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Terry Hull
2-Jan-2012, 10:59
I have decided to try and tone some fiber prints that were made in the 1955-85 time period. I have never toned prints B4.

Questions:

1. Can old prints be rewashed and toned?
2. What is a basic sepia (or other) toner I can use for small prints (up to 8X10) ?
3. My goal is to make the prints look older.

Thanks

tedw6
2-Jan-2012, 17:47
I really like sepia/brown toned prints. My favorite combination is Adox MCC glossy with Agfa Viradon. This is a polysulfide toner so use it outdoors. You can buy the toner at Freestyle (http://www.freestylephoto.biz) or at B&H. The result is a cold brown tone. It is a direct toner so all you have to do is wash the prints well. I usually wash, then use a hypoclearing agent such as permawash, then I wash again and take the prints outside in a tray. Tone prints individually for 2-10 minutes.

This toner works well on many papers. On warm tone papers, Viradon gives a reddish-brown tone. My choice for warmtone papers and I usually use Oriental WT is Berg selenium toner. Very easy to use direct toner and I don't have to outside.

I am about to try mixing my own toner with liver of sulfur (potassium polysulfide) obtained from the photographers formulary.

If you are serious about exploring toning, Tim Rudmann's book is a must.

Good luck.
Ted

Peter De Smidt
2-Jan-2012, 19:42
I agree with Ted. Dr. Rudmann's book on toning, http://www.timrudman.com/content/toning-book-reprint, is outstanding.

If prints haven't been toned, then yes they can be washed and toned now. Sometimes, though, this changes density a bit. Many sepia toners are a bleach and re-develop deal, and many are really stinky, as they produce hydrogen sulfide gas. There might be some thiourea toners worth looking into. These wouldn't smell near as bad.

Allen in Montreal
2-Jan-2012, 21:04
Thanks for the tip Peter and Ted,


The prices, and shipping charges on Amazon are insane for this book.
25 British pounds a copy but min order is 100 pounds, anybody want to jump in on a group buy of 4 books?
Terry, you in?

Allen

Peter De Smidt
2-Jan-2012, 21:25
See:http://www.masterphotographerstoningbook.com/content/buy-the-book

No minimum order is required for the book.

The price is much less than used copies of the first printing are going for.

Roger Cole
2-Jan-2012, 22:28
I like the Freestyle store brand of Kodak Brown Toner. I'm not sure if something similar is offered in the UK. Kodak only sells the original in "lifetime supply" gallon sizes for $300 or so but I can get Freestyle's version in the US for $15 for 8 oz. I find it easier to control than bleach and redevelop sepia toners. Those are fine if you're toning to completion. Some people get excellent results with partial bleaching but it takes more trial and error. For the brown toner I do what Drew Wiley suggested to me and dilute 1/4 the strength the bottle says - 1/4 oz in a quart of water. Then I tone very quickly, about 20 seconds, and then dump into a water tray to rinse. Don't stop to let the print drain or it will be uneven. Toning continues a while in the water so it's better to tone less rather than more. If it isn't toned enough, back into the toner and repeat for 15-20 seconds. This works extremely well with Ilford MGWT.

All the sulfide type toners smell bad and the fumes can fog paper and film. I do it indoors but outside the darkroom (on another table outside the darkroom but in the basement where it is) and have never had a problem.

One point - the working solution has a very limited shelf life once diluted. It works, but much more slowly, the next day. Using this 1/4 strength dilution is cheap enough; just dump it and mix fresh each time.

I've not tried Viaradon or the other brown/sepia toners. My experience is limited to bleach and redevelop sepia, single solution brown, and selenium. Selenium is probably not what you want to make the prints look "older."

There are a few examples of brown toner toned prints on my Flickr page. One, of an old abandoned store, is very lightly toned. The time is misleading - this was before I realized the stuff was near dead the second day, but I still toned until I got the subtle brown I was looking for. The other two (shot on MF not LF) are toned in fresh toner 1/4 strength toner. Since they aren't LF I'll just link and not embed:

Old store very lightly toned:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rogercole/6145991412/

New Orleans Courtyard and one of my fiance both shot on 6x6 MF, toned in (very freshly diluted) 1/4 strength brown toner for 40 seconds:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rogercole/6421965615/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rogercole/6429895995/
My fiance Alicia (al

Allen in Montreal
3-Jan-2012, 06:12
See:http://www.masterphotographerstoningbook.com/content/buy-the-book

No minimum order is required for the book.

The price is much less than used copies of the first printing are going for.

Done,
Thank you Peter, I did not see that working on the small screen of my phone. I had gone straight to the Silverprint home page.
Have a good day,

Terry Hull
3-Jan-2012, 11:36
Thanks for the help !

Vaughn
3-Jan-2012, 13:11
It may not be an issue, but keep an eye out for uneven toning. I date back to the the early 1950's, too, so I imagine prints from back then might be a crusty as I feel sometimes.

In particular I am thinking about the gelatin hardened with age and then when re-wetted, the emulsion might not soak up the toner evenly. But again, it may not be a problem.

Brian Ellis
3-Jan-2012, 23:33
One of the things I liked about bleach and redevelop toners was that you can control how much gets toned by controlling the time. With a short time the highlights will get most of the toning, longer time and the midtones and eventually the shadows get toned. So you can get many different looks from the same toner.