Tray Film Developing - Timer?

[Pawlowski6132]

So, I'd like to give tray developing a whirl but, am not sure what timing of device is best. I'm leaning on getting a metronome and just counting. Any other practices?

[Matt Miller]

I use a standard Gralab timer. I don't understand why you'd want to do the counting yourself.

[Pawlowski6132]

I use a standard Gralab timer. I don't understand why you'd want to do the counting yourself.

Well, I actually had always used daylight tanks and so, just assumed tray development needed 100% lightfree development (including glow of Gralab timer). Guess not!

Well, I bought one last month but the thing showed up busted.

:rolleyes:

I know they're about $50 even used so...


$50 vs. Counting (Free)

[John Bowen]

Zone VI compensating developing timer. They are no longer available new, but show up on Ebay from time to time. They aren't cheap, but they adjust the time to account for temperature variation. Even if you manage to start development at 68 degrees, the temperature of the developer will most certainly rise with your hands in the soup.

As a good friend of mine states "you'd have to pry his Zone VI compensating developing timer from his cold, dead hands." I'd second that statement.

[Pawlowski6132]

Zone VI compensating developing timer. They are no longer available new, but show up on Ebay from time to time. They aren't cheap, but they adjust the time to account for temperature variation. Even if you manage to start development at 68 degrees, the temperature of the developer will most certainly rise with your hands in the soup.

As a good friend of mine states "you'd have to pry his Zone VI compensating developing timer from his cold, dead hands." I'd second that statement.

How's you or your friend's health these days?

[Kevin Crisp]

I couldn't agree more with John on this one. Critics say it only works for Tri-X and HC110 but I use it for 5 different films in 3 developers and as long as my 68 degree time is right from testing, it always works.

If you can't spend the money on one, then carefully checking temperature and using a talking count down timer like the one Radio Shack used to sell will work fine.

[John Bowen]

How's you or your friend's health these days?

I expect your film will expire long before we do :D

[Drew Wiley]

The Zone VI timer is wonderful, if you're lucky enough to find one. Can't imagine why
they discontinued it, but assuming the subcontractor folded some time after Calumet
acquired the line. Otherwise you have to have a temp-controlled water jacket around
the tray (which is a good idea for film work, but generally overkill for developing prints).

[Kevin Crisp]

The timer is a convenience, but it doesn't do anything magic you can't do for yourself. (Looking up the time on a chart, checking the temperature, etc.) If you get your darkroom to some convenient temperature close to the temperature of the solution, it isn't going to drift very far and it isn't going to get there very fast. The display and the beep at 30 seconds are convenient too, but you can get by.

[wager123]

i use the computemp software with my laptop . it is a great system , just cover the computer screen with ruby lith and you are set.

[J Ney]

You folks are fancy!! I just set the timer on my watch for the deveopment time and go with that... I count out the stop bath in my head and re-set the watch for the fix (only glancing at it when I'm confident that 3-minutes have passed and I can turn on the lights).

I don't fully understand the need to compensate for heat-transfer from one's hands. If your starting fluid temperature is the same, the volume of developer is the same, the ambient temperature is roughly the same, development time is the same, and your body temperature is roughly the same (assuming you're not febrile), then wouldn't any rise in developer temperature be accounted for when doing your development time testing?? I'm not seeing the variable that would cause a differing rise in temperature.

I've done all my development testing without water jackets and I have noticed that my times are slightly shorter than others, but that takes into account the temperature rise from my fingers. I've never had an issue going forward.

[Colin Corneau]

Gralab timer works well - I've used it for tray processing and if it faces away at a decent distance, there's no chance of fogging.

I also downloaded the Massive Dev. Chart app for my iPod Touch. Of course it's too bright to use, but I have it facing down and use the sound to gauge; it gives a tone for agitating each minute (or whenever you set it for) and another tone for the end of the process.

[John Bowen]

J,

In MY darkroom the temperature can vary from 63 degrees in the colder months to 75 in the warmer months. I used to spend time either warming up or icing down the developer water until it reached 68 degrees to get consistent results. Now I just put the Zone VI temperature probe in the tray of developer (film or print) and let the timer do the work. :-) The Zone VI compensating developing timer and the Thomas safelight have both made tremendous improvements to my darkroom experience. I wouldn't think of getting rid of either until they stop making B&W film and paper.

