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View Full Version : Schneider Symmar XL 150mm f5.6 VS Nikor SW 150 f8



NATURELOVER
18-Oct-2012, 10:08
Which lens will produce the best/sharpest image result for landscape work on my 8x10? Any others to consider? Experience matters.

E. von Hoegh
18-Oct-2012, 10:10
Take the same photograph with each lens and you probably won't be able to tell which is which.

There may, however, be differences in the image circle.

John NYC
18-Oct-2012, 10:20
I owned a 150mm XL. It is a fabulous lens, but the focal length was too wide for me on 8x10. There is significant falloff on this lens. Sometimes that look is really great. For times that it's not, you will need a center filter. The center filter is very expensive also, as is the lens. I owned the center filter, and I picked and chose the times that I would use it. Sometimes I actually liked the look of the falloff.

I have no experience with the Nikkor.

Daniel Stone
18-Oct-2012, 10:22
Having a 5.6 maximum aperture can be beneficial if focusing in fading light.

The 150SSXL is a wonderful lens IMO. I don't own one(yet, still saving), but have used one that belongs to a friend, and have been floored by the resolution it brings to the table.

Dan

premortho
18-Oct-2012, 10:27
Yeah right. It's a stop faster. And sometimes that's the whole ballgame.

Drew Wiley
18-Oct-2012, 10:28
Accuracy of film plane is often a bigger variable for sharpness than specific lens choice.
And at 150 (a very short focal length for this format) you need the film to stay flat in the holder. I don't own that Super Symmar XL, but have peeped through a groundglass with
one attached. It's pretty impressive.

Eric Leppanen
18-Oct-2012, 10:30
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?35234-Nikkor-150mm-F8-SW-Lens-Opinions-Comments

NATURELOVER
18-Oct-2012, 11:10
Great comments. I have the Nikor SW 150 and am pleased with its performance when enlarged 7x-just not overly thrilled. I use it on a Deardorff and have to tighten the knobs down tight. I don't think about the lens being balanced when I am attempting to attach it to the camera standing in 2 feet of water.

I don't notice any falloff with the Nikor.

Thanks for the input. :cool:

ckeith
18-Oct-2012, 13:21
I used to have the Nikon SW 150 and replaced it with a 150SSXL, I can not tell a difference in image quality. The Nikon was hard to focus in the dark woods of Washington compared to the 150SSXL.

The primary issue I had with it was size and weight. My 8x10 camera used Toyo lens boards and the Nikon needed a big 158mm x 158mm board while all my other lenses fit in the smaller 110mm x 110mm boards. It ended up taking up to much rood in my pack and with the lens board weighed ~1 lb more than the 150SSXL.

Both have light fall off that is most noticeable in blue sky with color film. I carry 5 lenses from 150mm to 600mm with my 8x10 and use it for ~20% of my photos.

Keith

Balazs Szabo
17-Feb-2021, 08:29
I'd love to get my hands on either one of these.
does the nikkor not need centre filter?

Dan Fromm
17-Feb-2021, 08:38
I'd love to get my hands on either one of these.
does the nikkor not need centre filter?

The Nikkor requires a center filter, as do all lenses that cover 106 degrees. On 8x10, unshifted, with a 150 mm lens the corners will be 2 stops down from the center. They'll be farther down if the lens is moved off center.

Nikon didn't make center filters. Schneider's CF IVa will do, so will Heliopan's 95mm ND Center Filter 3X. For more information see http://www.galerie-photo.com/center-filters-for-large-format-lenses.html

Neal Chaves
17-Feb-2021, 09:19
http://www.galerie-photo.com/center-filters-for-large-format-lenses.html[/url]

Most 95mm filters (even Nikon brand) will contact the front element of the 150mm Nikkor SW and mar the coating. The only filter series I have found that are safe are the now discontinued B+W Series E. A step-up ring to 105mm is probably the best move. Lots of inexpensive filters are available in that size.

Dan Fromm
17-Feb-2021, 11:09
Most 95mm filters (even Nikon brand) will contact the front element of the 150mm Nikkor SW and mar the coating. The only filter series I have found that are safe are the now discontinued B+W Series E. A step-up ring to 105mm is probably the best move. Lots of inexpensive filters are available in that size.

Good point, Neal, but are there inexpensive 105 mm center filters?

Armin Seeholzer
17-Feb-2021, 11:36
The Nikkor requires a center filter, as do all lenses that cover 106 degrees. On 8x10, unshifted, with a 150 mm lens the corners will be 2 stops down from the center. They'll be farther down if the lens is moved off center.

[/url]
If one needs a center filter is a very personal thing in my opinion. I use my 120mm SW f8 Nikkor on my 8x10 without a center filter. It's a matter of personal taste my 2 cts.

Drew Wiley
17-Feb-2021, 11:53
They ideally need center filters. Just depends on how you feel about falloff and if your film has enough latitude left to correct for it when printing, if needed. Color transparency film would be a different story. Nikon does not make their own CF's, so you'd have to use one made by someone else.

mhayashi
18-Feb-2021, 07:52
Like the answers above mentioned already,
Ben Horn answers your question in the page below.
https://www.benhorne.com/cameras-and-lenses
I have SSXL 150, but not nikkor sw 150.
Just for a different point of view apart from 8x10, I love the look of the pictures taken with SSXL wide open at f5.6 in 4x5 and even 5x7.
You can’t do the same thing with the slower nikkor f8.

