How do you scan?

[JHenry]

I'm relatively new to large format, having recently begun using a Chamonix 45n-1. Took it and lots of film on a recent trip to Morocco and Scotland, and now have a significant amount of film to scan.

I've searched and searched, but can't find a thread where people document how they scan their large format negs/transparencies. I have an Epson V750, which I plan to use with Vuescan. I could also use also use Silverlight Ai, but I've been using VueScan with my Nikon 5000 for a while. The problem is there are so many variables in scanning.

So, my question: How do you scan? What software do you use? What resolution do you scan 4x5 at (assuming file storage is not a consideration)? What is your scanning process? Any specific settings you've found that lead to better results? And, most importantly, why have you made the decisions you've made with respect to your scanning process?

Know this could be too in-depth of a question, but thought I'd throw it out there...to help me and others that follow.

Cheers, and happy shooting!

Jeff

[Peter De Smidt]

Find the ideal height to suspend the negative over the scanner. It can range from 0-3mm (or so) above the glass.

If you're shooting BW, find out which channel gives the best results. It'll probably be the green channel. If so, you can set Vuescan to make the BW image from the green channel.

Make sure to scan in 16-bit per channel mode.

Scanning above 2400 spi will probably not give any useful info with your scanner, but check for yourself.

Make sure not to clip any data.

I prefer not to sharpen in the scanning software, but others do so.

I use different equipment and software then you do, and my exact workflow won't be useful for you. Maybe those with your scanner and software can be more specific.

[domaz]

I can add to Peter's comment- scan raw files in Vuescan if you have the space. That way you can go back and mess with scanning settings by scanning the file. You can also open the raw file in Photoshop if you scan as a raw DRG format.

[sergiob]

I have an Epson 4870 Photo. I discovered that it gives exactly the same thing scanning as color neg or bw, so I scan as BW neg. The green channel in my scanner doesn't give more. I put the output sliders at 0 and 255. The input sliders I leave a little wider than the histogram on both ends. I discovered 3200 ppi gives me more detail, or at least the same detail but more clearly, than 2400. I scanned a step tablet and realized scanning as a positive is a no no. I turn unsharp mask off and do my sharpening routine in PS.

Those black plastic things that come with the scanner called film holders are useless, at least in my case. Some say betterscanning has great holders. I have not tried them, so I don't know.

What I did was a series of height tests. I started laying the film flat on the glass, then put it one a thin cardboard with a window that raised the film slightly, the put another, and so on. Double card thickness is the sweet spot focus-wise in my scanner. Works pretty well and I get decent scans.

There is so much info on a well done 4x5, that you can spare some of it and throw it away with a flatbed desktop scanner. It is a good compromise for me, otherwise going up in scanner quality would mean spending several thousands of dollars more, which I would rather spend in front of the lens, not behind.

My 2 cents.

[mdm]

All that advice is fine, but if you dont know how to scan then what good is it? Go to Ken Lee's site (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/scanning.html)site for an article on how to use your scanner with epson scan. That is how I learned to scan. Sadly I still havent read the epson manual. I have found epson scan difficult with the betterscanning holder but fine with the epson holders which can be moved up and down to get the correct focus using some plastic feet supplied in a bag. Dont get fixated on scanning, you can spend mega bucks on it, but look at all of Kens wonderful scans done with the simplest tools.

David

[stevebrot]

I use Epson V700 with Epson Scan and very rarely Vuescan. I might use Vuescan more if I had the pro version. Silverfast gives me hives...


Steve

[sanking]

I have found epson scan difficult with the betterscanning holder but fine with the epson holders which can be moved up and down to get the correct focus using some plastic feet supplied in a bag.
David

I am confused by this comment. One of the main features of the Betterscanning holder is that it has small nylon screws that one can use to adjust the height of the holder over the glass plate to place the film at exactly the right focus. Does your holder not have these nylon screws?

Sandy King

[Bob McCarthy]

I would suggest using Vuescan Pro, The license allows the software installation to be used on any scanner you have attached to your computer.

If you've been using it you should know your way around. Very capable software.

And pro is not much more than standard version.

bob

[sanking]

For scanning B&W negatives the Epson scanning application does everything I want and is very easy to use. I have used both Vuescan and Silverfast but for scanning B&W negatives I have not found that they work any better than the Epson software that is included free with every V700 or V750.

For color I really don't know because while I use a lot of color film it is nearly alway with the intention of converting to B&W.

Sandy King

[Tom Monego]

The professional section of the Epson software is very capable and I haven't had a reason to use anything else. The Home and Auto sections are not worth the time and they are setting deficient. I ahve done 48 bit color scans of b&w negs and 16 bit b&w scans results are very similar. I scan 4x5s at 1800-2400ppi. I don't go over 3200 ppi with my V700 even with small negs.

