Anybody still using tank & racks?

[Shootar401]

I've been developing my 4x5 in Patterson tanks using the taco method and also with my Mod 54. Recently I started developing my 5x7 in tanks using the steel racks. Talk about easy! I'm seriously thinking of getting some racks to use with 4x5 negs and do away with the taco's and Mod all together. The only downside is that the tanks I use hold a gallon of chemistry. I really need to find some smaller tanks.

[Graybeard]

I've been developing my 4x5 in Patterson tanks using the taco method and also with my Mod 54. Recently I started developing my 5x7 in tanks using the steel racks. Talk about easy! I'm seriously thinking of getting some racks to use with 4x5 negs and do away with the taco's and Mod all together. The only downside is that the tanks I use hold a gallon of chemistry. I really need to find some smaller tanks.

There are plenty of half-gallon tanks available for 4x5 hanger development. Plastic food storage containers of this volume work well too and at less cost.

[Jeff Bannow]

I love racks and tanks - the perfect option for developing 4x5, and cheap and durable as well.

[Tony Lakin]

I use racks and tanks combined with nitrogen burst agitation, perfectly even development, after initial 30 second manual agitation turn on the nitrogen and go and do something else until the negs need moving on through the stop and fix then wash, perfect, simples:)

[jon.oman]

I use the one gallon tanks for 8x10, but I recently bought the film holders for 4x5 and 5x7. My Jobo CPE2 may not last too long.....

[Vaughn]

It is the developing method we teach our students.

[Jim Fitzgerald]

I've been using tanks for my 8x10 for years. I'll be using them or should I say the girlfriend will be using them for her 5x7 soon. I use Pyrocat-HD and mix it from scratch so my developer is cheap. I use gallon tanks.

[BetterSense]

I really liked my tanks, and still have them, but got occasional surge marks maybe 1% of the time. I was working on a Nitrogen burst system but eventually went back to trays which isn't really much different than tanks because you still have to stand in the dark either way. I wish a had a master to teach me; I'll never figure out what I was doing wrong.

[coisasdavida]

I love racks and tanks - the perfect option for developing 4x5, and cheap and durable as well.

I second that. I have both 1-gallon and 2-gallon tanks. I have 8x10 singles, 5x7 doubles and 4x5 quadruple film holders, its a perfect setup.

[Leigh]

I second that. I have both 1-gallon and 2-gallon tanks. I have 8x10 singles, 5x7 doubles and 4x5 quadruple film holders, its a perfect setup.
I do likewise with one-gallon tanks for 8x10 and quad 4x5. Works beautifully. I have larger tanks for washing.

- Leigh

[Roger Cole]

I use the one gallon tanks for 8x10, but I recently bought the film holders for 4x5 and 5x7. My Jobo CPE2 may not last too long.....

Humm. I started with tanks and..what I always heard called hangers but I guess they're the same thing, and moved to a Jobo. I haven't used my deep tanks since.

They work fine but require lots of solution making one shot impractical and they make temperature control difficult. (Although I am tempted to try them again with Diafine.)

[Graybeard]

Humm. I started with tanks and..what I always heard called hangers but I guess they're the same thing, and moved to a Jobo. I haven't used my deep tanks since.

They work fine but require lots of solution making one shot impractical and they make temperature control difficult. (Although I am tempted to try them again with Diafine.)

Temperature control is pretty simple really. Just put the developer tank into a dishpan of water at the control temperature. The large mass of water in the tank and in the dishpan will make temperature changes slow.

I put my tank in a laboratory water bath (surplus on eBay) which holds the temperature automatically.

[Vaughn]

We have 'T' shaped SS tanks for the developer. Holds a liter of developer to cover the four (max) 4x5 hangers. Also have lids for them if one needs to turn the lights on. We also have a water bath that the tanks can fit into to keep them at temperature.

Fairly efficient.

[Roger Cole]

Temperature control is pretty simple really. Just put the developer tank into a dishpan of water at the control temperature. The large mass of water in the tank and in the dishpan will make temperature changes slow.

I put my tank in a laboratory water bath (surplus on eBay) which holds the temperature automatically.

Well, temperature controllers aren't as expensive as they used to be, granted. But they still take a half gallon of developer. If you want to use replenished, that's fine. But no more film than I get to process I really prefer one shot.

