What's wrong with this picture?

[Mike Anderson]

First LF color shot:

http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/medium/1-color-raw.jpg

This is a cheap scan of Portra 160VC, uninverted. Did the lab process it in BW chemicals, or is it way overexposed, or what?

I took a couple of similar BW shots on FP4+ processed by the same lab and they turned out OK. I don't know what exposure I used - gotta start writting that stuff down!

And the film doesn't seem to sit squarely in the holder. Should I tap the holder to square up the film right before inserting it in the camera?

Thanks for any help.

...Mike

[Mark Stahlke]

Was the film loaded backwards?

I don't shoot color negative film but this is sort of what color slide film looks like when you load it backwards - with the emulsion side away from the lens.

Cheers,
Mark

[vinny]

what he said.

[csant]

The good thing about sheet film is that you don't need to pay extra money to get "redscale film" :D

[Mike Anderson]

Was the film loaded backwards?

Could be. I was operating under the assumption that if I'm looking at the film and the notches are on the lower right corner, then the emulsion side, the side that should face the lens, is facing me.

Maybe that's true for BW but not color?

...Mike

[Bob McCarthy]

notches upper right for all sheet film

emulsion is then facing you

bob

[csant]

I was operating under the assumption that if I'm looking at the film and the notches are on the lower right corner

Upper right, or lower left. You loaded the film the wrong way around…

[Brian Ellis]

Could be. I was operating under the assumption that if I'm looking at the film and the notches are on the lower right corner, then the emulsion side, the side that should face the lens, is facing me.

Maybe that's true for BW but not color?

...Mike

That's correct if you're holding the film horizontally. If you're holding it vertically then the notches should be in the upper right corner.

[RPNugent]

http://www.butzi.net/articles/filmload.htm

should clarify film loading

[RichardRitter]

Could be. I was operating under the assumption that if I'm looking at the film and the notches are on the lower right corner, then the emulsion side, the side that should face the lens, is facing me.

Maybe that's true for BW but not color?

...Mike
Did you load the film in total darkness?

[bvstaples]

Mike:

It does sound like you loaded the film in backwards. If the notches were in the lower right corner of the film holder, then the emulsion was down. This probably plays a part in this. Who processed the film? Did you ask their opinion. If you had Chrome do it, they real good about troubleshooting with you.

Just curious Mike, do we know each other. I know three Mike Andersons in San Diego, and I'm wondering if you're one of them.

Brian

[Mike Anderson]

What does a print from the negative look like? Make a print and show it. You might have a pleasant surprise when you see how it looks.

http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/medium/1-color.jpg

There is the negative inverted in PS.

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

Mike:

It does sound like you loaded the film in backwards. If the notches were in the lower right corner of the film holder, then the emulsion was down. This probably plays a part in this. Who processed the film? Did you ask their opinion. If you had Chrome do it, they real good about troubleshooting with you.

North Coast Photography in Carlsbad processed it. I've had 35mm processed by them and they've always done a good job. This is my first attempt at LF.



Just curious Mike, do we know each other. I know three Mike Andersons in San Diego, and I'm wondering if you're one of them.

I don't think we know each other - I don't know any LF photogs other than online.

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

That's correct if you're holding the film horizontally. If you're holding it vertically then the notches should be in the upper right corner.

Notches in lower right when the film is horizontal. I think I did load it correctly - I read the Paul Butzi article a couple of times, found a video on youtube, etc.

Another clue as to the orientation: the image as posted here is oriented as I saw it (not reversed left to right) AND the imprint on the film "Kodak 160VC-2", as seen on the film as posted here, is also not reversed. Is that enough info to determine whether the film was facing the right way?

Thanks for the help.

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

Did you load the film in total darkness?

I loaded it in a film changing bag. I also did a BW shot - same procedure and same thing - and it turned out OK.
http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/medium/1bw-edit.jpg

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

I wasn't clear, I loaded the film with notches lower right with the film horizontal, like this:

http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/DSC_000236.jpg

...Mike

[BetterSense]

Well, that's the right way round. You didn't have red filter on the camera right?

[RPNugent]

What were the scanner settings when you did the scan? The film was loaded correctly so that leaves the scan as the next source of the problem.

[drew.saunders]

http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/medium/1-color.jpg

There is the negative inverted in PS.

...Mike

Whip out the black turtleneck, use some buzzwords from here: http://www.pixmaven.com/phrase_generator.html call it "art" and charge more money for it.