Tom

[mdm]

I am confused by this comment. One of the main features of the Betterscanning holder is that it has small nylon screws that one can use to adjust the height of the holder over the glass plate to place the film at exactly the right focus. Does your holder not have these nylon screws?

Sandy King

When I scan using the betterscanning holder using epson scan on a v700 it often is not recognised correctly and I end up with 3 6cm strips instead of 1 4x5 scan. I used to be able to fix that by resetting epson scan to its defaults but for some reason that no longer works for me, it always thinks the betterscanning holder is medium format and I end up with 3 thumbnails. So, if I am using the betterscanning holder for a wet mount, then I use vuescan. Mostly I just use the epson 4x5 holder with epson scan because it is less work, most of my scans are only 700 spi. Probably the fault is mine but I can find no way to pick what format holder I am using, other than to choose which 6cm format you are using, 6x4.5 6x6 6x7 6x9 etc. Perhaps I should upgrade my software or, horror of horrors, read the manual.

David

[sanking]

When I scan using the betterscanning holder using epson scan on a v700 it often is not recognised correctly and I end up with 3 6cm strips instead of 1 4x5 scan. I used to be able to fix that by resetting epson scan to its defaults but for some reason that no longer works for me, it always thinks the betterscanning holder is medium format and I end up with 3 thumbnails. So, if I am using the betterscanning holder for a wet mount, then I use vuescan. Mostly I just use the epson 4x5 holder with epson scan because it is less work, most of my scans are only 700 spi. Probably the fault is mine but I can find no way to pick what format holder I am using, other than to choose which 6cm format you are using, 6x4.5 6x6 6x7 6x9 etc. Perhaps I should upgrade my software or, horror of horrors, read the manual.

David

David,

Did you see the previous message about the professional versus the home and auto modes of Epson scan? Perhaps this is why you are having trouble with the application recognizing the format. I scan everything in the professional mode and have never had any problem with format recognition.

Sandy

[mdm]

No, I am using the professional screen, basicly doing exactly what Ken recommends.

[sanking]

No, I am using the professional screen, basicly doing exactly what Ken recommends.

Then there must be some kind of quirk in your software or operating system. I have used the Epson scanning application for years with several different computers and scanners, including the V700 now, and have never had a problem of the type you describe. But perhaps I did not understand you? When I make a scan in the professional mode I first do a preview, and then I define the exact area that I want to scan. That is, I don't want or expect that the application recognize the format since it is so easy to do that after the prescan..

Sandy

[mdm]

Now that I think about it it only started with Windows 7. I do a preview and where I used to get a large area including the betterscanning holder, from which the scan area could be selected, I now get medium format strips as individual preview thumbnails, as if I was using an epson mf holder. Nothing I can do will make it change its mind, everytime I do a preview of a 4x5 with the betterscanning holder, it spits out some mf previews. I beat my head against the wall for a morning and then just changed to vuescan for the betterscanning holder. I dont mind because with the latest vuescan, one can do a raw scan and then do the software adjustments that epson scan does in a black box, seperateley. So if you are not happy with the way a scan turns out, you can just redo the adjustments without having to rescan the negative, and that makes sense to me because I use the betterscanning holder to make bigger, time consuming scans. In any case, I doubt anyone cares and neither do I. This is way off topic. The original poster is trying to work out how he is going to do his scans.

David

[Ken Lee]

Have you placed the Better Scanning holder in the correct orientation ?

(I have done it wrong more than once. I ended up placing some white tape on the scanner and the holder, so that I don't have to remember).

[mdm]

I am positive it is oriented correctly and I have just tried again by reseting epson scan to its defaults. Image size before I preview is set to the transparency scanning area size, after I preview it is set to MF and it will not allow me to manually change the original document size. Screen shot attached. Whereas Vuescan gives me a wonderful scan in which I can see the structure of ice crystals, crop attached. I like epson scan in every other respect though.

[Jon Shiu]

How about unchecking thumbnail?

Jon

[mdm]

How about unchecking thumbnail?

Jon

Thank you for that. Problem solved. Perhaps I should read the manual sometime or just get some common sense.

David

[mdm]

Just to be fair, here is an equivalent crop from epson scan.

[Peter De Smidt]

The epson scan version is clipping highlight detail.

[JHenry]

Thanks for all the responses. Good information and food for thought.

Jeff

[coops]

I just scanned a 4x5 neg using the fluid mount accessory (not wet mounted) for the heck of it, and the same negative again with the plastic holder. The FMA scan was WAY sharper, and the colors were richer, if thats the right word. Just thought I would mention it.

[Professional]

First, i have Epson V750, and i use Epson Scan always over the Vuescan and SilverFast.
Second, i still don't have LF to scan, but i hope soon i can do that when i will have LF system.
Third and last, i hope i know where i can get Fluid Mount Accessory for my V750.