Would You Attend a Workshop in Newfoundland?

[r.e.]

I'm in the process of purchasing a lodge in Newfoundland and I'd like to know whether there would be interest if we offered photographic workshops.

Some background...

The lodge is located on the North Atlantic Ocean on the Bonavista Peninsula at the mouth of a salmon river. The film version of The Shipping News was shot nearby, so if you have seen the film, you have a pretty good idea of what the area looks like. Photographic subject matter includes extremely rugged coastline, sea stacks, fishing villages (including small ports that were abandoned due to a resettlement programme several decades ago), fishing boats, lighthouses, moose, whales (Humpbacks, Finns and Minkes), icebergs and sea birds (Bald Eagles, Puffins, Great Black-backed Gulls, Kittiwakes, Northern Gannets, Shearwaters and Black Guillemots). Activities, apart from going out to see whales, icebergs and birds, include fishing for salmon and sea trout (these are brook trout that spend part of their time in salt water), hiking (the Skerwink Trail is about three miles away and there are many other trails in nearby Terra Nova National Park), seak kayaking, scuba diving (wrecks and scallops) and cultural activities such as attending productions by Rising Tide Theatre: www.risingtidetheatre.com/

This web site contains information on the area as well as a map: http://www.thediscoverytrail.org/english/hikediscovery/index.html

Newfoundland is in a unique time zone which is 1.5 hours ahead of Eastern Standard Time. The lodge is about a 2.5 hour drive from St. John's, which in turn is a 3 hour flight on Continental from New York. Service from London is in a state of flux. There is currently a direct flight, which takes 5 hours, although it may soon be necessary to fly from London to St. John's via Halifax. One could also take the ferry (4-5 hours) from Cape Breton Island, Nova Scotia to Argentia, Newfoundland, and then drive. If one wants to visit the French islands of St. Pierre, Miquelon and Langlade, one can take a short flight from St. John's or a ferry from Fortune, which from the lodge is about a 4 hour drive down the Burin Peninsula, to St. Pierre. The ferry takes an hour.

If we offer photographic workshops, our intention is to engage first-rate leaders. The question is, would there be interest in workshops and, if so, what kind? How many days should they run? What is the optimum group size? What time of year? I'd also be grateful for information on what highly-skilled workshop instructors charge.

Thanks.

P.S. If the moderators conclude that this is a commercial post of the prohibited variety, they should of course feel free to delete it.

[Eric Rose]

it's to bad it cost so darn much to get to the "rock". It's cheaper for me to fly to Thailand from Calgary than go to Newfoundland.

[r.e.]

Eric,

Continental's web site just gave me a quote of $433, inclusive of taxes, for New York-St. John's return. I asked for a quote, at random, for a departure of Sept. 21 and a return of Sept. 30. Not dirt cheap, but perhaps not unreasonable. Flying to Newfoundland isn't quite the same thing as flying to Fort Lauderdale.

I should make it clear that this thread is exploratory. We happened to be on the Bonavista Peninsula two weeks ago, fell in love with the area and decided to buy the lodge on the spur of the moment. We haven't entirely decided whether to run it as a summer residence or as a lodge. If the latter, I thought that it would be interesting to float the idea of photographic workshops and see what the reaction might be.

[Peter Collins]

No. It is not possible until I retire. That, at best, is three years away. The amount of time and/or money due to distance from Ann Arbor to travel by either car or plane preclude such a destination.

[David A. Goldfarb]

I guess a major factor would be--who is leading the workshop, and is it a "workshop" or a "photo tour"?

I usually think the draw of a workshop is the instructor and the skills that will be covered, and the location is secondary. In the case of a photo tour, the location comes first, and if one learns something about photography in the process from the leader who is usually a professional photographer acting as a kind of tour guide/instructor, that's a bonus.

Occasionally I've signed up for an inexpensive "workshop" as an easy way to get access to a location--which is to say, a workshop that would have been better described as a photo tour. If I really want to learn something about photography, though, I'm willing to pay a bit more for a workshop with a skilled instructor, which I would regard as something more serious, and the location would be secondary.

[bob carnie]

By attendig Foto3 you will come in contact with some very excellent teachers who could help you with some of your questions.
I have taken the ferry to Newfoundland and you are right it is a magical location.I do not see any problem with your dream of combining the property with good teachers to persue photography related courses.
I wish I had the scratch to do what you are doing.
good luck

[Michael Mutmansky]

Well, sure, as a destination, I think NF is high on my list of places to see before the end. I spent time on CBI and wished I had the time to take the ferry over, but that didn't happen on the last trip.