As always, YMMV

[MIke Sherck]

I use a Gralab timer, set on a deep shelf about three and a half feet above the wet side of my darkroom. I cover it with a scrap piece of mat board when loading or unloading film and uncover it once the film is in the developer tray. The timer is set back far enough on the shelf that it isn't visible from the trays, and my darkroom walls are painted matt dark gray so there's no reflection. I've never had a fogging problem (although I'm concerned about having to switch lighting to the new compact fluorescent bulbs. I understand that some of them contain phosphors which can continue glowing for quite a while after you switch them off.)

I set the timer and switch it on for developer and fix; stop is just one "ring" of the film (a pass through the sheets of film, usually 4 sheets of 8x10 or 8 of 4x5, top to bottom, then rotate 90 degrees and do it again. A "ring" is four passes, or 360 deg. rotation.) That's well over 30 sec. and I do it consistently the same way in all solutions. After a while it becomes such a habit that you don't really need the clock, even when singing along to the music... :)

I don't worry much about change in solution temperature during processing. For one thing, as has been pointed out, it should already be accounted for during processing for film testing -- I started out using Tmax film which punishes inconsistency in technique harshly, so I learned to be consistent.) For another, insufficient solution is a major cause of scratches, so I use plenty of liquid in the tray. For example, a quart of D-76 will develop 16 sheets of 4x5, or four sheets of 8x10. That's the minimum volume of liquid I'll use, and at least that much stop and fixer, in my old Yankee 8x10 trays.

Mike

[Darin Boville]

Maybe more fun,

Sort songs by time in iTunes. Choose songs or combinations of songs that match your processing times. Make playlists for developing. Enjoy.

--Darin

[Pawlowski6132]

Maybe more fun,

Sort songs by time in iTunes. Choose songs or combinations of songs that match your processing times. Make playlists for developing. Enjoy.

--Darin


I like it!

[J Ney]

J,

In MY darkroom the temperature can vary from 63 degrees in the colder months to 75 in the warmer months. I used to spend time either warming up or icing down the developer water until it reached 68 degrees to get consistent results. Now I just put the Zone VI temperature probe in the tray of developer (film or print) and let the timer do the work. :-) The Zone VI compensating developing timer and the Thomas safelight have both made tremendous improvements to my darkroom experience. I wouldn't think of getting rid of either until they stop making B&W film and paper.

As always, YMMV

John...

I can see how the Zone VI timer would be invaluable if your ambient temperature changed dramatically... as a native Virginian, I completely understand. I guess I'm spoiled living on the coast of So. California where the temperature hovers around 70 all year (if you chart out our average temps, it is as flat as a pancake). So for me, the ambient temperature rarely changes.

To each their own. :)

[Kevin Crisp]

Temps hovering at 70 in Thousand Oaks all year? Really.

[J Ney]

Temps hovering at 70 in Thousand Oaks all year? Really.

Definitely not... but I use a college darkroom down in Oxnard/Ventura area. So down there it stays pretty cool.

[Eric Biggerstaff]

Use the Compentemp software, very similar to the old Zone VI timer but much more flexible. You can read a little about it on Alan Ross's website. Alan also makes a probe holder that will secure it in a tray. It is well priced and very accurate.

[Ross Chambers]

RH Designs Processmaster II.

Temperature compensating, 8 different channels for film/developer combinations, very legible display, beeps every 30 seconds, mains or battery, steps for soak, develop, stop, fix, wash or any other step you choose, footswitch, percentage/time toggle with run on option.

It doesn't require a visit to e-bay to find an antiquated beat up Gralab (whatever they are) and doesn't play music. It's currently made by the Poms and can be serviced by them.

Regards - Ross

[BetterSense]

Wow, compensating timers? I guess I'm not very scientific. I use my Timex wrist watch...I even use the Indiglo function to see how the time is doing. Oh noes!

[Ed Pierce]

I no longer use the compensating function on my zone vi timers since I've had two of them go bad. I had them both repaired (by Calumet), but one went bad again. In both cases, the timers gradually ran faster than they should have, until they were running fast enough to notice. As a result those negs were progressively underdeveloped.

Apparently there's a diode or something inside on the compensating circuit which does wear out. I haven't had any problems with the 'real time' function.

I suppose I could check them before use by putting the probe in 68f water and switching back and forth from real time to film time, checking against my watch to make sure they're the same. I may do that in the future...for now I'm finding it easier to just use a water jacket and be very careful about the developer temp.

These days I'm running my film at 75f in tubes, so I'm not certain how well the compensating action would work without running some tests. However I have been considering moving back to a lower temperature since 75 is much harder to maintain in my darkroom.