Weston's Print Paper

[Mark Woods]

Hello all. I've been looking, but can't seem to find any information on what Edward Weston printed on for the silver gelatin prints. And, what might be similar today. Any ideas. I've been using the Ilford MGW FB IV and I'm not really knocked out. I recently purchased some Oriental paper, and didn't like it. The paper I like the best is RC Ilford MG Delux Pearl. But I'm worried that if it's like the Kodak RC paper, it gets a solarized look if the prints are displayed, even if they aren't in direct sun. Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[Michael Jones]

Hello all. I've been looking, but can't seem to find any information on what Edward Weston printed on for the silver gelatin prints. And, what might be similar today. Any ideas. I've been using the Ilford MGW FB IV and I'm not really knocked out. I recently purchased some Oriental paper, and didn't like it. The paper I like the best is RC Ilford MG Delux Pearl. But I'm worried that if it's like the Kodak RC paper, it gets a solarized look if the prints are displayed, even if they aren't in direct sun. Any suggestions?

Thanks!

There were several brands, but nearly all were silver chloride "contact" printing papers, such as Kodak's Azo. He generally used a glossy surface for the images we are most familiar with.
I'd suggest you keep trying papers and stay away from RC versions. Just my .02.

Mike

[Jerry Flynn]

While others may have some specifics, the answer in general was that he used contact speed papers. Cole mentioned that his father used Haloid paper at one point. Haloid became Xerox and got out of the photo business long, long ago.

Weston used an Amidol developer for prints. Photographers formulary sells kits.

Azo would have been your next choice, but that's gone now.

I do not know where Michael Smith is in his efforts to get a contact paper made.

[David A. Goldfarb]

Another chloride paper that Weston used was Haloid Industro. I have some from the 1950s, but it hasn't held up so well, though I've seen some recent prints on Haloid from that era that seems to have been in better shape.

At the moment, your best bet would either be to pay outrageous prices for Azo on eBay or to coat your own. I've seen some very impressive results on handcoated silver chloride paper.

[Toyon]

I am not aware of any papers currently made that is manufactured according to a formulation more than a decade or two old. Perhaps, EFKE's or Slavich's date to the 50's. It takes a while to learn the true characteristics of papers at with different developers, preflashing, exposure times, negative densities and toners. You tried some good papers, I suggest you give them another round of trials.

[Bill_1856]

I think there was a comment by Merg Ross(?) last year about EW's papers. Azo was among them, but not particularly his favorite.
As good as EW's prints were/are, they are put to shame by the prints of Brett Weston, who used enlarging papers, particularly the Oriental brand. Their secret may be AMIDOL developers and the right negatives, more than the paper used.

[Mark Woods]

Sigh. I went into my darkroom and noticed I have some Ilford FB Glossy & Matt paper, and some Arista RC. Next time I print, I'll give them a try too. BTW, I've been thinking about coating papers for a project I'm working on. Thanks for reminding me.

[Michael Alpert]

Mark,

Weston's contact prints are beautiful in a physical sort of way, with a distinct, very rich style. His prints are a bit dark and too contrasty for some people, and after all these years some of the prints look a little rough and frayed around the edges. Weston's prints were emphatically hand made, and that is an important part of their appeal. They fit the person who made the photographs. Still, there are contemporary photographers who I consider better (or at least as good) photographic artist-printers. George Tice's work comes to mind.

Based on the images I saw on your website, your work is much more urban (and urbane) than Weston's. You seem to have your own style. So you might not have that much to learn from Weston. His paper, even if you could find it, might not serve your photography well. Just a thought.

[Mark Woods]

Michael, you definitely have set my mind thinking. When he had a show at the Huntington, I went down 5 times (my wife and I are members). And what you say is very accurate. We went to the Santa Barbara Museum when there was a show of his there with Tina Mondotti. That was an eye opener on many counts. I had not done my homework and was really knocked out with her work. I'm shooting a project on the Arroyo in Pasadena, and it's more nature driven. Some of it is on my website as "The Pasadena Arroyo." I did a shot with my old 8x10 2D with the Turner Reich triple convertible lens (12-21-28") and the neg is really nice. But the quality of the print leaves me cold. But that's not unusual. I once spent 3 months with a neg working on and off making a print. I figured I had 40 hours into that one neg before I got what I was after. (I don't see that happening with the current neg I mentioned.) I hope to revisit the recent neg with some of the other papers I have.

BTW, thank you for you kind comments.

[j.e.simmons]

Per Cole Weston, from DARKROOM2, printed by Lustrum Press:

He went on to say: "The papers I have used to print his negatives incluce Contactone, Convira and Agfa Brovira. A few years ago I started using Ilford Ilfobrom in grades No. 0, 1 and 2. Ilfobrom is the paper that has come closest to Haloid."

The book has a copyright date of 1978 so you will have to take that into account when transating this into modern Ilford papers.

And not long after that Fred Picker was bemoaning in his early newsletters that all the "good" Ilfobrom was gone.

juan

[Gregg Cook]

It was, and I hang onto my last little bit of Brovira 6 like gold.

[Eduardo Aigner]

I miss Kodak Ektalure W. . .

[Jim Galli]

Might be worth your while to pay a visit to the folks at Freestyle and try some of the Adox FB paper. Developed in amidol and toned in Selenium it has a rich warm look similar to Weston's to my eye. I also was lucky enough to get a sample of their new MCC 111 paper and it looks like it will be lovely also. Give Per Volquartz a call. He's an Adox user and lives in Pasadena. You could see first hand.

[Dan Schmidt]

I don't see adox paper for sale at the Freestyle website?

[chris_4622]

I don't see adox paper for sale at the Freestyle website?

I was looking to try some too.

[Jim Galli]

Oops. I'll have to call them tomorrow. Maybe it was for walk in's only. Or maybe I'm crazy and never really saw it. I had been using it with the J&C name on it.

[Jim Fitzgerald]

Jim, I have some prints that I did with some old 60's-70's Azo in Amidol that have a warmth and old look that I have never gotten before. I'm searching for that same look in some new paper and when I find it I will let everyone know.

Jim

[Dan Schmidt]

Oops. I'll have to call them tomorrow. Maybe it was for walk in's only. Or maybe I'm crazy and never really saw it. I had been using it with the J&C name on it.

I remember when J&C was around they carried Adox. Adox still seems to exist, but I have not found any US retailers. Anybody got a source?

[David A. Goldfarb]

Freestyle carries Adox and Efke products.

[Jim Noel]

Jim, I have some prints that I did with some old 60's-70's Azo in Amidol that have a warmth and old look that I have never gotten before. I'm searching for that same look in some new paper and when I find it I will let everyone know.

Jim

Unless someone goes back to making papers without brighteners built into the emulsion we are not likely to see papers like those used by EW. The last of my old Convira was used up about 20 years ago, and nothing today looks the same. Certainly my Azo from the 80's is brighter than the older stuff.

[blevblev]

He must have used expensive paper. A Weston photo just sold at Sotheby's for $1.6 million.