Dealing with the cold

[Jehu]

I had my first experience with LF in the cold last week. There were some marks on the film that appear to have been caused by frost. Also, I couldn't focus too well at one point because the glass kept frosting up. I keep the film in the camera box which is in the tool box in the back of my pickup. I leave it there all the time unless I'm planning on indoor use. I thought I was following all the rules but I'm still having problems. The shutter was failing as I mentioned in another thread. I'm going to have that serviced.

I know I'm not the first one to have to figure this out. Any suggestions from the more experienced would be appreciated.

[Scott Kathe]

If you pull the dark slide too quickly you could get static electricity and this would show up on the film but I've never seen this.

As far as frosting up the ground glass, I've learned to breath down or hold my breath, some have suggested snorkels or those dust filter masks but after some practice you can learn how to not frost up the ground glass. At least you haven't frosted up the lens which I still do occasionally.

You should definitely get your shutter serviced if it is hanging up due to the cold or stop down and do exposures of greater than 1 sec.

Scott

[John Kasaian]

As far as breath condensing on the gg goes, you might try breathing through a snorkel. It looks wierd, but any photographer using a view camera these days looks wierd anyway ;)

[mrladewig]

#1 On the shutter, when the lubricants get old, the cold really affects them. I had this happening on one of my compur #0 shutters causing slowwwww times on the slow times. A trip to Flutots for CLA and it is right on time at -10F or 100F now.

#2 The film can be affect by changes in temp causing condensation. I would recommend that you keep the film (and other gear) inside a ziploc bag even if it is in the back of the truck and especially if you bring it inside and give it time to come up to temperature before opening the bag. Condensation is caused when your gear goes from a cold environment to a warm and humid environment and this can happen in a tropical environment (AC hotel room to outside) or a winter environment (-10F outside to a 68F house).

[Scott Kathe]

#2 The film can be affect by changes in temp causing condensation. I would recommend that you keep the film (and other gear) inside a ziploc bag even if it is in the back of the truck and especially if you bring it inside and give it time to come up to temperature before opening the bag. Condensation is caused when your gear goes from a cold environment to a warm and humid environment and this can happen in a tropical environment (AC hotel room to outside) or a winter environment (-10F outside to a 68F house).

I like this explanation a lot more than mine. “If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, it must be a duck”. If it looks like frost it probably is frost.

I've seen static discharge on x-ray film that I use at my job, if the air is dry and I wear gloves I get little static dots where I handle the film. I've also seen static charges in the darkroom if I peel off the tape at the end of 120 film too quickly. Never seen it with large format though.

Scott

[Peter De Smidt]

If you have a glass "ground glass", would treating the outside with fog-x/rain-x help with the condensation?

[Brian Ellis]

For gg fogging, I take a deep breath and then hold it while composing and focusing. I keep the bottom of my BTZS hood partially open and when I have to exhale/inhale again I do it through the opening.

[Drew Wiley]

Peter - I tried some of that anti-fog stuff like they use on skier's glasses on my gg
and it didn't do much good. The snorkel idea sounds better to me; but there can be
times when this problem is inherently tricky. DRY cold weather is a different kind of
situation, and when I used a metal camera (Sinar) I sometimes actually had to ground the camera back with a piece of wire and a nail into the dirt to prevent static discharge on film in the desert, plus some antistatic fuid on the holders themselves.

[Preston]

"For gg fogging, I take a deep breath and then hold it while composing and focusing."

So, if we see a passed-out frozen lump under a dark cloth do we call the medics, or feed it a good single malt?:D

-Preston

[mdd99]

For gg fogging, I wrap my scarf around the lower half of my face and breathe through my nose to narrow the breadth of the exhaled air.

[Steve M Hostetter]

I try not to use a darkcloth unless I have to ,,, it's 50% of the problem

[Eric James]

I made a short snorkel out of a CPR rescue mask but I find it easier to hyperventilate before I dive under the cloth, and hold my breath while I'm there. Another major contributor to GG fogging is moisture (sweat) from your hair/hat. You can synch up a hood over your hat before diving in to minimize this source. Lately I've been carrier a couple dry handkerchiefs in a Ziplock bag - you can use them for any number of things including wiping down a fogged GG.

If I fumble with a composition all of these strategies may not be enough to keep the glass clear; in these situations I find it useful to remove the focusing cloth (I use a Black Jacket), turn it inside out to clear it of moisture, let the glass cool to ambient temp., wipe it down once more, then reapply the cloth. This can be done in a flash if the light is changing quickly. It also gives you a chance to catch your breath and hyperventilate again before giving it another go.

[Eirik Berger]

Large format photogray in real cold has not been that tricky I think. Of course one must avoid breathing on the ground glass, It will condensate and (if really cold) instantly freeze over and make it real hard to focus.

I have photographed with LF (Toyo 45CF) in temperatures right below -40°C (I find it to be -40°F as well) and my biggest problem was my breath against the GG and the heat from my eyes condencing on the loupe when focusing. Even if it is tricky to focus, remove dark slide, handle loupe etc with gloves on the biggest problem was heat generated from my body against the very cold camera.

I use a balaclava made for snowmobile-driving. It covers up the mouth and nose pretty weell but still allows for breathing. I addition to that I wear a pair of snowmobile googles with a plastic face mask underneath. I have removed the glass of the goggles. This stops my breath effectively and also reduces the general heat from the face or wet/sweaty hair. Because the glass is removed I can still use theloupe for focusing and composing.

I have never seen results of static electricity on exposed film from removing the dark slide, even if it is a very dry climate here during winter and the sea ice is covering most of the ocean around here. And I have had no problems with frost-marks on the film either. It might again be the overall dry climate that is the cause of that.

I must admit that there are times that I wonder what the h*** I am doing working with LF in extreme cold. There have been times when I seriously have considered switching over to a digital solution just for convenience. But I remember Bruce Barnbaum wrote or said once that no good images has ever come out of convenience. And when I see my developed films, and even better the final prints, it reminds my why I keep working this way.

Happy new year to everybody.

[David_Senesac]

http://www.davidsenesac.com/_a-z_evad/wisner_bag.jpg

I've done quite a bit of work in cold even stormy winter conditions. Anyone serious about such work must do something about condensation on the ground glass, else their efforts are sure to suffer at the worst time in dim light. My dark cloth is actually a pair of fine weave $15 black Licra bike stretch shorts I customized the waist opening to fit around my rear standard, with one leg hole to snug around my face and the other at the bottom as an access and air hole. I bought some elastic tubing at Oshman's and after cutting a small access hole adding some duct tape adapted it as a snorkel. Ugly but works great. Actually even during summer in the high mountain areas I often work, groundglass condensation is a frequent dawn and sunrise problem.

[rvhalejr]

I would recommend that you keep the film (and other gear) inside a ziploc bag.

Testing moving parts at the shooting temperature before getting on location might be prudent. Some equipment may not work in the cold even if it recently had a factory service or CLA. Given this,

Try adding desiccant in the bag, let sit for 24 hours (should absorb most moisture) at room temp and then let equipment normalize at cold shooting temp for 24 hours.

I'm afraid of condensation (over time) possibly damaging equipment.

I do not know is keeping film at room temperature (inside your photo vest under the down jacket) or letting it normalize in the cold might be the best.

I have problems with stuff fogging in normal temperature or (a long time ago) while skiing, its a constant battle.,.