[RichardRitter]

Could be flare. You are shouting into the setting sun. Which type of film did you use first? The B & W or the color.

[Mike Anderson]

What were the scanner settings when you did the scan? The film was loaded correctly so that leaves the scan as the next source of the problem.

It's just a cheap scanner set for color scan. The scan is true enough to the actual appearance of the negative.

The film was purchased from Adorama, the development lab has a very good reputation, the BW film that was loaded and shot and developed in parallel turned out OK.

I'm at a loss. The good news is that the camera/lens seems to work (it's an old camera) as the BW shots came out OK, and determining the functionality of the camera was the point of making these shots. But I would like to figure out what went wrong with the color shots.

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

Could be flare. You are shouting into the setting sun. Which type of film did you use first? The B & W or the color.

The red/orange negative at issue is Kodak 160VC. The BW that turned out OK is FP4+.

...Mike

[Mike Anderson]

Well, that's the right way round. You didn't have red filter on the camera right?

No filters.

...Mike

[RPNugent]

Does the scanner have a setting for color negatives? It looks like it was scanned as a positive and inverting that will not get you the necessary correction for the orange mask.

[Mike Anderson]

Does the scanner have a setting for color negatives? It looks like it was scanned as a positive and inverting that will not get you the necessary correction for the orange mask.

The scanner doesn't have a setting for negatives. The original orange image I originally posted is a positive scan of the negative. The cyan image I posted is that inverted. Maybe it's just way overexposed.

...Mike

[RPNugent]

Based on that response I think there is in fact nothing wrong with the picture. What's wrong is the scan.

The exposure actually looks pretty decent and your black and white negative (which was probably shot at a very similar exposure) looks fine.

Inverting a positive scan of a color negative will give you a cyan looking image since the inverse of orange is cyan. You will have to play around in Photoshop to correct the color balance to remove the orange mask since inverting won't take care of the mask. I know you say it is a cheap scanner, but you might want to look at Vuescan to see if the scanner is supported. If it is you can try the software for free and see if you can get a proper mask corrected scan of the negative.

[Mike Anderson]

Based on that response I think there is in fact nothing wrong with the picture. What's wrong is the scan.

I agree.


The exposure actually looks pretty decent and your black and white negative (which was probably shot at a very similar exposure) looks fine.

Inverting a positive scan of a color negative will give you a cyan looking image since the inverse of orange is cyan. You will have to play around in Photoshop to correct the color balance to remove the orange mask since inverting won't take care of the mask. I know you say it is a cheap scanner, but you might want to look at Vuescan to see if the scanner is supported. If it is you can try the software for free and see if you can get a proper mask corrected scan of the negative.
http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/data/13981/medium/1-color.jpg
These first shots were just test shots to see if the camera works, and since it does look like it works I can start looking at getting a better scanner (as well as start learning to dev my BW film). Epson has the V700 refurbished for $415 off and on, so that's probably what I'll look for.

I appreciate everyone's help on this wild goose chase. I feel like a real photographer now!:)

Thanks again,

....Mike

[Brian Ellis]

Notches in lower right when the film is horizontal. I think I did load it correctly - I read the Paul Butzi article a couple of times, found a video on youtube, etc.

Another clue as to the orientation: the image as posted here is oriented as I saw it (not reversed left to right) AND the imprint on the film "Kodak 160VC-2", as seen on the film as posted here, is also not reversed. Is that enough info to determine whether the film was facing the right way?

Thanks for the help.

...Mike

You loaded it correctly, as I said in my previous post.

[lenicolas]

the inverse of orange is cyan.

The inverse of cyan is RED! come on!

[RPNugent]

Yes PURE cyan has an inverse of RED. but the orange mask looks pretty close to cyan when inverted. It answers the question. Thanks for being SO helpful.

[lenicolas]

Inverting a positive scan of a color negative will give you a cyan looking image since the inverse of orange is cyan.

Dude.
The begining of your sentence made some kind of sense, but when you state something totaly wrong to explain it, someone has to say it's wrong.
I'm sorry not everyone buys all the bs you say.
And i know you're trying to be helpful and everything but just to convince the OP to get a decent scan of his image, you don't need to mislead him into believing some bs you just made up.
cheers.

[Jack Dahlgren]

Looks like it was mis-processed. Both the initial scan and the inverted scan are devoid of much color. Even this subject should have some color range to it.