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Richard Wasserman
24-Aug-2011, 18:22
I need to order frames for a show I have in October. It will consist of about 35 16x20 black and white prints in 24x28 frames. They are printed on Kentmere VC paper which has a pretty bright white base. The prints are neutral toned. I find myself obsessing between wood frames in either black or what is called Espresso, a very dark brown. So, what do you all think? Should I consider other options? I feel silly asking, but I seem to be stuck....

Greg Y
24-Aug-2011, 18:49
Richard, I've been in the same quandary. In the end, for shows, I've usually gone with black. It goes well with the image no matter what. Sometimes the gallery flooring or walls or accent colours seem to clash with 'espresso' I'm wishing there was a paper with a little less glare in the whites...kind of like Forte polywarmtone was..sigh*

Erik Larsen
24-Aug-2011, 18:57
I agree with Greg. Go with black and it should match most any surroundings and has a classic look IMO. I prefer simple wood look to aluminum but that is just a matter of taste. Good luck with the show!
Regards
Erik

Alan Gales
24-Aug-2011, 19:02
Have you put a piece of matte board next to your print and then a piece of frame on top of the matte board to give you a good idea what the end result will look like? This is what I have always done when framing prints.

jeroldharter
24-Aug-2011, 19:27
I use the same paper.
I use Nielson frames in Contrast Gray color which is dark but not quite black. I find that it does not fight with the black in the prints. Sometimes straight black makes selenium toned prints look more blue or eggplant.

FDI has them. They do a great job and the frames come very clean.

Kirk Gittings
24-Aug-2011, 19:39
First off, I think one can obsess over this to much. I think that as long as the frame is clean lined and contemporary then fame color is secondary. Traditional B&W silver photography almost always looks contemporary and requires a clean lined frame (unless one is imitating an earlier aesthetic). I think if the print is strong and pulls you in, then the frame (as long as it isn't dumb) is secondary.

But truly neutral? That would be somewhat unusual IME. What subtle tone are the prints (not the paper base), cold tone, selenium, warm etc.?

Merg Ross
24-Aug-2011, 20:49
My thoughts. The frame should always be as unobtrusive as possible if you want your prints to be the dominant feature. For the past twenty-five years I have exhibited using contrast-grey frames. Black frames can on occasion work well, but sometimes draw the eye away from the photograph and become a distraction, similar to a key line. For a 16x20 print mounted to the size that you suggest, the frame is not that distant from the image itself; again, be certain to make the image the focus of your presentation.

However, if you are exhibiting your work for decorative purposes, then a contrast-grey frame might not bring great returns.

In any event, I hope your exhibit is a grand success; you have some excellent work to exhibit.

Noah A
25-Aug-2011, 04:30
When I shot B&W I tended to stick with black. I like the look and in a way I found brown or other near-black colors to be a bit distracting.

For my color work I'm now using white Nielsen 117 frames and I really like them. The profile is a bit deeper than other metal frames. I've never tried them with B&W but it might actually look good. They really disappear and let the work speak for itself, but at the same time they look very polished and professional. The price is right and they're easily reusable if you need to use them for another show down the road.

Since it's a matter of preference like so many other things, I'd suggest stopping by a frame shop and playing with their samples next to one of your prints.

If you get wood frames I'd recommend getting ones that are painted or stained directly. If you get wood frames that are coated with gesso or some other thick coating it will chip off over time if you ship or re-use the frames and before long they'll look pretty beat up.

I don't know what the venue is or if the prints are for sale, which may be a consideration. But I think it's hard to go wrong with a simple profile and a white or black frame.

GPS
25-Aug-2011, 05:06
Black frames for B&W is the common sense. Any other color brings a third color to the picture itself. Coloured frames are for color photography as black or white is again, an opposition to a color, in a certain way.

Brian Ellis
25-Aug-2011, 05:21
I use black because that's what I started with and I don't want to reframe things from my first few exhibits. If I were starting over I'd use some sort of nickel/silver looking frame. I've seen both black and nickel/silver over the years and I just like the way the nickel/silver looks. But I don't think the frame is really that critical, all I want in a frame is something that doesn't distract from the photograph. I want people to notice and look at the photograph, not admire the frame.

Peter De Smidt
25-Aug-2011, 06:26
I'm the opposite of Brian. I started with silver frames, but I'm considering changing to black or dark gray. I agree with the advice about taking a sample of your work and checking out the options.

BrianShaw
25-Aug-2011, 06:37
Likewise...

After 30+ years of silver Neilson Nr. 11 I'm looking into changing to the Contrast Grey or a matte black.

In general I don't think it matters much, like the other Brian said.

Jim Jones
25-Aug-2011, 07:12
I also started with a silver equivalent of Neilson 11, but find that many buyers prefer black in an unsophisticated market. I would use all black for an exhibit, but offer both at art fairs. Aluminum is less obtrusive and more practical than wood.

ROL
25-Aug-2011, 08:43
I feel silly asking, but I seem to be stuck....

Well – don't feel silly, necessarily. This is the basic reason I don't offer framing with my prints, and am reticent to do so when pressed on the matter. I recognize that framing tends to be a personal choice, and very important to people matching decor "aesthetics". My perspective, though, is entirely based on the desire of the work's creator (i.e., me) to universally emphasize the work itself and not the manner of its display. I offer (professionally) and use (personally) but one simple black metal frame style for all of my work, something I have written briefly about in my article, Print Presentation (http://www.rangeoflightphotography.com/pages/Fine%20Art%20Print%20Presentation) -> Framing (http://www.rangeoflightphotography.com/pages/Fine%20Art%20Print%20Presentation#framing). As for wood frames in general – while I appreciate the aesthetic choice, they tend not to be as dimensionally nor archivally stable as metal.

