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Phovsho
2-Apr-2017, 22:53
Dear All

I'm about to buy my first 8x10 set up. Whilst I have a Linhoff IV I'm really rather new to LF. I'm attracted to the image making process with an 8x10 as much as anything - taking time out of a busy life. My primary interests are available light portraits and a bit of landscape/street scenes.

Anyways, I am after a high quality wooden 8x10 field camera set up. I'm open to either new or used. My preference would be second hand but I need to be confident that the camera is in great shape and only requiring a little bit of maintenance now and then. I live in New Zealand so shipping a LF camera around the world on a regular basis for repairs gets old (and expensive) pretty quick. So my hesitation with buying used is the camera isn't "as advertised" - always the danger with Ebay.

I generally like fine things and am attracted to the idea of finding a camera first time which is a special camera and a lifetime companion. So willing to spend a bit more on a great example of a great camera (and lenses).

My questions at this stage:

1. Is eBay the best place to buy used? I couldn't see a "buy and sell" section on this forum - I was hoping there was one because here you are more likely to be dealing with true entuasiasts. Are there better alternatives than eBay with respect to LF cameras?

2. There are a number of Deardorffs on Ebay at present. A couple are said to be mint but expensive. Others look a little more used but are potentially smooth nice cameras. I appreciate there are always risks but is this even a sensible path to be taking? I chose Deardorff because of its history and generally good reputation. But I'm not attached to them in anyways - they seemed ow risk and beautiful. Should I forget the nostalgia and buy later cameras?

3. If I went for a younger camera - or even new - any suggestions where and what I might look for? I would love an Ebony, for example, but I haven't seen any 8x10s on eBay. I understand they aren't made any more.

4. In terms of lenses I'm really most interested in a (fast) portrait lens (head and shoulders) and a normal (or slightly wide) lens for environmental portraits and landscape/city street scenes. I really don't know where to begin here. So many choices. In my 35mm and MF film cameras I generally find myself gravitating towards german glass (Leica, Rollei, Schneider etc.) My Linhoff IV has Rodenstock 210mm/5.6 and 90mm/6.7. I don't know where to begin here. So many choices, ages and price points. Any advice appreciated.

I appreciate that many newbies post asking a lot of questions about gear. My challenge is I'm ignorant about LF cameras, other than what I've read on the internet, I don't have the opportunity to try before I buy, and I really want to nail it first time as turning gear over from New Zealand can be expensive. Any help, direction or leads appreciated.

Thank you

Murray

Leszek Vogt
3-Apr-2017, 00:59
Don't wish to dissuade you, but you might want to consider 4x5 as a start. It offers more available film stock, more cameras, lenses, accessories, etc.....and at more reasonable prices too. I do see fairly often someone is trying to sell 8x10 on my local CL for $1200. As to lenses, and perhaps this is too general, you'll have to bite it (sometimes) and get more expensive optic/s just to have the desired film coverage. Sure, there will be slip ups on ebay, etc. and exceptions, but that takes time and dedication....not to mention knowledge. Oh, did I mentioned the phys weight of 8x10 ? ;) Also, it doesn't say anywhere that you have to limit yourself to just one rig.....

Hopefully you'll take the time before you make the final decision. Overall tho, even having the best equipment does not warrant the best results....it's all about the operator.

Personally, I'm giving a 5x7 a chance and see where it goes. Best of luck.

Les

locutus
3-Apr-2017, 01:41
First thing to ask yourself is, what is the intended output? Enlargments? Scans? Contact prints?

Unless you want 8x10 contact prints really consider if 5x4 isn't enough to get started in.

B.S.Kumar
3-Apr-2017, 02:22
Since you already have a Linhof, you might want to get some more experience with it first. I assume you already have a lens or two? If they cover 8x10, great. If not, you might want to look at substituting them for the lenses you'll need for the larger format. But take it slow - handling an 8x10 is a bit different from 4x5. And unless you're shooting Xray or expired film, consider film and processing costs as well.

The Buy and Sell forums will be visible to you after you've been a member for 30 days.

Kumar

LabRat
3-Apr-2017, 02:49
It's not just the camera you will buy, but the entire support system, such as lenses, holders, large tripod, larger changing bag, focusing cloth, film processing equipment, film, cases, bags, etc...

These handle differently than a 4X5, with less DOF, longer exposures due to smaller f stops, less lens extension with longer FOV's, and can be tricky to balance and steady, keep holders dust free, and lug this beast around... But can shine when you get everything right... (But so can a smaller camera...) It would good to try one first to see if it is your thing, so see if some local will let you shoot one of theirs...

As mentioned, if you enlarge, you can make the print any size you can make with a 4X5 and enlarger, but wait until you have to find an 8X10 enlarger...

But the bigger the neg, the contacts will be bigger, so decide what size you want the final prints to be...

Decisions, decisions...

Steve K

Phovsho
3-Apr-2017, 02:53
Dear all

Thanks for the comments. Cautions appreciated. I am seeing 8x10 as an "and" not an "or". So will still have Linhoff 4x5 and other cameras in the MF and 35mm space.

I totally accept the point that a camera is no substitute for talent! But I'm getting older and this is something I want to give a try. I've always been attracted to the lesser travelled road. That said, I'm painfully aware of the compromises - cost, weight, choices etc. However, I do see that there appears to be some pretty good film choices available for 8x10 - including Impossible's instant film (though I hope it performs better than my experience with it in smaller formats).