Heroique
18-Feb-2021, 09:07
…Like the answers above mentioned already, Ben Horn answers your question…

Thanks for the nice link, mhayashi. It’s a long “Lenses in my kit” article, so here’s the relevant section for anyone short on time:


“When I researched wide angle lenses for 8x10,” Ben Horne says, “there were two lenses that caught my attention, The Nikkor-SW 150mm f/8, and the Schneider Super-Symmar XL 150 f/5.6. …I decided to go with the Nikkor because it does not require the use of a center filter. Both lenses will show a soft vignette even when stopped down, but it is very minor and correctable on the Nikkor — even when shooting with slide film. The Schneider will require an expensive center filter that eats up the difference in light gathering ability. You can't go wrong either way, but I prefer not having to use a center filter…”

I’d enjoy hearing more about your SSXL 150mm images taken at f/5.6 on 4x5 or 5x7 – the imagery you say the Nikkor f/8 can’t do. Better, if you have a scanner, seeing the images would be great.

Ari
18-Feb-2021, 09:39
I use the 150XL on 8x10 and never use the centre filter.
I like the fall-off, and even emphasize it in many of the photos I take with the lens.

https://live.staticflickr.com/5568/14913147085_7cc941f4eb_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oHPM4B)

Bernice Loui
18-Feb-2021, 09:46
Having owned and used the 150mm f8 SW Nikkor & 155mm f6.8 Rodenstock Grandagon in the past (late 80's to 90's) petered the 8x10 images from the Grandagon. Yet both could benefit from a center filter if color transparency film is involved.

Previous post regarding light fall off on color transparency film with the 155mm Grandagon. Scroll down to post# 40.
https://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?112376-21cm-lens-that-covers-8x10-format/page4&highlight=200mm+grandagon

Both these lenses are not small.

The 155mm Grandagon got replaced with a 150mm SSXL for 5x7 _ 13x18cm. This essentially cured the light fall off issue mostly good and done.
Regardless, the 150mm SSXL is GOOD and like all tools like this each has it's trade-offs of bad and good.

The other lens in this set would be the 165mm f8 Super Angulon, it is also not small and similar to the 150mm f8 SW nikkor, 155mm f6.8 Grandagon.

As a category, these are the "modern" wide angle choices for 8x10.


Bernice





Thanks for the nice link, mhayashi. It’s a long “Lenses in my kit” article, so here’s the relevant section for anyone short on time:


“When I researched wide angle lenses for 8x10,” Ben Horne says, “there were two lenses that caught my attention, The Nikkor-SW 150mm f/8, and the Schneider Super-Symmar XL 150 f/5.6. …I decided to go with the Nikkor because it does not require the use of a center filter. Both lenses will show a soft vignette even when stopped down, but it is very minor and correctable on the Nikkor — even when shooting with slide film. The Schneider will require an expensive center filter that eats up the difference in light gathering ability. You can't go wrong either way, but I prefer not having to use a center filter…”

I’d enjoy hearing more about your SSXL 150mm images taken at f/5.6 on 4x5 or 5x7 – the imagery you say the Nikkor f/8 can’t do. Better, if you have a scanner, seeing the images would be great.

Neal Chaves
18-Feb-2021, 10:32
Good point, Neal, but are there inexpensive 105 mm center filters?

I recently sold my Nikkor to another member, but what did with filters (never felt the need for a center filter) was to add them over the Series E B+W. I never saw any vignetting, but I didn't employ much lens displacement. I like the combination of a yellow or red with a polarizer. I had a B+W Series E polarlizer witch I would mount directly to the lens and then use a Hoya or some other brand of yellow or red on the outside. Seemed to work well. Maybe this could be done with a center filter that would otherwise damage the front element.

Carl J
18-Feb-2021, 10:47
I use the 150XL on 8x10 and never use the centre filter.
I like the fall-off, and even emphasize it in many of the photos I take with the lens.

https://live.staticflickr.com/5568/14913147085_7cc941f4eb_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oHPM4B)


+1 I would also echo the Nikkor 150 SW is fine without the center filter (I don't shoot color 8x10 but I don't think it would deter me if I did). Seems as much a matter of which one you can actually acquire since they're not exactly common. The added bulk of the Nikkor is a factor -- takes up a lot of room in the bag with the lens board -- but just plan accordingly. Interesting perspective on the use of the 150mm SSXL on 4x5 and 5x7 where the smaller size, wider max aperture, and image quality (subjectively speaking), could tip the scales.

hiend61
6-Mar-2021, 14:34
Most 95mm filters (even Nikon brand) will contact the front element of the 150mm Nikkor SW and mar the coating. The only filter series I have found that are safe are the now discontinued B+W Series E. A step-up ring to 105mm is probably the best move. Lots of inexpensive filters are available in that size.

Donīt worry, Schneider Center filters IVa, IVb and Heliopan 95mm center filters will not mark the front lens coating of the Nikkor SW 150/5,6. They are as safe as the discontinued B+W EW series.