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mortensen
22-Sep-2011, 10:01
To all you experienced Sinar users:
would a F2 8x10 stand the task as a portable camera for architectural photography?

My concerns are the following:
- will the front standard allow for significant front rise (at least 60mm)?
- will it be stable and rigid using so much rise (if at all possible)?
- how portable is the camera (approx weight?) and can it collapse relatively compact?
- ... and finally, which movements are geared?

sorry for maybe reposting something considered common knowledge, but I couldn't find a thread addressing these questions specifically. I can't really find good hires pictures of the F in 8x10 version, so if any of you know where to look, please let me know.
thanks :)

Ari
22-Sep-2011, 10:08
I have only handled a Sinar 8x10 for a few minutes, but I can tell you it is very rigid, very stable.
The price to pay is the weight; it's beastly and bulky.
Yes, it's portable, if you have a car. I think you are a bicycle rider, so I'd forget that.
Given the proper case, a Sinar case made for the 8x10, it collapses well into the suitcase, but again, the case will be heavy.
Someone else might chime in with regards to front rise specifics, but I imagine you'll be using a 4x5 F standard, so that should tell you how much rise you'll get.

mortensen
22-Sep-2011, 10:14
thanks, Ari - yes, I'm a bicycle rider. Regarding the front standard I read somewhere that there is a dedicated 8x10 F front, which should allow for more rise... yet to be confirmed.

Mark Woods
22-Sep-2011, 10:17
The 8x10 is HUGE & heavy. I bought a V8 for the exterior work that I do. The movements on the Sinar are precise and allow for a lot of movement. I believe the rise and fall on the front standard is about 60mm in each direction.

rdenney
22-Sep-2011, 11:02
thanks, Ari - yes, I'm a bicycle rider. Regarding the front standard I read somewhere that there is a dedicated 8x10 F front, which should allow for more rise... yet to be confirmed.

That is true. It's called the "special" front standard (my part numbers are at home). The major difference is the longer rise columns, and I think it also has more shift range. It will have detents on the rise columns to align the front with the 8x10 back.

I think you'll find the camera easily as rigid as any wooden field camera. Portability? If you remove the bellows from the front standard, you can fold the front standard back flat, and the rear standard over it, which makes a pretty compact bundle by monorail standards. It will never be as compact as a folding field camera, but for architecture use it will be more versatile. You can remove rail extensions down to the 12" base rail routinely, and add as many as are needed.

The F series does not have any geared movements except focus, and on an F2, the focus is geared on both standards. It has base tilts, a yaw-free design, separate locks for shift and swing (unless it was made in the first couple of years of the F2 model), and zero detents for everything except lateral shift. The same movements are available on both standards. All controls and locks are accessible from one side of the camera, so you never need to take your hand from the loupe as you are making adjustments.

You can also add a 4x5 rear standard and bellows to your kit and have the ability to make a two-minute conversion to a 4x5 camera with a relatively small additional cost (probably cheaper than a 4x5 reducing back). That might help when you need something more compact.

Rick "who uses a 4x5 F2" Denney

Daniel Stone
22-Sep-2011, 11:11
Sinar's are rock solid(when tightened down properly that is ;). However, the F2 has those "stick" columns which add to the size of things.

They're great cameras though, and as previously mentioned, fully interchangeable parts-wise with other Sinar acc's and backs(such as Rick mentioned above). I owned a 4x5 F2 for a 6mo period, and greatly regret selling it. I love the "modularity" of the Sinar system, and it JUST WORKS.

Architectural photography sometimes involves long shutter speeds(especially if at night), so a heavy camera helps add to the stability issue.

and "extras"(acc's) are easily purchased 2nd hand too :).

-Dan

tgtaylor
22-Sep-2011, 11:16
As a comparison front rise on a Toyo 810G is 145mm and has a back rise 170mm. The 4x5 Toyo Robos has 80mm rise on both the front and back.

Thomas

rdenney
22-Sep-2011, 12:17
As a comparison front rise on a Toyo 810G is 145mm and has a back rise 170mm. The 4x5 Toyo Robos has 80mm rise on both the front and back.

The F2 4x5 front standard has 110mm of total vertical movement, if I read those specs correctly (and that seems about right from mine). The Special front standard will be more, but I don't know how much more.

Rick "noting that the F2 has more rise than the F" Denney

sanchi heuser
22-Sep-2011, 13:17
Hi Mortensen,

the F2 8x10 weighs 7600 g,
the P2 8x10 weighs 8200 g.

For data, see the BH link, scroll to page 98 ff:
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=72629

What I can say about the P2 8x10:
A real pleasure to work with,
most adjustments can made while look at the ground glass under the dark cloth.

I transport it in a Peli 1650 case, tripod on the shoulder, with tramway and bus, the rest by feet. I also thought about using a bike maybe with a small trailer.

Cheers Andi

mortensen
22-Sep-2011, 13:27
thanks for info, guys... if I have to get a P to get geared movements (or a Toyo G for that matter), I think some of the advantages of choosing a Sinar F over a woodie (Shen-Hao or Ritter, for instance) starts to fall apart.

But its good to know - not least that you can actually use a 8x10 P as a 'field' camera, Andi. Those extra 600 grams is surely nothing for going fully geared.

sanchi heuser
22-Sep-2011, 13:37
:) Mortensen,

There's always a way for a P2 8x10 far from Copenhagen roads:
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=75204&page=27 :cool:

mortensen
22-Sep-2011, 13:39
:D plain crazy!