B&W in an icy gulley

[John Kasaian]

Theres a gulley I want to photograph in the dead of winter. Big honkin' icicles form on the sides and in the past winters they looked like stalagtites in a cave and wierd other worldly sculpture, or the pipes on a huge organ. It is a gray, dramatic & moody kind of a place (heroic even---its easy to imagine it as the set for a wagnerian opera) so I'm thinking about which way to approach this to get the look I want (gray, dramatic & moody) I am especially wondering if I should shoot a slower film, say 125 ASA like FP-4+ or 100 ASA Fomapan, or go with more speed and use Tri-X or Tmax 400. There is lots of glare from the ice, but it is also dark because much of the time most of the gully is in a shadow. Also which filters should I take with me? I'm thinking maybe none, but then I may want to darken the blueish cast a bit, so...? The lenses I'll take with me are the 19" Artar for distant details and the 240 G Claron (and maybe the 159mm WA Wollensak Yellow Dot") for everything up close and personal. Oh yeah, I'll be shooting the 8x10. Any suggestions?

Cheers!

[Ole Tjugen]

Ice in a dark gulley is a typical high-contrast scene.

The difficulty with this is to preserve local contrast in the "interesting bits" without losing highlights and/or shadows.

In my experience you may have to use a compensating developer, or resort to other "darkroom tricks" to get a good result.

This example was shot on a 9x12cm glass plate from Slavich, developed in a 2-bath staining developer, and printed on POP. The contrast range is high even for the POP!

[paulr]

A compensating developer sounds like good advice to me.

Also, be careful. Not sure if you're a climber with experience in icy gullies, but they can be dangerous places.

Icicles fall without warning (and they're just the right shap to skewer you). Sometimes whole frozen waterfalls come tumbling down. And the ground under the snow is often going to be a partially frozen creek.

Ice is usually safest if you go when it's at least a few degrees below freezing, and after a period of stable weather. Cold snaps and sudden warmings make the ice unstable.

[David Karp]

I have had success photographing snow scenes with HP5+ and developing it in Barry Thornton's Two Bath developer. Here is the formula and some other information from an older post:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=19918&highlight=thornton.

I have never had a problem using a two bath developer, but there are photographers and chemists who swear that they do not work with modern films. I stopped worrying about it, because it works for me. To be safe, try it on some snow scenes or high contrast scenes before trying it out on the important stuff. expose the HP5+ at 200, FP4+ at 64-80, and Delta 100 at 50.

Best of luck and be safe.

[Jim Rice]

Just be safe, sir.

[Andrew O'Neill]

Yes, be safe. I was thinking the same thing. Those are really hanging spears up there.
In this situation, I would use a pyro developer...well heck, I use pyro for just about every situation.

[David Crossley]

<Just be safe, sir.>

Done lots of this and I would highly recommend a set of non-rigid crampons John. And just to echo what everyone else has offered , keep that weather eye on whats going on above you!



David Crossley/Crossley Photography....

[John Curran]

Hey John,

RE: Contrast

If the scene is indeed gray, dramatic and moody, I'm wondering if a high-key approach might work.

Most importantly, don't forget to bring your hardhat!

Good luck

John Curran

[Ed Richards]

As for filters, a polarizer might help with reflections.

[John Kasaian]

OK, a brain bucket & crampons--no problem. Compensating developer---hmmm, I don't use one and might not have much time to experiment before the trip...any suggestions as to which one I should try? Can I use a compensating developer in a Unicolor processor?

Thanks for all the great advice!

[John Kasaian]

Ole,

Great photograph! Thats definately dramatic and moody!

[John Kasaian]

David Karp,
Thanks for the link---very interesting. I guess the route to go is to make dulpicate shots and develop accordingly?

[George Hart]

One of the most impressive photographs I have ever seen is a carbon print taken in a gully in Antarctica, by Herbert Ponting, shown in miniature here: scroll down to S0000106 (http://images.rgs.org/search.aspx?artistID=7361). The original was in the V&A Museum, London and the range of tonal values is amazing.

[paulr]

OK, a brain bucket & crampons--no problem. Compensating developer---hmmm, I don't use one and might not have much time to experiment before the trip...any suggestions as to which one I should try? Can I use a compensating developer in a Unicolor processor?

Thanks for all the great advice!

What developer do you normally use? It might compensate quite a bit if you just use it at a weaker dilution.

If you go on a hazy day, that might take care of everything for you.

[David Karp]

I guess the route to go is to make dulpicate shots and develop accordingly?

I think that is a good idea. It is my practice to always make to exposures, just to make sure I have not messed something up unwittingly, or to have a spare negative in case I make a mistake in development. The only thing I did before starting to use Thornton's developer regularly was to do an exposure test. I found some open shade area on a sunny day and made 4 exposures of each film. For example, HP5+ at 100, 200, 400, 800.)I developed them together and chose the 200 sheet. (My buddy would have chosen the 400 sheet.) That's it. I have not had a problem yet.

The extra sheet will let you develop in your regular soup if you like once you have developed the first "experimental" sheets.

As far as processing goes, Anchell and Troop say 2 baths are good candidates for rotary processing. I don't know by experience. I use a slosher.

Good luck.