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josh_560
11-May-1999, 22:24
Just curious, Does anyone know what a Lanthar lens is? I did not see any info on them on the main page. They pop up from time to time in the used ads for outrageous sums of money. Why are they so special? Josh

John Hicks
12-May-1999, 00:02
They're so special because there's an aura of mystique surrounding them and they 're collectible. Voightlander made a series of lenses to fit various cameras, called Apo-Lantha r. How apo they are and how they'd compare to modern lenses I don't know persona lly but a couple of well-known photographers/photograpy writers whose opinions I trust have said that they're good lenses but not in the league of modern lenses , many of which sell for _lots_ less.

Blake
12-May-1999, 10:29
They are made from a very dense "rare earth" glass called lantham? (i think) and are famous for being a "hot" lens(slightly radioactive). They are prized for being some of the sharpest best performing "classic lenses" on the used market. oops gotta go...I'll dig up an old view camera mag see if i can find the article.

Ian Binnie
13-May-1999, 22:29
I understand that the Apo-Lanthar is a variant of the heliar design wherein one or more elements (although I believe only the rear element) is made of lanthanum (rare earth) glass. This lens is reputed to have very high resolving power. S omewhere on the net is a comparison chart of large format lenses produced by an interested professional. The Apo-Lanthar rated a 7/10, which was more or less a median score. That's about the extent of my knowledge.

Ian Binnie
8-Jul-1999, 23:14
A followup. My father owns a Voigtlander Apo-Lanthar that he purchased back in the 1950's. Very recently, I had the shutter serviced and the lens mounted on a Crown Graphic. We took some sample negatives last weekend. To my admittedly u ntrained eye, the resolution and contrast were excellent. I wouldn't pay collec tor prices to own one, but this lens is really very nice to work with.

kreig
25-Dec-2003, 15:29
I purchased a 300mm Apo-Lanthar back in the very late 60's when they were being "closed out" by a big camera store in NYC. It came without caps in a compound shutter.

I used this lens on my 4x5 for many years and the results for me are stunning!! Color work is exceptional and B@W the same. I also use the lens on an 8x10, but there are no room for movments, the coverage is tight!! Minimum aperature is f/32

Have never seen a 300 Apo-Lanthar for sale, can't imagine what one would cost if it was on the market. Sorry, mine is NOT for sale. I work with dagors, schneiders and rodenstocks also. I love the Lanthar, goes to my grave with me. For some curious reason, only antique photons travel trough the lanthar and the results are very special. :-) :-)

Ernest Purdum
25-Dec-2003, 21:45
Until quite recently, most lenses were "achromats" meaning that two colors made images the same exact size. "Apochromats" or "Apo" lenses are able to image three colors to the same exact size, but used to be limited to process lenses such as the Apo Artar, which sacrifice speed and coverage to obtain apochromatic correction. The new "rare earth" glasses, of which lanthanum is one, made it possible for faster and/or wider lenses to qualify. The Apo-Lanthar was the first large aperture lens to be designated an apochromat. The point was emphasized by three colored grooves on the front of the lens mount.



Since then, many apochromats have come on the market, some carrying "Apo" as part of their name, some without the designation.

Ole Tjugen
25-Dec-2003, 23:09
I used a 210mm Apo-Lanthar for a while, then sold it as it seemed to be a lot more desired by collectors than shooters. For the money I bought a 210mm Xenar and a 150mm Apo-Lanthar...

I have never shot a test target with any lens. But to my eyes, the Xenar and the Lanthar are both very, very sharp. Somehow the Lanthar gives more "pleasing" pictures - it's probably one of those "bokeh" things.

I also have a 150mm Heliar mounted on a plate camera, and that also gives very pleasing but possibly less sharp images.

tangyimail
15-Jul-2011, 03:15
I would be interested in knowing more about using Apo Lanthar 300 on 4x5, I have one that needs a new shutter, and I would like to know what's the best shutter / lense board solutions for it.

thanks


I purchased a 300mm Apo-Lanthar back in the very late 60's when they were being "closed out" by a big camera store in NYC. It came without caps in a compound shutter.