I think that photo tours will be more logical, rather than workshops, as the destination is worthwhile on it's own, and it's a bit far reaching for a regular process/technique workshop.

Shipping News was a very enjoyable film, BTW. Well worth the time to watch for anyone who doesn't know what NF is like.

Here's another place that would make a GREAT workshop/tour/artist's colony...

http://www.primelocation.com/international-property/browse/all/sales/ireland/GWDU999000184/

Anyone with $2.5M?


---Michael

[r.e.]

I wholly agree that this is a place to make photographs rather than a place to learn about scanning or digital or wet darkroom technique.

I think that a workshop, or tour if one prefers, would be more about aesthetics. On a technical level I could see a workshop about macro.

That said, I know a couple of people who print for Magnum photographers, one in Paris and one in New York, and I know that they would love to come and hang out and maybe teach a bit. We'll see.

But fundamentally, Newfoundland is about being outdoors in a remarkable place, where one wakes up at dawn and is dead to bed by about ten.

Maybe it would be better to use the word retreat. I could see welcoming a group of photographers who are largely self-directed, but have a great place to stay, logisitcal support and the benefit of local knowledge and contacts.

I got some colour negatives back today (I'll get the rest tomorrow) that were taken with a Mamiya 7 and a 150mm lens that I purchased a few months ago from Ken Lee, They are photos of Humpback Whales, all at the minimal shutter speed of the camera of 1/500, and if I am reading the negatives right (I'll scan them tomorrow morning), I think that it just might be possible to photograph Humpbacks with a handheld 4x5. That would be very cool.

Thanks so much for the input.

[Tom Conway]

Count me in as a potential attendee. NF is high on my list to shoot!

[D. Bryant]

I'm in the process of purchasing a lodge in Newfoundland and I'd like to know whether there would be interest if we offered photographic workshops.



Not in the winter and only if there is independent verification attesting or confirming the veracity of the proposed workshops.

Don Bryant

[r.e.]

We plan to operate from May to October, and we'll be actively seeking independent reviews of the accomodation, the food and activities. It's a beautiful place. We plan to have a website this November. If we decide to do something oriented toward large format photography, I'll do a post in the Announcements section.

A couple of the summer residents that I encountered while out fishing:

[Daniel Grenier]

Would I attend a workshop in Nfld ? Not likely. Would I go to your lodge and photograph the area? Very likely.

I suspect the odds of success for LF-centred workshops would be rather unlikely given the tiny market you'd be targetting. The broader audienced (not format centric) photo-tour approach might fare better where the destination is the main attraction and the "workshop" second in importance.

However, I wonder if there are some merits to an "LF-friendly" lodge (i.e. darkroom, gallery, library etc..) where somebody like me would spend a week or two, photograph and process, see some great photographs, hang out with fellow LFers outside the constraints of the workshop format ???

[r.e.]

Daniel, your comments got me thinking a bit.

For my own purposes, there will be a darkroom for black and white processing, a scanner, at least two computers with Adobe CS3, and photography books. It's a no-brainer to make these resources available to visitors. There's also a dynamic arts community in Newfoundland, and a space where we intend to exhibit the community's work.

On the other hand, if you wanted to hang out with fellow LFers, you'd have to bring them along. You can probably count the number of local large format photographers, on an island that takes 10 hours to drive end to end, on one or two hands :)

[Don Miller]

As a photo destination, yes.
As a workshop, probably not.
How many rooms?

[Michael Kadillak]

As a photo destination, yes.
As a workshop, probably not.
How many rooms?

I agree with Don.

As the kids go off to college and these expenses and responsibilities are taken care of, the possibilities open up considerably. Have camera(s), will travel.....

[r.e.]

There are currently 11 rooms, but we are going to reduce that number to 8 or 9 because we are going to make the rooms larger. There is also a separate 2-bedroom cabin.

I'm quite familiar with the Newfoundland plastic arts, literary and fine art letterpress scenes, but less so with what is happening photographically. I may have spoken too soon when I suggested that large format photographers are few and far between. I'm sure that there aren't a lot of them, but the university has a fine arts programme, and the authors of Copper Plate Photogravure: Demystifying the Process (Focal Press) live and work in Newfoundland. I'm going to be there in mid-October, perhaps a good time to become more familiar with what is happening locally with large format photography and alternative processes.

To the moderators: the idea behind this thread is to get comments from people on what might interest them as a photographic resource in this part of the world. If you feel that the thread crosses the line into commercialism at some point, and therefore violates forum rules, don't hesitate to say so.

