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Kirk Gittings
2-May-2012, 10:48
I'm going to have access to one of these (not sure if its a 2 or 3) while I am in Chicago teaching my class for 6 weeks and want to get some serious scanning done. I have worked with one of these with a good technician looking over my shoulder but that was a couple of years ago. This time I will be completely on my own. Any tips?

sanking
3-May-2012, 06:26
I'm going to have access to one of these (not sure if its a 2 or 3) while I am in Chicago teaching my class for 6 weeks and want to get some serious scanning done. I have worked with one of these with a good technician looking over my shoulder but that was a couple of years ago. This time I will be completely on my own. Any tips?

If you have not already done so get a copy of the instruction manual for the oXYgen scanning software and read through it to familiarize yourself with the basic operations. oXYgen is similar to the software for the Jazz, but more powerful because it allows DT (high bit) saves. The institution where the scanner is housed probably has the manual on a .pdf file.

You might also consider fluid mounting your negatives. It is super easy to fluid mount on a flat bed scanner and there are a number of tutorials you can read about this. All you need is some Kami fluid, a pack of think mylar, and some tape (blue masking tape works well for this). You don't have to worry about focus point with the IQSmart scanners as with Epsons because there is automatic focus.

The maximum optical resolution of the IQSmart 3 is about 5500 dpi but you probably don't need to scan at more than 4000 dpi to pull all of the information out of a 4X5 negative.

Have fun, and turn your cell phone off when scanning!!

Sandy

Brian K
3-May-2012, 09:01
Kirk what kind of scans are you doing? Gray or color?

Kirk Gittings
3-May-2012, 09:05
Thanks all.

All b&w some from color neg originals.

Whats the deal with the cell phone?

sanking
3-May-2012, 10:08
Whats the deal with the cell phone?

Oh, that is just so you can concentrate on the creative aspects of scanning and avoid those irritating calls from forum members

Sandy

Kirk Gittings
3-May-2012, 10:11
OK I get it. I thought maybe it interfered with some cosmic aura surrounding the machine.:)

Brian K
3-May-2012, 11:26
Kirk, I'm not sure if you're going to scan in the DT mode or scan for a specific output. I scan specifically for output. If you are doing B&W I have found that the best B&W results with the least fuss is to scan 16bit RGB positive using the Tri-Gray input. It still uses all 3 colors to produce what appears to the eye as gray and will appear as a negative which you'll need to invert. I also find that I get a better result when I keep the tonal range between 5 and 250, and when I'm outputting LVT's between 5 and 240 (highlights).

Wet mounting will make a huge difference when it comes to sharpness, scratches and grain. Make sure though that the scanner does not have the AR glass on it as the mounting fluid can damage it. The way you can tell is that the AR glass has a coating, and the regular AN glass, which you can use for wet mounting, has that fine etched surface. If it's an IQ 2 it most likely has the regular AN glass.

Good luck with it.

Kirk Gittings
3-May-2012, 13:51
Thanks Brian. How do you personally deal with capture sharpening?

Brian K
3-May-2012, 17:28
Thanks Brian. How do you personally deal with capture sharpening?

I sharpen as little as possible during the scan. Off the top of my head I use red channel and the lowest custom settings, almost none at all. I do not use the presets as I find they over sharpen. Of course it all depends on how high a res you are working.

George Pappas
8-May-2012, 10:25
Kirk,

I second Brian's and Sandy's comments. I have an IQsmart 2; it is a terrific scanner and produces great files. I find that an additional benefit of scanning B&W using the OxyGen's RGB mode is that I have better control of the Black/White endpoints compared to the B&W mode. This is critical in getting the maximum tonality out of the negative and into the file. Fluid mounting is very easy with this machine - it was clearly designed for it. Make sure you set all of your configurations, with Oxy sharpening off, as a preset. The software has a habit of reverting to a default pre-set with scanner sharpening enabled. I agree with Brian that the scanner sharpening is overdone - my guess is that it was probably designed for newsprint/graphic applications.

Have a blast...it is a great machine.

George

Kirk Gittings
8-May-2012, 11:21
Thanks all. Any specific tips with Pyro negatives? Most of what I will be scanning are those. Specificaaly the brownish ones from Pyrocat HD?

sanking
8-May-2012, 16:06
Thanks all. Any specific tips with Pyro negatives? Most of what I will be scanning are those. Specificaaly the brownish ones from Pyrocat HD?