I used this lens on my 4x5 for many years and the results for me are stunning!! Color work is exceptional and B@W the same. I also use the lens on an 8x10, but there are no room for movments, the coverage is tight!! Minimum aperature is f/32

Have never seen a 300 Apo-Lanthar for sale, can't imagine what one would cost if it was on the market. Sorry, mine is NOT for sale. I work with dagors, schneiders and rodenstocks also. I love the Lanthar, goes to my grave with me. For some curious reason, only antique photons travel trough the lanthar and the results are very special. :-) :-)

Ole Tjugen
15-Jul-2011, 04:04
I think the only shutter the 300mm's were sold with is the Compound V. Big things, but so is the lens...

Math
16-Jul-2011, 08:59
Keep in mind that the highly regarded lens we're talking about is the Apo-Lanthar. A plain (non-APO) Lanthar is a simple triplet lens, used by voigtlander as a budget option.

E. von Hoegh
16-Jul-2011, 12:15
Keep in mind that the highly regarded lens we're talking about is the Apo-Lanthar. A plain (non-APO) Lanthar is a simple triplet lens, used by voigtlander as a budget option.

I don't think so, Math. The "Lanthar" moniker came from the lanthanum glass used.

Now, Voigtlander is selling lenses that may or may not have rare earth glass under the "Lanthar" name.

Math
16-Jul-2011, 15:46
I don't think so, Math. The "Lanthar" moniker came from the lanthanum glass used.

Now, Voigtlander is selling lenses that may or may not have rare earth glass under the "Lanthar" name.

Though that makes very good sense, sadly it's not true.

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/9219/dsc42901.jpg

Many cheaper Voigtlander cameras had the Lanthar name on their lenses, but I can safely say that these are not well corrected Heliar formula lenses, but cheap budget lenses.

Tony Evans
16-Jul-2011, 16:36
From Antique & Classic Cameras Website.
"Rollei expert Alex Pearlman remarks that the Tessar on the Rolleiflex T utilizes Lanthanum glass for improved resolution and color correction".

Tim Deming
17-Jul-2011, 11:39
Though that makes very good sense, sadly it's not true.

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/9219/dsc42901.jpg

Many cheaper Voigtlander cameras had the Lanthar name on their lenses, but I can safely say that these are not well corrected Heliar formula lenses, but cheap budget lenses.

you're both (?) right. The lanthars (triplets) and apo-lanthars (heliar/dynar design) were both made with lanthanum glass. AFAIK, the lanthars were only used on 35mm cameras (Voigtars and vaskars were Voigtlander's low-end triplets for medium format cameras) and the more expensive APO-lanthars were used only for medium/large format.

cheers

Tim

Jens Langen
11-May-2013, 15:12
I too purchased an Apo Lanthar lens from a company in NY called Camera Barn in 1972.
It's a 210mm in a Compur 3 shutter but strangely doesn't have a serial number anywhere. Does anyone know why this is? I read that only the last production runs of the 210mm had Compur 3 shutters but that's all I've heard.

Ian Greenhalgh
11-May-2013, 16:10
A Lanthar is a Vaskar with the middle element made from lanthanum glass. An APO-Lanthar is a Heliar with the middle element made out of lanthanum glass.

Both are excellent performers, Voigtlander were a little ahead of everyone else in the 1950-55 period because they suffered less from the war and got their new designs to the market around 1950, whereas it took Zeiss and others a few years to get new designs to market after the war.

Tom Sobota
14-May-2013, 08:26
Except that the later APO-Lanthars maybe ended up having no Lanthanum at all. Lanthanum is mildly radiactive and some people would see it risky to walk with one of these lenses in their pocket. I don't know what happened but the facts are these: my APO-Lanthar f4.5 210mm in Compound n.3 is an older lens and produces an easily measurable gamma emission. On the other hand a more recent 150mm in Compur simply does not emit anything measurable. Since the half-life of La 138, the radiactive isotope, is some 60000 years I don't think that it has decayed since the lens was built.