[Hans Berkhout]

If traditional wet darkroom facilities were availabe, I'd love to spend 10-14 days or so at your lodge. I'd do my own thing but would thoroughly enjoy meeting ohter photographers over breakfast, supper etc. I would need the darkroom only for neg development and contact printing, to make sure that "everything is OK", final printing I can do at home. Pleas keep me on your mailing list, tx. Kingsize beds?

[Frank Petronio]

We'd love it as a Lodge B&B type place first, that just happens to be extra-photographer friendly... I could definitely see planning a Summer vacation up there, but given past workshop experiences, I'd want to bring my wife and have a little more comfort than the typical "dorm" experience.

How are (or "is") the dining, etc.?

How late in the Summer can you find icebergs to photograph?

Are naked girls running around OK?

Ever see this flick: Rare Birds, with William Hurt and Molly Parker? I want to go there. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0295552/

[r.e.]

How are (or "is") the dining, etc.?

How late in the Summer can you find icebergs to photograph?

Are naked girls running around OK?

Ever see this flick: Rare Birds, with William Hurt and Molly Parker? I want to go there. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0295552/

The icebergs calve from Greenland and can be seen until late June/early July. There were a lot of them this year, and they are an awesome sight.

With a population of half a million, most of them in the Saint John's area, and a land mass of 42,000 square miles (110,000 square kilometers), there's no shortage of space for naked people to run around.

Rare Birds is a fun film. As good as William Hurt and Molly Parker are, I think that Newfoundland comic actor Andy Jones holds the film together: http://www.andyjonesproductions.com/ The film is based on this novel: http://www.amazon.ca/Rare-Birds-Edward-Riche/dp/0385658621/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/701-4662184-8009113?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1190479313&sr=8-1

How's the dining? I don't think that we'll be manufacturing any rare bird sightings :) We'll be putting a lot of emphasis on food and wine because the guy that I'm doing this with is a high-end New York chef. The local ingredients are first rate and it's a seafood lover's paradise. Wild mushrooms and wild berries (raspberries, wild strawberries, blueberries, lingonberries and cloudberries) are abundant. Moose, caribou and grouse in the fall. There's also a serious organic farming operation run by a fellow, originally from Louisiana, who teaches at the university.

[Rob Champagne]

Ever see this flick: Rare Birds, with William Hurt and Molly Parker? I want to go there.

There's a sighting of ORCA's just near a Cornish fishing village every couple of years. Does wonders for the local tourist industry. Never been confirmed though. I wonder why not...

We get a pod Dolphins in Salcombe estuary every year.

[MJSfoto1956]

The question is, would there be interest in workshops and, if so, what kind? How many days should they run? What is the optimum group size? What time of year?

DEFINITELY not in October!! :( I recall the last time I was up there on business and the locals were verifying that October is indeed a quite rainy time of year up there (to put it bluntly). Summers of course are lovely. Otherwise, your idea sounds like a grand opportunity for photo artists.

[billschwab]

I've done one successful tour to Iceland leading a group and have another filled for the Spring of 2008. I have also been looking into doing the same in Newfoundland and would be interested in checking out your establishment for a possible base or at least a stop on such a tour. Please keep me informed.

[fotographis]

I have attended several workshops at the Maine Photographic Workshops, and if your offerings were of a similar calibre and temperment then I would definitely consider it. The biggest drawback for me would be that it is in Canada, my workplace has a USA only training policy. I would have to wait until I could afford both the time and the cost for the trip myself. Then again, I have always wanted to visit both Newfoundland and Nova Scotia...

[Simon Benton]

I know the area quite well and it is indeed a lovely location. I would be more interested in an informal type of photo workshop where I could use a darkroom to develop my 8X10 negatives and maybe make some proofs and have some constructive criticsm. I would like to travel the area with my wife and take photos as the spirit moves but it should definitely be informal. Fine dining, a good bar and a comfortable bedroom would be a must. Is your location anywhere near Fishers Loft? (I think I have the name right and my wife and I spent a lovely few days there a few years back)

Simon

[r.e.]

Hi Simon,

Fisher's is in Port Rexton, maybe 10 miles away on the other side of the bay.

In August, I took this snapshot of a moose and her calf about a half mile from Fisher's. It isn't a good photograph, we were in the car and they just happened to be on the side of the road as we were passing, but it may bring back some memories.