Scan pyro negatives in RGB. Before converting to B&W have a look at the RGB channels to see if one is sharper or has better grain than the other. If the difference is small, as it usually is with Eversmart and IQ scanners, just proceed to changing the image to B&W with the PS converter. You can adjust grain and contrast quite a bit this point depending on how you plus or minus the various sliders.

Sandy

Kirk Gittings
8-May-2012, 16:45
Cool. Thanks Sandy.

Brian K
8-May-2012, 19:18
Kirk,

I second Brian's and Sandy's comments. I have an IQsmart 2; it is a terrific scanner and produces great files. I find that an additional benefit of scanning B&W using the OxyGen's RGB mode is that I have better control of the Black/White endpoints compared to the B&W mode. This is critical in getting the maximum tonality out of the negative and into the file. Fluid mounting is very easy with this machine - it was clearly designed for it. Make sure you set all of your configurations, with Oxy sharpening off, as a preset. The software has a habit of reverting to a default pre-set with scanner sharpening enabled. I agree with Brian that the scanner sharpening is overdone - my guess is that it was probably designed for newsprint/graphic applications.

Have a blast...it is a great machine.

George

George I scan in RGB but use the Tri-Gray as the input profile. I found that when I scanned in RGB and used the standard RGB input profile, the differences between the red, green and blue channels were huge and it was tough to adjust each of them to a satisfactory level. I think, and I may be wrong, that the Tri-gray input profile (and BTW I save the file using the SRGB output profile) uses all 3 color channels and balances them into an RGB grayscale image. Is this correct as far as you know?

George Pappas
13-May-2012, 10:20
Hi Brian,

sorry for the delay in responding..I have been offline for a bit... I haven't used the tri-gray input profile before so am not sure how it works in practice. What I do know is that scanning B&W using RGB Positive mode with IqSmart gives me more controls for setting endpoints & gradation than IQsmart's B&W mode. When I examine the R/G/B channels after scanning, I don't usually see the kind of difference you are describing. This applies to file developed in "conventional" developers and film developed in Pyro developers - I have plenty of both.

What I care about is capturing the maximum information that the negative has to give; that is why I like the endpoint controls in IQsmart's color mode so much - they let me get all of it more easily than B&W mode controls. I will have to take a look the tri-gray input profile you are describing..I"ll let you know what I find. I love the scanner and find that it is the best of all tradeoffs for me; however, the scanning software, while powerful, was designed for pre-press production rather than smaller-scale use and requires some effort to figure out...

John Brady
14-May-2012, 05:11
This scanner requires lots of independent learning since there seems to be so few of them around. I have an IQ2 that I bought new about four years ago.

When scanning color negs or chromes for final grayscale output, I like making the scan as color and then convert to grayscale using b&w conversion in photoshop where I have more control.

I agree with others that say to use limited sharpening. I use 1,2,2 and 5,6 for smoothing. It is critical that you do some in scanner sharpening and then final sharpening in photoshop.

Do any of you have input profiles for different films for Creo? I have been unable to find any.

This is a great scanner, but after many hundreds of scans I feel like I am still learning.

www.timeandlight.com

Kirk Gittings
29-Jun-2012, 08:33
So this is an IQsmart 3. On the whole a very capable quality machine. But surprisingly slow for a machine designed for comercial applications. One hour for a 4800 SPI for a 4x5? It took me maybe a day to get adequate knowledge of the software. It seems to work well but some quirky design issues like on the histogram where you set your endpoints. Why are the sliders at the top of the graph instead of at the bottom where they properly are on most software? Odd. The biggest drawback vs. a high end drum scan seems to be in scanning dense negatives where I think a good drum scan pulls better detail and separation.

Anyway, I ve been cranking through these supplementing my income via saved money for outsourced scans. Setup 6 at a pop and go for a long walk, lunch, a movie and a nap-come back and wah lah! Great High res scans. Love how Pyrocat negs scan on this puppy. Sweet.

sanking
29-Jun-2012, 08:55
Kirk,

The software I use with the Eversmart Pro is quite similar to what you are using with the IQ3 and I also find it a bit quirky. Part of the issue is that the original design was done back in the day when scanners did most of the final work on the pre-scan itself as the assumption the Scitex/Creo software was better than Photoshop. Another issue I dislike about the software is that you have to re-set the sharpening for every scan as it always resets to a certain default setting.