Again, separating La 138 from La 139 (the inert isotope) and using only the latter in the lenses does not look like it can be made on the cheap, so the only reasonable alternative is that Voigtländer at one moment started using some other compound.

But who am I to know...
Tom

gliderbee
14-May-2013, 09:20
How about this one (35mm lens) ?

95085


Stefan.

Tom Sobota
14-May-2013, 11:25
I found the thread that I remembered about Apo-Lanthars, it's from 2005:
http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?15047-Voigtlaender-Apo-Lanthar

Stefan, that is a nice lens you have there but it's not Voigtländer, but rather Cosina. And while it might be Apo, it is not a Lanthar. You know that trade names come and go nowadays, and I have read somewhere that this lens has 6 elements in 5 groups, while the Apo-Lanthar, a Heliar actually, is 5 elements in 3 groups, if I remember correctly.
Tom

Oren Grad
14-May-2013, 11:50
You know that trade names come and go nowadays...

Yes. Cosina's use of the licensed Voigtlander names is purely for marketing effect. There is no connection between the optical designs of today's C/V lenses and the historical lens types for which the names were originally used.

Bernice Loui
15-May-2013, 21:02
Lanthar was used as a marketing tool for these lenses. They were not the first or the only ones to use Lanthanum optical glass.

"In the early 1930's, G.W. Morey of the Geophysical Laboratory of Washington,
developed some new glasses, and in 1934 came up with a glass with unusual
properties. Eastman Kodak undertook to commercialize this discovery. (For more details of this see Rudolf Kingslake's "A History of the Photographic Lens", p77.) The glasses were referred to as the Lanthanum Crowns. The properties of these glasses are best illustrated by reproducing Kingslake's diagram."

http://www.austincc.edu/photo/pdf/lanthanum.pdf

History of Lanthanum glass is from the USA during the 1930's and commercialized by Eastman Kodak..


Schott cut off the supply of optical glass to the USA during WW-II, so alternatives had to be made and found. Among them were Lanthanum and Thorium optical glass.


What the APO Lanthar offers is wide aperture, good color correction and nice out of focus rendition at large apertures. Stop the lens down to f16 or smaller the differences are less apparent when compared to other lenses of similar design with round a round iris.


Bernice

mark e mark
28-Oct-2013, 04:26
Can someone with the 300mm apo lanthar in a shutter weiht the lens please. I know my camera has difficulties supporting lens over 1000g.

Arne Croell
29-Oct-2013, 10:13
Except that the later APO-Lanthars maybe ended up having no Lanthanum at all. Lanthanum is mildly radiactive and some people would see it risky to walk with one of these lenses in their pocket. I don't know what happened but the facts are these: my APO-Lanthar f4.5 210mm in Compound n.3 is an older lens and produces an easily measurable gamma emission. On the other hand a more recent 150mm in Compur simply does not emit anything measurable. Since the half-life of La 138, the radiactive isotope, is some 60000 years I don't think that it has decayed since the lens was built.

Again, separating La 138 from La 139 (the inert isotope) and using only the latter in the lenses does not look like it can be made on the cheap, so the only reasonable alternative is that Voigtländer at one moment started using some other compound.

But who am I to know...
Tom
Not so. In the natural isotope mix, the stable 139 La has a concentration of 99.9%, and the radioactive 138La makes up the rest. However, 138La has a half life time of 10^11 years which translates to a pretty low level of radioactivity just on its own. At 0.1% concentration, the natural La isotope mix is essentially nonradioactive for all practical purposes. Lanthanum glass is quite alive and available, check out the current Schott glass catalog and see all the glass types with La in the name....
The radioactive Apo-Lanthars used Thorium oxide in addition to Lanthanum oxide in the glass. Voigtländer changed that somewhere between 1964 and 1966 as shown in the 2005 thread mentioned above. Since production numbers were much higher in the early years, the number of radioactive Apo-Lanthars on the market is much higher than that of the nonradioactive ones. More information can be found in my article on Voigtländer LF lenses built after WW II: http://www.arnecroell.com/voigtlaender.pdf