Hahnemuhle Photo Rag with Photo Black ink???

[Harley Goldman]

West Coast Imaging has a "how to" article on printing with Hahnemuhle Photo Rag and the Epson 9600. The master printer. Terrance Reimer, says he uses Photo black ink instead of matte black, which is normally used on this paper. I have an email into him to ask him about it, but I was curious if anyone else uses photo black with Photo Rag or has ever heard of it. See link to article below.

http://www.westcoastimaging.com/wci/page/info/photoshoptip/tip18.html

[Walter Calahan]

Please keep us posted. I've use this paper in an Epson 4000 printing with the matte ink. Never thought to use photo black.

Haven't tried Photo Rag in my 9600, so I'm very interested in what you learn.

Thanks.

[Kirk Gittings]

Ted Harris has talked about something similar, also limiting the gloss black ink slightly, with the Color Burst RIP. Maybe he will chime in.

[Michael Gordon]

Hi Harley: I've tested PK on Photorag for the heck of it and if you like a really flat look with lower dmax (than MK on Photorag), then maybe you'll like it. If you know what MK looks like on Photorag and you like that, then I'll suggest that you'll hate the way that PK looks on Photorag.

I'm not naming names, but WCI prints a well-known LF photographer's work on Photorag with PK, and I thought it was a big detriment to an exhibit I saw. I really can't understand why PK on a matte paper would be anybody's preference, but to each his own.

[Bruce Watson]

I've tried it too. I get the same results as Mr. Gordon. Speculation as to why this is so is along the lines of the PK containing less pigment, and the pigment it has is ground differently. But the end result on matte papers is considerably lower Dmax. Yuck.

So tell me again: Why is anyone paying any attention to WCI? Or am I the only one who reads junk like this and questions their competency?

[dwhistance]

I'm also somewhat surprised by the suggestion. I've used a PK profile on PhotoRag (when I couldn't be bothered to change inks) but wasn't at all impressed by the results. However there are other things in this article that raise questions; for example they suggest using the canned Hahnemuhle profile with the Epson driver when I would expect anyone producing images professionally to use their own bespoke profiles, probably with a serious RIP for better control of the inks!

David Whistance

[Greg Coates]

I had a couple of color prints made using the Photo Black ink on this paper, and I hated it. The blacks just weren't deep enough.

[Greg Miller]

I'm also somewhat surprised by the suggestion. I've used a PK profile on PhotoRag (when I couldn't be bothered to change inks) but wasn't at all impressed by the results. However there are other things in this article that raise questions; for example they suggest using the canned Hahnemuhle profile with the Epson driver when I would expect anyone producing images professionally to use their own bespoke profiles, probably with a serious RIP for better control of the inks!

David Whistance

If you are using an Epson printer with a closed loop color managment system (4800, 7800, 9800) then any profile will produce the same results on all printers of the same model. So, as long as the manufacturer creates a pretty decent profile, then this practice actually isn't so bad.

[Harley Goldman]

Here is the response from Terrance Reimer, the printer at West Coast Imaging:

"Harley,


Thanks for your email.


The profile that was created by the fine folks at Hahnemuhle was generated using the Photo Black inkset instead of the Matte Black. We are using their profile to generate prints on the 9600/PhotoRag paper combination and have many clients including Jack Dykinga that prefer the softer, less contrasty look of that printer/paper combination. If you are looking for rich blacks using a fine art rag type paper, I would agree that using the 9800/K3 inkset with the Matte Black would be the way to go if that is the look you are trying to achieve, especially if it is a black and white image."