However, nothing especially slow about the scan time. Scanning a 4X5 sheet of film at 4000 spi also takes about an hour with a Howtek D4000/D4800.

Sandy





So this is an IQsmart 3. On the whole a very capable quality machine. But surprisingly slow for a machine designed for comercial applications. One hour for a 4800 SPI for a 4x5? It took me maybe a day to get adequate knowledge of the software. It seems to work well but some quirky design issues like on the histogram where you set your endpoints. Why are the sliders at the top of the graph instead of at the bottom where they properly are on most software? Odd. The biggest drawback vs. a high end drum scan seems to be in scanning dense negatives where I think a good drum scan pulls better detail and separation.

Anyway, I ve been cranking through these supplementing my income via saved money for outsourced scans. Setup 6 at a pop and go for a long walk, lunch, a movie and a nap-come back and wah lah! Great High res scans. Love how Pyrocat negs scan on this puppy. Sweet.

Kirk Gittings
29-Jun-2012, 09:24
Yes the damn reset to default sharpening! That has cost me a few rescans as I forgot to check it! The first day it was three times!

Brian K
29-Jun-2012, 10:08
Yes the damn reset to default sharpening! That has cost me a few rescans as I forgot to check it! The first day it was three times!

Kirk you can save your sharpening setting, then save the overall parameters, like trans or ref, rgb 16 bit AND your own sharpness default.

Kirk Gittings
29-Jun-2012, 10:41
Thanks Brian. I will check that out for the next batch.

George Pappas
29-Jun-2012, 13:18
Kirk,

You definitely need to set up your own presets with sharpening, etc.... to avoid the unwanted sharpening on scans. I have done this and still make the mistake of not selecting the preset. Glad you are enjoying the machine - I think they are terrific. The software is definitely quirky; it was design for a different world and primarily for pre-press.

MisterPrinter
3-Jul-2012, 01:34
You can scan in DT (digital transparency) mode, that removes a lot of options and just captures everything the scanner can see. Afterwards, rename it as a TIFF and open it with Photoshop to adjust levels and curves. Photoshop might give you a warning that it has thrown away some data, I don't know what it is but it doesn't seem important.

If you are using ancient PS7 or 8 there is a DT plugin.

Kirk Gittings
3-Jul-2012, 06:23
Thanks but long since finished.

mob81
11-Jul-2012, 05:03
I had my iQsamrt2 for few months now and I really enjoyed the quality of the scans I get from it. however, I know there is much room to improve.
I just want to know why when I make a scan with no output profile the final scans comes much dull or less contrast and saturation than the Preview scan once I made the editing I do to it! and when I pick an output profile I can't use the LS curves or any of the color correction tools on Oxgyn software? any help here will be much appreciated

I tape my film frames above the Mask but want to know from other if it's the optimum setting to keep it this way or which is better (Lazy to do testing) ;)

Regards,
Mohammed

mob81
30-Aug-2012, 03:17
I tested a 6x7 negative and slide and 35mm slide above and below the mask (taped) and couldn't notice a different between them! But taping the film above the mask was easier and faster for me.

I still can't get the LS curves and color correction to work with me!!! It asks me to save and when I name it and save it tells me error and I'm forced to cancel the adjustment! Any help here would be appreciated

mob81
4-Nov-2012, 02:51
To update this post, I learned that LS Curves and color correction will only work on 8-Bit mode! so as I scan 16-Bit I don't use LS-Curve or any other than the end Points.

sanking
4-Nov-2012, 19:34
I tested a 6x7 negative and slide and 35mm slide above and below the mask (taped) and couldn't notice a different between them! But taping the film above the mask was easier and faster for me.



The IQ Smart has an auto-focus system so taping the negative or slide to the top of the mask, or placing it on the glass, should not make any difference in terms of image quality. However, if you allow the slide to contact the glass bed you may get Newton rings. For this reason Scitex/Creo/Kodak instructions for scanning with a mask call for taping negatives and unmounted transparencies to the top of the mask.