[diversey]

I use Kodak half gallon tank (hard rubber) and racks (Kodak 4A) to process my 4x5 films. I am wondering how many films I can develop each time. I usually develop 5 or 6 films each time and feel waste too much developer. Thanks.

[Leigh]

Regardless of the technique/equipment in use, you must always use at least the minimum amount of developer
per sheet as specified by the developer manufacturer.

One "sheet" or one "roll" in this context means one 8x10 sheet of film, or any combination of film that could
be proofed on a single 8x10 sheet of paper, i.e. one 135-36 roll or one 120 roll or four 4x5 sheets.

With high-dilution developers (e.g. Rodinal 1+50) the total volume of liquid in the tank may limit the number
of films you can develop to less than the maximum that the tank can hold.

- Leigh

[Roger Cole]

I understand that Leigh and I think most people do. But when you're using, say, D76 1+1, I'm not sure how many sheets of 4x5 1/2 gallon can develop but I'm reasonably sure it's a lot more than I've ever done in one session.

[Leigh]

... when you're using, say, D76 1+1, I'm not sure how many sheets of 4x5 1/2 gallon can develop...
It's an extraordinarily simple calculation, based on published data for D76. Not rocket science.

- Leigh

[Roger Cole]

It's an extraordinarily simple calculation, based on published data for D76. Not rocket science.

- Leigh

Yep, I realize that. I'll look it up if I ever use the tanks with D76 again. ;)

I wasn't asking, and certainly not saying I didn't know how to find out. I just meant I didn't know offhand but was quite sure it was more than I'd develop in one session. I rarely do more than six sheets (1.5 rolls of 35mm/120 equivalent) and have never done more than 10 (2.5 rolls.)

[SpeedGraphicMan]

The preferred method in my opinion!

[macandal]

Ok, guys, so, where do you find the tanks? Hangers I see on eBay all the time. The stainless steel tanks (what I'm looking for) is what I'm having a hell of a hard time to find. I'm looking the tanks to develop 4x5. I even put a WTB ad on the classifieds:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?96286-WTB-4x5-developing-tanks-(metal)

Let me know if you have any for sale. I'm almost to the point where I'm going to give the BTZS tubes a try. Thanks.

(Sorry to piggy back on this thread. Don't mean to highjack it, but, since it is about the very things I'm looking for, someone here must have some good info.)

[Roger Cole]

I don't know. When I bought mine (which are plastic) in the 90s, I was getting into 4x5 with the help of a friend and former college room mate who ran a commercial lab at the time. Either he found them or I got them from Midwest back in those days. Maybe put a WTB add here in the For Sale/Wanted forum?

[Leigh]

Ok, guys, so, where do you find the tanks?
I get my Arkay stainless steel tanks from B&H. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=arkay+tanks&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&Top+Nav-Search=

If you want tanks strictly for 4x5, look for Arkay numbers beginning with "45-". The 8x10 tanks start with "81-".

You can process 4x5 sheets in an 8x10 tank using special hangers that hold four 4x5 sheets in a 2x2 arrangement.

- Leigh

[macandal]

Maybe put a WTB add here in the For Sale/Wanted forum?I did that:


[...] I even put a WTB ad on the classifieds:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?96286-WTB-4x5-developing-tanks-(metal) [...]

[macandal]

If you want tanks strictly for 4x5, look for Arkay numbers beginning with "45-". The 8x10 tanks start with "81-".
- LeighThanks, Leigh. So, something like this:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/65376-REG/Arkay_600686_45_4_Stainless_Steel_Cut.html

Is that per tank or is this a set of four? I need four. At this rate this would be very expensive. I must be missing something here, because it says the tank above can process 24 sheets at a time, or am I reading that wrong? If it is 24, that's too much. Maybe later I'll have that many to process at one time, but not now. I'm looking for the ones they have at my school. You can process 4, maybe 6, sheets at a time.

Thanks.

[Jeff Bannow]

Thanks, Leigh. So, something like this:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/65376-REG/Arkay_600686_45_4_Stainless_Steel_Cut.html

Is that per tank or is this a set of four? I need four. At this rate this would be very expensive. I must be missing something here, because it says the tank above can process 24 sheets at a time, or am I reading that wrong? If it is 24, that's too much. Maybe later I'll have that many to process at one time, but not now. I'm looking for the ones they have at my school. You can process 4, maybe 6, sheets at a time.

Thanks.