Some info on Fisher's: http://www.fishersloft.com/

[Bruce Barlow]

A number of folks seem to have expressed interest in being there, but not necessarily in workshopping there. Why not consider taking it the way it wants to go? Near us the MacDowell Colony offers space to artists of all ilk to reside and work on specific projects. Each has a small cabin, one or two even have darkrooms, as I recall. Folks come, work, and gather in the evenings to talk about their projects and otherwise socialize. MacDowell internships are free, but competition is fierce.

So maybe offer a "photographer's retreat" where folks can come and photograph, work in the darkroom or on the computers, hang out, eat, and drink? Charge normal room and board, and a lab fee for those working in the darkroom, but save the participants the expense of paying for instruction they don't want. Require a minimum stay length. Have communal meals at big tables. Revruit a couple young folks as interns who can lead photography expeditions and know the area ("interns" means free or nominal wages).

I'm sure MacDowell has a web site. You might also refer to Ted Orland's book "A View from the Studio Door," where he describes "salonistas" and his gatherings of artists to discuss their work.

This is all too easy for me to suggest, since I'm not at financial risk and don't need to do any work to make it come alive, so I apologize for my effrontery, but ya know, I just might be a regular for something like this. Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

[evan clarke]

The best workshops I have been to spent most of the time indoors talking about photography and the actual time spent photographing was limited. I'd like to come there for a couple weeks and photograph or maybe follow Bill Schwab there with a group...EC

[Tim Hyde]

I was thinking the same thing as Bruce. MacDowell has been around for decades and has spawned a number of other "retreats" where musicians, artists, writers, and poets can work in private "studios" or cabins during the daytime and gather together for meals and to discuss each others' work. I would be very interested in that experience for photography, especially in that location.

[r.e.]

Bruce and Tim are among a number of people who have talked about a 'retreat" model. We can't do it for "nominal" room an board, but maybe we can organize retreats that are sponsored. Anyway, it's something that we're going to consider as a model.

[Bruce Barlow]

Bruce and Tim are among a number of people who have talked about a 'retreat" model. We can't do it for "nominal" room an board, but maybe we can organize retreats that are sponsored. Anyway, it's something that we're going to consider as a model.

Who said "nominal?" Not me. MacDowell Colony is well-endowed (!) and can afford to do what they do. And as I said, competition is fierce to get in. Could I? Don't know, haven't tried. MacDowell stays can last a month, too, depending on the project and the persuasiveness of the proposal from the artist. They deliver lunch to your cabin in a basket, too. Fresh baked bread...

For a good place to stay, good chow, access to a place other than the bath tub to change film, and evenings with like-minded folks, I'd pay market rate with no quibble. If you can get sponsors to subsidize part, all the better, but it's definitely not a requirement to get my interest. I suspect the retreat model has appeal to many who are looking for an interesting place to get away from it all, or at least most of it. Sounds like you've got it.

What's it like there in the winter?

[Tim Hyde]

what bruce said

[Michael Rosenberg]

I agree with what Bruce suggested. I would also be willing to come up and spend a week there photographing on my own or with some friends.

Mike

[r.e.]

What's it like there in the winter?

For Americans, a comparison to Maine might make sense:

Maine (Portland): http://www.theweathernetwork.com/statistics/C02870/usme0328

Newfoundland (Bonavista): http://www.theweathernetwork.com/statistics/C01989/canf0023

I just realized that that was all in metric. Here it is in Fahrenheit:

Portland: http://www.weather.com/weather/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/USME0282?from=search

Bonavista: http://www.weather.com/outlook/travel/businesstraveler/wxclimatology/monthly/graph/CAXX0576?from=search

Newfoundland is a big place, and the weather varies depending on where one is. Bonavista, known best for its lighthouse and as the place where John Cabot is thought to have landed, is about an hour's drive to the north on the island's northern coast. The weather, while not quite the same, is pretty close. There is another weather office about 45 minutes to the southwest, at Terra Nova National Park, for which the numbers differ from Bonavista, but not by a lot.

[Bruce Barlow]

Thanks, r.e. Actually a little bit warmer than here in NH, methinks, and a bit more moist. Could be really interesting in a ground glass.

HEY! I can handle metric! I routinely befuddle people when I reply that I'm an even two metres tall. Then I make them figure it out. Good entertainment.

[r.e.]

Hi Bruce,

It's a very interesting and attractive model.

We got the structural, etc. report last night and it looks like we are going to go ahead.

We aren't financially dependent on this and we're still playing around with what we want it to be. We know that we want to start a salmon hatchery on the river, and we have this idea about making the space and experience available for part of the summer to inner city kids in Canada, the US and the UK. It would also be a lot of fun to make it inviting to artists, and this thread has been very helpful in working through how that might be done in the case of photographers.

