinions, but public airings sometimes go awry. Once a point has been made, we can consider it and move on. Let's do that now.

Rick "closing the thread now" Denney