I had a real nice set for sale a few weeks ago, but it's sold now. You might look for a system like that though - holds 4-6 sheets and only used a liter of solution. Plus it's got a water bath to keep the temps stable. Sometimes they pop up on eBay, APUG or here at LFF.

[macandal]

I had a real nice set for sale a few weeks ago, but it's sold now. You might look for a system like that though - holds 4-6 sheets and only used a liter of solution. Plus it's got a water bath to keep the temps stable. Sometimes they pop up on eBay, APUG or here at LFF.Jeff, I know. I almost bought yours. At the time I couldn't decide if I wanted that or a BTZS. The advantage of the BTZS is that I would be able to process my film at home more easily. I don't have a darkroom, so the tubes make sense. However, considering how difficult getting one of the setups like the one you had is becoming, I'm about to throw in the towel and get a BTZS.

[Leigh]

Is that per tank or is this a set of four? I need four.
...it says the tank above can process 24 sheets at a time, or am I reading that wrong?
Yes, they're sold as each, not in sets.

That's correct. Look under Specifications... It says it will hold 24 single-sheet hangers and four quarts of solution.
Take a look at catalog number 45-2. It does 12 sheets in two quarts of solution.

Of course you can always process fewer sheets if you wish, but the volume of solution required remains the same.

- Leigh

[macandal]

Of course you can always process fewer sheets if you wish, but the volume of solution required remains the same.

- LeighThat's exactly what I'm trying to avoid: waste.

[Jeff Bannow]

That's exactly what I'm trying to avoid: waste.

Remember that it isn't really that much waste since all but the developer is reused anyway.

[Leigh]

That's exactly what I'm trying to avoid: waste.
The only item of concern is the developer, since all other solutions are reused to exhaustion anyway.

Use Diafine, a two-part compensating developer that's ideally suited to tray or tank development because it doesn't
care about temperature or agitation. The stock solutions are used without dilution and last indefinitely.

It's replenished simply by replacing the lost volume of Solution A with fresh, and adding that same amount of Solution B to its container. This only amounts to a few tens of ml per session.

- Leigh

[Eric Rose]

it's the only system I use. love it!

[Roger Cole]

I did that:

Duh! Sorry, must have been distracted. :o

[Tim k]

If your a little bit handy, its pretty simple to make your tanks out of plastics.

[Vaughn]

If you have a big tank, put a big block of something in it to reduce the volume.

Vaughn

[jon.oman]

The only item of concern is the developer, since all other solutions are reused to exhaustion anyway.

Use Diafine, a two-part compensating developer that's ideally suited to tray or tank development because it doesn't
care about temperature or agitation. The stock solutions are used without dilution and last indefinitely.

It's replenished simply by replacing the lost volume of Solution A with fresh, and adding that same amount of Solution B to its container. This only amounts to a few tens of ml per session.

- Leigh

I might give that a try!

[ian kraus]

+1 regarding Diafine. Really nice developer that is great for hand processing.

[cyrus]

I find Diafine to be a bit too energetic.

As for avoiding waste, this is my solution: using hangers placed flat in trays, with a bent handle
83037

[cyrus]

I find Diafine to be a bit too energetic, and also no push/pull

As for avoiding waste, this is my solution: using hangers placed flat in trays, with a bent handle
83037

[Kimberly Anderson]

Same here.


It is the developing method we teach our students.

[Kimberly Anderson]

That's actually pretty clever cyrus. I will see if there's a way to incorporate this into our workflow next semester.


I find Diafine to be a bit too energetic.

As for avoiding waste, this is my solution: using hangers placed flat in trays, with a bent handle
83037

[Curt]

I've been using tanks and hangers since the 70's. if you're going to do stand development it's perfect. Myself, I just can't stand or sit on a stool and shuffle through sheets in a tray. It gives me a headache. I have a ss one gallon tank for the 8x10 developer and larger ones, 3.5 gallon for the presoak, rinse, fix, hypo clear, final wash. I'll get some more one day.

For 5x7 I have a couple narrow tanks in a black plastic. It's a different material than the hard rubber.

For hangers I've collected many in each size from 2 1/4, 4x5, 5x7, 8x10 and now 14x17 which I only have four. It all adds up space wise. The nice thing about having a lot of hangers is having dry ones for a long session.

About hangers, I've had negatives come out of them. Specifically the hangers with two wire fold over clips. These are more prone to it in 8x10. I believe they're Carr. The one piece fold over top retainer on the Eastman Kodak hangers don't do it. The small 2 1/4 or 2x3 have very secure clips that hold the film, they are the most secure.