Sorry that my eyes, focused on my laptop screen, but apparently not focused enough, confused "normal" for "nominal" :)

If you're dead on at 2 metres, metric is easy :)

[Bruce Barlow]

Hi Bruce,

It's a very interesting and attractive model.

We aren't financially dependent on this and we're still playing around with what we want it to be.

It would also be a lot of fun to make it inviting to artists, and this thread has been very helpful in working through how that might be done in the case of photographers.

If you're dead on at 2 metres, metric is easy :)


Howdy, r.e.!

Yeah, and the doors of my 250-year-old New Hampshire house are about 4 cm shorter than me. Wore a bicycle helmet the first three weeks we lived here while the initial lumps healed. Now I only crack my noggin about once a month.

More suggestions from someone with nothing at stake. We schedule Fine Focus Workshops for when the photography is ineteresting - Fall Foiage, Snow and Ice, springtime, deep summer, late autumn. Each time is special here in New Hampshire. You might want to consider the same idea. When is it really special there? Schedule a week and publicize it to attract folks. I'd be more willing to come when I thought I would run into like-minded folks, so make the date a magnet for the intended audience.

Schedule for the dry season. Rain is tough to deal with if you're trying to photograph outside.

Second, the MacDowell Colony model mixes all media. I think it would be fun to hang out with painters and writers and scuptors and talk to them about how they approach their art. Dinner and post-dinner might just be wonderful as a gathering time. So while media-specific gatherings would be interesting, so would mixed media. Similar to above, you can set dates and advertise.

You might be able to get grants to underwrite some aspects or programs, but then you have to become a professional grant-seeker, which may be neither the best nor most fun use of your time. Grants are fleeting, hard to get, and won't solve all problems.

In my opinion, your venue is wasted on darkroom work. Folks should be out in your world discovering it, not slopping paper in chemicals. Therefore, I would suggest rudimentary darkroom facilities for changing and developing film, and maybe proofing negatives, but no investments in fancy enlargers and a lot of space. Prevent all temptation to be a mole.

You have an advantage in that you can market yourself as an escape from the "real world." Speaking for myself, I like the places I've been that don't have TV, don't have phones, don't have newspapers, do have community dining, and do have interesting things nearby. No distractions. Gets my head on straight.

I'll bet I know at least one workshop instructor who'd trade coaching a three-day workshop for room and board plus a couple more days of room and board so he could go photograph for himself... How tall are the doors?

You have interesting music up there, too, yes? Any of it nearby?

[r.e.]

Hi Bruce,

We are very much on the same wavelength about this.

Except that I would call it an escape to the real world :)

There's no shortage of music, and also a theater that has become very successful despite being located in the middle of noplace: http://www.risingtidetheatre.com/menu.htm

Ten foot ceilings are in short supply, but we can do a little better than two metres.

I think that I'm going to the Celtic Colours International Music Festival on Cape Breton Island next week ( http://www.celtic-colours.com/GeneralInfo.html ), and from there to Newfoundland to finalize this. When the deal is done, I'll send you a note.

Cheers.

[Simon Benton]

The Celtic Colours on Cape Breton island are magnificent - I too am hoping to go there in a few weeks to enjoy the music and take pictures of the magnicinet scenery.
Good luck on your project. Do keep us informed as I am itching to get back to Newfoundland to enjoy the people, the history and the scenery (and the pubs in St. Johns).

[John Bowen]

Sorry to be reviving an old thread, but.....

r.e.,

Did anything ever come of the "photographic escape idea?" Sounds very interesting.

[Bruce Barlow]

Yeah, like John said.

[Nathan Potter]

I was also curious about this thread. I'll be up in the Canadian Maritimes this early summer, PEI, Nova Scotia, Grand Manan Is. and Maine but have always been interested in Newfoundland for photography. Any news?

Nate Potter, Austin TX.

[Jim MacKenzie]

Me three.

I plan to go to Newfoundland & Labrador in June. 5,400 km from home - should be a blast. And my bank card works like at home. :)

[r.e.]

Update... We completed the purchase but will wait for the economy to recover before doing a rebuild. Meanwhile, it makes for a spacious summer cottage for family and friends.

Nate, if you are going to Nova Scotia you should consider visiting Cape Breton Island. From there, if so inclined, you can take the ferry to the west coast of Newfoundland, where there is a national park and world heritage site called Gros Morne. The Viking settlement, possibly established by Leif Ericson, is further up the coast.

Jim, June last year was great for icebergs. This one was visiting just up the road from us...