Adapter for 39mm to copal#1

[Proartwork]

I need an adapter that is able to fit to a copal#1 lens board for use on a 39mm mount size lens. Such thing exist? Where can I get it?

Thanks

[Dr Klaus Schmitt]

Schneider makes those.
https://www.schneideroptics.com/Ecommerce/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?CID=1367&IID=2016

[Bob Salomon]

If you are planning on doing macro work with an enlarging lens then you also want a reverse mounting ring. And, in any event, don't forget to block off the illuminated aperture port on the back of the lens.

[Dan Fromm]

Klaus, the OP wants to put a lens in M39x? in a hole drilled for a #1 shutter, which is (see http://www.skgrimes.com/products/new-copal-shutters/pressshutters) 41.6 mm in diameter. The adapter you pointed to "adapts a lens with a 32.5mm x 0.5 mounting thread to an enlarger lens board (or a Unifoc 58 / 76 focus mount) with a 39mm x 26Gg LEICA thread." Not what's wanted.

OP, I just checked, a flange for an enlarging lens in M39 fits a Copal #1 sized hole. What's your problem?

[Proartwork]

Klaus, the OP wants to put a lens in M39x? in a hole drilled for a #1 shutter, which is (see http://www.skgrimes.com/products/new-copal-shutters/pressshutters) 41.6 mm in diameter. The adapter you pointed to "adapts a lens with a 32.5mm x 0.5 mounting thread to an enlarger lens board (or a Unifoc 58 / 76 focus mount) with a 39mm x 26Gg LEICA thread." Not what's wanted.

OP, I just checked, a flange for an enlarging lens in M39 fits a Copal #1 sized hole. What's your problem?

I'm doing an experiment and since i'm new to view camera system I need help in finding an adapter that i'm not familiar with. I had no clue the adapter is called a flange. Where can I find the flange? At least a link so that I know how it looks like.

Thanks

[E. von Hoegh]

I'm doing an experiment and since i'm new to view camera system I need help in finding an adapter that i'm not familiar with. I had no clue the adapter is called a flange. Where can I find the flange? At least a link so that I know how it looks like.

Thanks Are you using an M39 mount camera lens, or other lens?

[Proartwork]

Are you using an M39 mount camera lens, or other lens?

It's for a Nikon 80mm EL with a 39mm mount size.

[E. von Hoegh]

Then you should be able to fasten it to the board with a flange or a locking ring.
A flange screws onto the lens and has 3 or 4 holes around the flat part for screwing it to the board. A locking ring is a threaded ring with two notches or holes on one end for tightening with a special wrench, usually called a spanner.

[Dan Fromm]

It's for a Nikon 80mm EL with a 39mm mount size.

Look here: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?atclk=Accessory+Type_Flanges&ci=543&N=4288586497+4246734177

You'll have to measure to find out whether the lens' mounting threads are M39 x 26 TPI (that's Leica) or M39 x 0.75 mm (wrongly offered as x 0.75" by B&H). Then get the flange you need and go.

[Proartwork]

Then you should be able to fasten it to the board with a flange or a locking ring.
A flange screws onto the lens and has 3 or 4 holes around the flat part for screwing it to the board. A locking ring is a threaded ring with two notches or holes on one end for tightening with a special wrench, usually called a spanner.

So I have to drill holes so that the flange stay in place? Will this flange fit in a way that will not move around (perfect fit) I will hate to see that is not perfectly center. It would be nice to see something similar that will lock with a retainer ring and then screw the Nikon 80mm EL lens. Hope I am making sense! :confused:

[E. von Hoegh]

Put the lens on one side of the board. Attach the flange/locking ring from the other side. Tighten. You can, if you wish, attach the flange to the board with screws, and then screw the lens into the flange - this will leave holes in the board if you wish to use it for some other lens in the future.

Either the flange or locking ring can be used as a locking ring on a metal board, the flange is typically used on a wood board.

[Proartwork]

Put the lens on one side of the board. Attach the flange/locking ring from the other side. Tighten. You can, if you wish, attach the flange to the board with screws, and then screw the lens into the flange - this will leave holes in the board if you wish to use it for some other lens in the future.

Either the flange or locking ring can be used as a locking ring on a metal board, the flange is typically used on a wood board.