With an easy agitation this doesn't happen. If the music gets loud and fast the tendency to get over active causes problems. Deliberate action with a smooth hand is the key. Developing by inspection convenient, I have a dark green safelight. They are pricey but worth it. I haven't used it in years but I'm going to start up again. Like some others have said I don't dry the negatives in the hangers. I take them out and clip them up by the corner. Smooth even development prevents surge marks.

[RMiksell]

I just started with tanks and hangers back in July. Currently have 1 gallon and 2 gallon SS tanks with hangers for 8x10 and 4x5. Currently using Xtol seasoned with even development and consistent results, including push processing Ilford HP5 and TMax TMY. As long as you have a dark room (I use my garage) I think it's pretty foolproof. I'd like to start processing C-41 at home too, just not sure what kind of results I'll get without nitrogen burst agitation. I'm also trying to figure out what the best developer would be for 1 gallon tanks and where to get it. Looking at getting flexicolor though the startup costs are a bit high.

[Leigh]

I find Diafine to be a bit too energetic
You're over-agitating. Diafine is a compensating developer. It wants very little agitation.

- Leigh

[chy]

With all this talk about tanks and racks, I thought I'd bring to attention this listing on Craigslist in Rhode Island :

http://providence.craigslist.org/pho/3359083096.html

I have no connection at all with the lister, I just happened to notice it.

[Roger Thoms]

I've been using tanks for my 8x10 for years. I'll be using them or should I say the girlfriend will be using them for her 5x7 soon. I use Pyrocat-HD and mix it from scratch so my developer is cheap. I use gallon tanks.

Jim, so Leigh has been hanging out with me and my LF cameras for 15 years and never wanted a big camera. Now one weekend in the Redwoods with you guys and she decides that a 5x7 would be nice, and that contact printing would be fun. So I had to chuckle when I saw your girl friend has a 5x7. Anyway found a super clean B & J 5x7 for her and have holders on the way. Now despite Leigh's degree in chemistry I'm sure I'll be processing her film. Probably in tubes, since that's how I process the rest of my film.

Roger

[Vaughn]

She'll have fun with it! It is a good size for contact printing, a nice size for a hand-held print.

I have a 5x7 kit ready to be used (Eastman View No.2)...waiting for the time/place when the 8x10 is too big (heavy), but the 4x5 is too small (tiny), and too far from the van for the 11x14! The 5x7 is for wandering that bit further or just more casually, camera on the tripod and over the shoulder...and the holders and meter in a shoulder bag. I spent a day and wandered around in the redwoods that way...nice, but one does worry about the camera hanging out there. The trade off is having the camera set up and ready to go all the time. I put the darkcloth over the camera then a waterproof stuff sack. Keeps it dry and keeps the bellows from being snagged by anything.

I have been putting my 5x7's in the Jobo Expert 3005 drum (on a motor base). Sweet.

[Curt]

Roger I have a Kodak 2D 5x7 with matching extension rail. When I bought it someone had replaced the bellows with a new one. Anyway, it's actually easier to use than my 4x5 Shen Hao because the controls are not crammed together. I really enjoy using it. Like Vaughn said the print size is nice for viewing. The film is also not bad on the budget. A day after Katria I flew to Huston and drove out to Galviston. I carried on my 5x7 with holders, film, lenses, and accessories in a computer Rolling case. It easily fits in the overhead.

Out in the redwoods I missed not having it with me for some detail shots. Jim, I'm thinking of the group of mushrooms at Prairie Creek. That would have been incredible on a 5x7 being a tight group of small size.

So Roger Leigh is correct, it's just the right size for her. I hope we can get together again, it was a really great time.

I develop them in tanks too like the 4x5 and 8x10's. It's a lot of tanks and hangers!

[Jim Fitzgerald]

Roger, yes I got June a B&J 5x7 that is in great shape. It has the extension rail and even came with a lens. A Conley triple convertible. The 5x7 contact print is a nice size and I'm sure I will be developing the negatives for her but I've got the hangers for 5x7 as well. I'll have her up to speed as a carbon printer soon.

Curt, I can see those mushrooms on my 8x10 GG. Next time we need to hit the Skunk Trail. Mushroom city my friend!

[Curt]

Oh yeah, an 8x10 or larger, in close and fill the screen. What an experience! Yes, next time!