Sandy

mob81
4-Nov-2012, 23:45
The IQ Smart has an auto-focus system so taping the negative or slide to the top of the mask, or placing it on the glass, should not make any difference in terms of image quality. However, if you allow the slide to contact the glass bed you may get Newton rings. For this reason Scitex/Creo/Kodak instructions for scanning with a mask call for taping negatives and unmounted transparencies to the top of the mask.

Sandy

Dear Sandy,
I scanned 100s of medium format slides with direct mount without a mask (Now I made 6x6 mask along the 6x7 that came with the scanner) and didn't find any newton rings on any of them (IIRC the bottom glass is not ANR on the iQsmart2 and the upper Glass is).

Maybe I got lucky :) ..... anyway, I use the masks now mostly to avoid flare (I had it on 2 scans so far).

sanking
5-Nov-2012, 09:03
Dear Sandy,
I scanned 100s of medium format slides with direct mount without a mask (Now I made 6x6 mask along the 6x7 that came with the scanner) and didn't find any newton rings on any of them (IIRC the bottom glass is not ANR on the iQsmart2 and the upper Glass is).

Maybe I got lucky :) ..... anyway, I use the masks now mostly to avoid flare (I had it on 2 scans so far).

The Eversmart scanners have the same configuration, Anti-Newton ring glass on the top, non ANR glass (but coated) on the bottom. Normally scans are made with the emulsion side of the film facing down, toward the CCD. If the negative or mounted transparency is placed on top of the mask the AN glass on the top should contact the base (shiny) side of the film and hold it flat, but the mask keeps the film it from touching the base glass.

In practice you can usually get good scans with no Newton rings by just placing the negative or transparency emulsion side down on the base glass. But you may get the Newton rings with films that that have a shiny emulsion side.

Sandy

mob81
5-Nov-2012, 23:26
Dear Sandy,
Thank you. I actually use Masks now as I don't want to risk rescanning (Even though I actually enjoy scanning) but time is really tight as work and family prevent me from really enjoy scanning as I used to :) .

I usually scan and edit the photos few days later (sometimes weeks) and I noticed some flare on two scans (I didn'r bother rescan them), but to avoid the issue, I use masks now. If I find Newton rings I will have to rescan as I really hate those ugly rings.

I ordered the oil mount station and masks (with new base Glass) and waiting to use it once it arrive. I have many negative (Color) that was ruined from the Lab and Very old negatives that would benefit from oil mounting (At least I hope so).

Thanks again.

mob81
8-Nov-2012, 12:56
I just received the oil mounting station. WOW that thing is huge metal piece of art :) :)

I need to find a solution regarding place it above a light table as my small light table won't stand this abuse ;)

I'm a bit nervous using the fluid mount, but I'll try it sooner than later.


Sandy, Brian K and other creo/Kodak users why not creat a thread exchange ideas, tips, workflow...etc. like the screen cezanne users? Just thinking out loud

mob81
11-Nov-2012, 09:08
I just did my first fluid scan and it was disaster. If someone has tips to success in fluid scanning, please share them here.

sanking
11-Nov-2012, 09:19
I just did my first fluid scan and it was disaster. If someone has tips to success in fluid scanning, please share them here.

Have a look at this fluid mounting demonstration by Aztek.

http://www.aztek.com/KAMI_FAQ.html

The fundamentals can be applied to fluid mounting with any flatbed scanner.

Once you have done this right a few times you will be amazed at how simple it is to fluid mount on a flatbed scanner.

Sandy

mob81
11-Nov-2012, 10:38
Have a look at this fluid mounting demonstration by Aztek.

http://www.aztek.com/KAMI_FAQ.html

The fundamentals can be applied to fluid mounting with any flatbed scanner.

Once you have done this right a few times you will be amazed at how simple it is to fluid mount on a flatbed scanner.

Sandy

Dear sandy,
I really hope so, I just hated the mess it created. I'll try later with less film (1-2 frames of 6x6)

mob81
15-Nov-2012, 04:44
Second Try is much better and better controlled oil on Glass... Mainly I see smoother image and not sharper, which is also good as enlarging 35mm film was problematic of Portra 400 for me. Even with Ektar 35mm, it's smoother.

PhotoToyo
20-Nov-2012, 16:19
I ordered the oil mount station and masks (with new base Glass) and waiting to use it once it arrive.

From where did you order your oil mounting station?

mob81
20-Nov-2012, 21:02
From where did you order your oil mounting station?

From Ryan newton.