Smooth technique with a Graflok back?

[David Honey]

I've been practising inserting and removing new plastic 4x5 film holders and a Polaroid 550 back in my new/old view camera (a Graphic View II).

With all the gentleness I can muster, I still have the feeling that the camera could easily be jolted out of focus by this operation, such is the 'clunkiness' of of the sprung-back mechanism when pushing in the film holder (yes, I've tried all the variations of lifting and pushing it gently past the locating ridge, etc.).

The springs and everything else seem to be in good operating order. I ran a small amount of light machine oil between the spring's coils, which lessened some friction there and smoothed the operation a bit, but the huge tension and resulting friction doesn't lend itself at all to delicate operation. (I might try a touch of silicon lube on the sliding surfaces next, I think.)

Is this a common complaint? Why wasn't the Graflock back design improved such that the back could be fully opened at once, say, by a single lever, sufficiently to allow interference-free insertion of the film holder? (Probably because it was originally just a press camera feature -- wham, bam, thank you ma'm!)

Sorry to be such an upstart, but I hate to spend all that time setting up only to be cringing in anticipation of throwing things out of whack again so easily.

Has anyone not noticed this? Is there a solution? (Maybe I'm completely missing something ...hmm, this could be embarassing!)

Thanks
Dave

[Robert A. Zeichner]

This is pretty common. Being a press camera, it was designed to be hand held on most occassions. In that situation, the extra tension might actually be an advantage in preventing the back from accidentally being pulled back and causing a light leak. I had the same frustration with one on my Deardorff and decided to have a cabinet maker friend of mine "transplant" the Deardorff wooden back from an old 8x10 reducing back to my 45 Special. It worked great and is just right for my application. There have been numerous backs made with a releasing bail that allows you to completely relieve the spring tension so the holder just slides out. That works very well, but I'm not certain if anyone modifies the Graflok back with such a device. Have you checked out the Graflex users website? I don't remember the URL off hand but I'm sure others can tell you what it is or you can just Google for it. Good luck.

[Henry Ambrose]

There are a couple of things you're fighting. First, with new film holders the crisp, sharp edges are very "catchy" and I find them harder to insert than well used holders. Next it sounds like you may not have enough tripod or you may not be locking it down tightly. You'll be happier with a tripod that is heavy-duty with stout locking mechanisims so that unintended camera movement is not an issue. You may also benefit from a more structured working approach, that includes as its last step, checking every lock to be sure the camera does not move. After a while this will become second nature.

The single lever opening device you wish for is called a bail and some cameras have them. I wish they all did but they don't. Careful with the oil and any other lube. You'll attract dust and probably get oil on your hands which will then transfer to other parts of the camera and filmholders. Dry lube like wax might help on the surfaces of the back and ground glass frame. I'd stay away from silicone.

[Bill_1856]

I've had a GV2 since 1953 and never had a problem inserting the CFHs. Just don't be slam-bang and lock everything down tight and you'll be all right.

[Paul Fitzgerald]

Hi there,

David, on the GV2 there is a simple modification that lets them slide smooth as silk and lock down like a bank vault. When you send it for a CLA, the tech can replace the paper gaskets on the V blocks with 4 brass shim-stock inserts. Works beautifully.

Just a thought.

[j.e.simmons]

The Graflex site is graflex.org

I've used a GVI with the spring back and an Omega view with the Graflock back for about 20-years. As others have said, you need to lock it down on the tripod and carefully insert those new holders. You can't do anything very quickly with large format.

juan

[RichSBV]

Unless you're not tightening things down enough, there's no reason for your camera to be any more difficult than any other camera.

It might just be possible that you're being too gentle in the wrong way?

It all come down to technique. This is how I do it, and I'm right handed in case it makes a difference?

I hold the holder in my right hand. Left hands sits gently on top of the camera back to steady it. Left index finger gently raises the focus panel by pulling out on to upper wing where the holder slided into, just enough to get the holder started into the slot.

Then the left hand moves to the left side of the back to steady the entire camera while the right hand slides in the holder. Yes, the entire camera may shake a bit, but with equal force applied by both hands, the holders just slides into the back. Then make sure it's seated right and locked in the groove. After a little practice this takes no thought and only a second.

I wouldn't recommend any type of oil on the back. But the holders can deffinitely use a touch of paraffin wax or lemmon Pledge on the contact areas to help them slide.

I have many GVII's here with both Graphis (spring) and Graflok backs and there's no problem inserting holders, even Grafmatics, with no camera movement once the technique is mastered. And it's no more difficult than any of my other cameras...

And Robert, the GVII is NOT a press camera. It's a full view camera, and a very nice one at that!

[David Honey]

Thanks everyone for your helpful feedback.

As I thought, it's something you just learn to deal with, and yes I can see that if the camera is locked down on a good tripod there's probably no need to worry.

Still, as an professional mechanic (ha-ha), I can't help myself from trying to make things work better; the small amount of oil I used on the springs disappeared between the coils, and after being worked in, it really smoothed the pulling out of the back frame. Of course, I was careful not to overdo it.

Similarly, spray silicone lube used sparingly is a miracle of anti-friction on sliding surfaces, and shouldn't be a problem as you wipe most of it off and it ends up more or less as a dry film.

That leaves the brute-force tension of the springs, and it seems a bail-type lifter (like I've noticed on a few cameras) might be something to look at.

For now I'll try the traditional route -- slow and careful; maybe I just have to develop the right technique...

Thanks again everyone, great feedback

Dave

[RichSBV]

David,

I'm sorry, I not only didn't notice you had a Graflok, but that you were talking about the coil springs in it. Yes, they deffinitely need a drop of oil. I've had Grafloks so tight that they were comeplel;y unusable until I oiled the springs and the holes in the panel where the shafts go through (same shaft the spring sits around). After that, some working on them, flexing them out and in many times freed them up like new again.

The oil caution was generic. there's no way here to tell a person's experience a know-how. I've heard of people spraying entire backs & such, which kinda makes a mess of things. But you deffinitely sound like you know what you're doing and you're right about a touch of silicon to aid the sliding. I prefer the parafin because it's just easier to work with and was the recommended lubricant by Graflex, and it works great. But again, in very small amounts...

I'm sure you'll work it in and get the hang of it very soon. If you could arrange to see another camera, you could do a comparison. But from what you've said about the lubrication, the Graflok sounds okay. When you flex it, don't worry about pulling it out a good inch or so. I did the flexing on mine with the focus panel off and pulling out the individual arms to get them working again.

Good luck with it...

[David Honey]

Hi Rich. Yes, that sounds like my experience exactly.

For a 50+ year-old design it isn't really too bad though, considering. You can see that ruggedness was more a part of the design criteria than precision!

My next little project will be to try and find a way to reduce the tendency of the GVII front standard to wobble (especially with a heavy lens fitted)...

Cheers,

Dave

[Robert A. Zeichner]

"And Robert, the GVII is NOT a press camera. It's a full view camera, and a very nice one at that!"

Of course you are right. I must not have had enough coffee to comprehend the original post.

[Brian C. Miller]

I open the back slightly with my left hand while the film holder is inserted with my right hand.

Very probably they use the same springs that they used on all of their press cameras. The Graflex six sheet holder needs a back with serious tension to hold it in there while its being operated.

[David Honey]

Thanks very much to everyone who replied to my questions. Things are going smoother now that I have a bit of experience. (It's true that 'everything about LF is slow'!)

This is a great forum!

Cheers,

David