Thanks!

[E. von Hoegh]

You're welcome. Good luck!

[Proartwork]

It worked! Thanks everyone for the help. Although what I was trying to do has nothing to do with large format, I was able to find the information I was looking for here and nowhere else.

Thanks again

The results: http://www.flickr.com/photos/proartwork/6551179403/in/photostream

[domaz]

I think I have a 39mm to copal #0 adapter in my lens drawer. It probably crops some of the image area- but I've never tried it. Kind of strange.

[cyberjunkie]

Is there such a thing as a cheap LTM to 40mm adapter?
It would allow to front mount any 39mm enlarging lens in a standard No.1 shutter.
Nothing too strange, or too exotic, but i have never seen something like that on Ebay, or from other Internet resources.
If you know where to find one for cheap, i think it would be of some interest for many members with 4x5" cameras and 120 film magazines.

have fun

CJ

[Dan Fromm]

Not that I know of.

I looked, eventually talked things over with Steve Grimes and paid him (not all that much, prices may be higher now) to make a threaded bushing with female standard enlarger lenses in front and male M40x0.75 to fit the front of a #1 in the rear. Its been very useful.

[cyberjunkie]

Not that I know of.

I looked, eventually talked things over with Steve Grimes and paid him...


I concur with you.
As there is no ready-made chinese stuff, SK Grimes would be a No.1 choice.
Prices are not exactly cheap, but in this case it would be money well spent: a single ring for any LTM lens, in a single No.1 shutter. No need for a diaphragm, a Polaroid MP-4 shutter, or any other one without iris (as those nice dial-set Prontor Press), would do.
Unfortunately some of us live in that old continent filled with historic ruins, and inhabited by various tribes which seem to trace their origin to the fogs of history... you know, Europe! :)
Until a bridge is built, or the US companies agree to ship small parcels via First Class mail, buying cheap stuff from the USA is not exactly affordable.
On top of that, our beloved government thought that a 20% VAT (plus some other silly fee) was not enough, so now we have a 23% tax!
Just add the italian Customs Office, which is a mesmeric entity, unreachable and practically not accountable for whichever mistake they've done, and you have got the most part of a very depressing picture :(

Maybe it's better to contact one of the chinese vendors on Ebay, and try to represent a possible sale.
The only variable would be the length of the "tube". 39mm LTM thread and M40x0.75 are very close, so a simple adapter ring can't be a solution. An adapter "tube" must be made, which should have a carefully chosen length, to avoid that the rear of some enlarger lens could hit the shutter blades. On the other side, a "tube" which is too long would probably cause some vignetting.

Please, Dan, can you check the length of the adapter that SK Grimes made for you?
Did the adapter work with any LTM lens you tried?
I think that you have a lot of experience in this particular field, because you did a lot of testing for close range/macro photography.

Any other experience could be very helpful, of course...

have fun

CJ

[Dan Fromm]

I concur with you.
As there is no ready-made chinese stuff, SK Grimes would be a No.1 choice.
Prices are not exactly cheap, but in this case it would be money well spent: a single ring for any LTM lens, in a single No.1 shutter. No need for a diaphragm, a Polaroid MP-4 shutter, or any other one without iris (as those nice dial-set Prontor Press), would do.
Unfortunately some of us live in that old continent filled with historic ruins, and inhabited by various tribes which seem to trace their origin to the fogs of history... you know, Europe! :)
Until a bridge is built, or the US companies agree to ship small parcels via First Class mail, buying cheap stuff from the USA is not exactly affordable.
On top of that, our beloved government thought that a 20% VAT (plus some other silly fee) was not enough, so now we have a 23% tax!
Just add the italian Customs Office, which is a mesmeric entity, unreachable and practically not accountable for whichever mistake they've done, and you have got the most part of a very depressing picture :(

Maybe it's better to contact one of the chinese vendors on Ebay, and try to represent a possible sale.
The only variable would be the length of the "tube". 39mm LTM thread and M40x0.75 are very close, so a simple adapter ring can't be a solution. An adapter "tube" must be made, which should have a carefully chosen length, to avoid that the rear of some enlarger lens could hit the shutter blades. On the other side, a "tube" which is too long would probably cause some vignetting.