...but in the end, it's up to you.

Frank Petronio
25-Aug-2011, 08:51
I'm a little curious about doing a traditional corner-hung overmat treatment of 16x20 inkjet rather than silver, as that seems to be the edge of needing to drymount or otherwise fix the paper down or you'll get waves?

I prefer 1- to 1.5-inch rectangular profile wooden frames with real glass even if the aren't as archival or protective. The black is more forgiving if the frames are moved around and get a little dinged up, it's easier to fix them.

Jeff Bannow
25-Aug-2011, 10:28
I like plain matte black Nielsen frames. They are cheap, durable and look clean.

Kirk Gittings
25-Aug-2011, 10:31
Likewise...

After 30+ years of silver Neilson Nr. 11 I'm looking into changing to the Contrast Grey or a matte black.

In general I don't think it matters much, like the other Brian said.

I started with that frame too and used them for many years. In 2005 I had a big retrospective at a local museum. They owned a portfolio of mine from the early 90's that traveled and was still in the shipping case with the number 11 silver frames. To me in 2005 (and especially now) those frames look really dated and I had them change them out to a number 94 mat black which I think has a much more contemporary look to it.

MDR
25-Aug-2011, 10:41
Take a few of the prints you plan to exhibit to the framemaker or shop and put them next to the frames or in the frames. The One that looks best to you will be the right choice.
Good luck
Dominik

Merg Ross
25-Aug-2011, 11:36
It really is personal choice. I recall in the early days of museum exhibits, a piece of glass was slapped over the print and held in place with angle screws; no frame at all. At some point framed prints became the norm. I have used silver, white, black, contrast-grey aluminum frames as well as stainless steel. Finally,as previously noted, I have settled on the Nielsen #111 contrast-grey aluminum, and have too much invested to change.

However, a few days ago I had a print order for five framed prints with the specification that they be framed using matt black aluminum frames. I framed a couple this morning and I like the look. Either contrast-grey or matt black seem to work most of the time.

Drew Wiley
25-Aug-2011, 11:56
I have rows of plastic raingutter on the rafters in my framing room with 10ft lengths
of all kinds of Nielsen mldg, plus random lengths of various hardwood pattern. Guess I'm
eclectic and like to match the frame to the specific image. But I also need different
patterns because large prints need a lot more support than small ones. Plus it's fun
when I just want a small woodworking project - cutting and finishing a frame is a lot
easier than building another kitchen!

Richard Wasserman
25-Aug-2011, 15:47
I want to thank everyone, this has been quite useful. I knew I was over-thinking, and agree with a few people who pointed out that within limits it doesn't matter too much what I choose, as they are all good, just different. I have decided to go with black metal frames and keep it simple. Now I just need to choose a profile.....

Jeff Bannow
25-Aug-2011, 15:49
Pick something standard so that you can find the same style in the future.

Drew Wiley
25-Aug-2011, 16:24
Just be sure your profile has enough rabbet or lip depth so that the acrylic won't pop
out, or the frame corners pop, as the glazing expands and contracts. Some profiles,
like Nielsen 33, might look nice, but function poorly, especially with larger prints.

Kirk Gittings
25-Aug-2011, 16:32
Richard. I have been liking Nielsen #94 (http://www.contemporaryframe.com/product_configure.php?cPath=21&products_id=131)for the last 7 years. It has a nice "presence" to it.

Sal Santamaura
10-Sep-2011, 09:47
...I have settled on the Nielsen #111 contrast-grey aluminum...Merg, do you mean Nielsen #11? I don't find any #111 available to look at. Thanks in advance.

Merg Ross
10-Sep-2011, 10:00
Merg, do you mean Nielsen #11? I don't find any #111 available to look at. Thanks in advance.

Sal, I will check in a few days. It may be the #11, the 111 was the old LI catalog #.

Merg

Kirk Gittings
10-Sep-2011, 10:28
IMHO. I used Nielsen #11 up till about 15 years ago. I think they look very dated now.

Merg Ross
14-Sep-2011, 20:31
IMHO. I used Nielsen #11 up till about 15 years ago. I think they look very dated now.

I agree that the silver frames you were using look dated. I used them briefly. The Nielsen #11 is available in contrast grey, my preference for the last twenty years.

However, I delivered six prints this week in the ubiquitous matt black frames, and for the particular images they worked very well. In a residential setting, anything goes. In a gallery, I have always prefered one frame style and color.

Richard Wasserman
14-Sep-2011, 20:36
I went with Nielsen #117 in matte black. I started framing today and they look quite nice.

I got the frames from Frame Destination in Dallas, TX. Their prices were very good and their customer service even better. I will definitely use them again.

Merg Ross
14-Sep-2011, 20:46
I went with Nielsen #117 in matte black. I started framing today and they look quite nice.

I got the frames from Frame Destination in Dallas, TX. Their prices were very good and their customer service even better. I will definitely use them again.

Simple and elegant, I like the profile. Your work will show well. Congrats on the exhibit, hope it is a grand success!

Richard Wasserman
14-Sep-2011, 20:49
Simple and elegant, I like the profile. Your work will show well. Congrats on the exhibit, hope it is a grand success!

Thank you Merg!

Kirk Gittings
14-Sep-2011, 21:40
117 is pretty similar to my #94 and will give a clean contemporary look. Good Choice!

Richard Wasserman
14-Sep-2011, 22:13
117 is pretty similar to my #94 and will give a clean contemporary look. Good Choice!


Thanks Kirk, Frame Destination doesn't carry #94 which made the decision a bit easier.