Please, Dan, can you check the length of the adapter that SK Grimes made for you?
Did the adapter work with any LTM lens you tried?
I think that you have a lot of experience in this particular field, because you did a lot of testing for close range/macro photography.

Any other experience could be very helpful, of course...

have fun

CJ
Paolo, the adapter Steve made for me is a stepped bushing. The front section, that accepts the lens, is 6.75 mm from front to the back of the step, total thickness is 11.8 mm. The front section's outer diameter is 47.5 mm. With it the lens sits entirely in front of the shutter. There's no possibility of anything hitting the shutter blades.

Before I bought from Steve I also had discussions with SRB, now SRB-Griturn. There's just not enough room between the shutter's M40x0.75 and an enlarging lens' M39x 26. I've thought about painting the rear of a disposable enlarging lens with mold release compound, then with metal-filled engineering epoxy, and putting a disposable #1 gently on it. Unscrew the lens after the epoxy has cured ... Never tried, it doesn't seem the right way.

At one time there were many small machine shops in Italy. All those Fiat-based Etceterini had to have come from somewhere. Not that I've ever had a Fiat or a Fiat-based hot rod. Touring-bodied 2 liter Alfa, yes, Zagato-bodied Fulvia, yes, but Fiat no. Surely you can find a machine shop that can make an adapter for you.

Some lenses in M39x26 tpi have long rear sections with the mounting threads quite far from the rear. E.g., the 210/9 G-Claron. These lenses won't attach directly to the adapter Steve made for me. I have around 1 m of various length E. Leitz NY extension tubes, use them to attach such lenses to the adapter.

I started out hanging lenses in front of an ex-MP-4 #1 Copal Press, found its top speed of 1/125 limiting when using flash. Now I have a proper cock-and-shoot Copal #1 dedicated to front-mounted lenses.

Vignetting issues depend on many factors. The only lens I've had to be careful about when front-mounting is a 60/14 Perigraphe that just fits in an Ilex #3. But remember, I shoot 2x3, not 4x5.

Now stop griping, find a machinist, and ask for a cost estimate. Then you'll know whether buying locally makes sense. You'll still have to pay IVA.

Cheers,

Dan

[cyberjunkie]

Thanks for the input.
I'll try my best to follow your advice, Dan. I'm not so positive about the outcome, though.
Everybody is complaining about the crisis, but when you try to have a simple work done at the lathe (no question, asked, current fee by the hour, etc.), 99% of the times you are told that they don't do that kind of things. Too little to earn, and too much a nuisance, i suppose.

So you drove a Lancia when it wasn't just a rebranded Fiat!
Good taste, good taste. :)
Those were the good old times.
Now a true italian car is going to cost you a kidney and a half!
All the rest is mass production, without any creativity or real innovation.
I guess the future is in Chrysler...

cheers

CJ

[Dan Fromm]

I'm not sure the Fulvia is a real Lancia. As I understand the history, Professor Antonio Fessia designed what became the Flavia, boxer motor and all, and offered the design to Lancia. The Fulvia is basically a smaller Flavia with the Appia's V4 motor. Nice car, though, even if it wasn't really designed in-house.

Back to adapters. Steve and his successors have told me many times that most of the labor of making one is in set up; materials and time to make once set up cost very little. Ask SRB-Griturn for their price for making the adapter that Steve made for me, they may surprise you.

[John Flinn]

Is there such a thing as a cheap LTM to 40mm adapter?
It would allow to front mount any 39mm enlarging lens in a standard No.1 shutter.
Nothing too strange, or too exotic, but i have never seen something like that on Ebay, or from other Internet resources.
If you know where to find one for cheap, i think it would be of some interest for many members with 4x5" cameras and 120 film magazines.

have fun

CJ

Yes, a company called Helix made them. I have several that I bought on the bay. You take the lenses off of a Compur 1 shutter then screw this 40mm to 39mm LTM adapter into the front lens socket and you can use your El Nikkor or other 39mm LTM lenses into your Compur 1. This works great on 9x12 folders like the Bergheil. Another option is to screw on a 39mm LTM to 42mm adapter to the El Nikkor then use it with a 42mm bellows or helix for focusing. There are also 2 other ways to get an El Nikkor to work with your 35mm camera. I will elaborate later if there is an interest.