I'm not sure what I want to do with theoutput. Contact prints for sure - especially portraits. But as much the experience and process of capturing images. The good thing is im in no real hurry so will have an eye out until I find the right camera. Perhaps having to wait 30 days before I can see the "for sale" on this site is a reason and time for reflection.

Thanks again.

Phovsho
3-Apr-2017, 02:58
Steve

Much appreciated. Fortunately I have access to an 8x10 enlarger.

I guess I'm at a point in my life where I'm over convenience - a primary and purported benefit of digital anything. Want to do less better, or at least different. Though that sentiment might change after I've lugged the thing up a hill a few times.

Murray

Luis-F-S
3-Apr-2017, 08:03
I would wait until you can access the For Sale section on this Forum in 30 days after joining. The 'bay is often tricky and can be an overpriced place. There can be many great and not so great buys. If you're not experienced with Deardorffs, I would use extreme caution. One of the Dorffs on the 'bay belonged to a forum member. When you can access the For Sale section, you'll see his ad for the same camera, at a better price. By buying through this forum, you have a better chance of speaking with a knowledgeable individual who will hopefully tell you the plusses and minusses of the camera. I have 6 Deardorffs, so can't say enough about the camera. They're my preference over any of the new cameras being made. Best thing, if you buy one right, you can then sell it for close to what you paid for it if you don't like it. Some of the main things to watch out for is that the bed is not separated at the 4 joints. Not an easy fix. The main wear item on 8x10's are the metal shoes; where the rear frame focuses. Usually the first 1-3" wears from focusing over the years. Bellows can be replaced if needed, I would suggest Custom Bellows in the UK, great company with a great product. I've bought 2 bellows from him this past year and right now the is "reasonable". Just don't buy one of the overpriced "mint" ones from the far East! Feel free to PM me if you have any specific questions about Dorffs. Good luck. L

John Kasaian
3-Apr-2017, 09:18
If you're comfortable enough with your Linhof 4x5 then 8x10 should be an easy transition. I would suggest if possible, to shadow an 8x10 photographer in New Zealand for an afternoon (or morning.) That I think would answer some of your questions.
Some thoughts:

On old 8x10 wood cameras---
They earned their keep back "in the day" in the employ of working photographers and studios, so you'll find them well cared for, that or totally worn out. Unless you enjoy woodworking projects, a well cared for camera with everything working is probably a better choice. Any of the major brands will work if they are in good repair, so the question is how intuitive are they to use, and bellows draw. If you foresee a very long lens (600mm+) in your future, make sure your camera has long enough bellows.

On tripods for 8x10s---
Just make sure they can handle the weight of your camera. Wood tripods of course, look slick supporting wood cameras.

On the lens---
To my eyes, what works on 4x5 does not equate well to 8x10. I'll suggest starting with a "medium" lens between 240mm---375mm.. Use it for awhile and see if you want to add something longer, or wider to your kit. A 14" Commercial Ektar is a very nice lens, btw. I don't have any experience with newer lenses so I'll leave others to comment on those (Fuji, as an example, has quite an enthusiastic following)

On used 8x10 film holders---
Test them with photo paper first. Don't waste time/money on leakers. If you do end up with a leaker, save it for parts. Some prefer wood holders, some plastic. What's important is that they are light tight.

On focusing dark cloth---
Just like on your 4x5 only a lot bigger.

On a focusing loupe---
Your choice.

On 8x10 film---
Unless someone else is buying the film (or you're very wealthy in which case I'd like to introduce you to my daughter,) you'll likely never shoot color film.
If you shoot Ilford in the Linhof, I suggesting sticking with Ilford in 8x10 since you already "know" it.

Good luck and have fun!

DrTang
3-Apr-2017, 09:23
get a deardorf..get a 14" commercial ektar...get a 10" wide field ektar

start shootin

David Lobato
3-Apr-2017, 09:51
I have two Kodak Commercial Ektar lenses. Optically they are very nice. However, the Acme shutters are not always reliable. In New Zealand, I'd suggest modern lenses from Schneider/Rodenstock/Nikon/Fuji/Caltar in Copal shutters. I also have a Deardorff and one main advantage is that it has plenty of movements, more than I have ever needed. My 8x10 Conley for example does not have front tilt, and rear tilt is very limited. No swings or shifts, and its bellows draw is limited. The Deardorff delivers capability for many more situations.

Alan Gales
3-Apr-2017, 10:11
For a wooden camera if you decide on new then look at Chamonix. For a used wooden camera I would also look at Deardorff or a used Chamonix if you can find one.

Modern lenses are modern lenses and they all look similar as in contrasty and sharp. So a Japanese Nikon or Fujinon will look similar to the German Schneider or Rodenstock. Don't worry about brand if buying a modern lens. Let price and condition be your guide as to which to buy.

Kodak Commercial Ektars are great. I own a 14".

Phovsho
3-Apr-2017, 21:36
Thanks all.

I am going to pursue the Deardorff angle a bit further. I'm also going to look into older lenses - like the Kodak Ektars folks are suggesting.

I will need a tripod and head. Is wood feasible? Or just heavy vs carbon? I love the romance of wood.

Is Freestyle photo recommended as a place to buy film? I notice they have the big three names but also some other interesting choices.

Best

M

locutus
3-Apr-2017, 23:26
Berlebach wood tripods are nice, they have some affordable models that could hold a 8x10 fine.

Leszek Vogt
3-Apr-2017, 23:27
As a visual reference for lenses you can look up Monthly Portraits here. Similar with landscapes.

I'm using CF, since it's lighter and folds to 28 inches, but Ries (wood) has a good following, and so does Berlebach and Wolf. Each of us have faves so you'd need to tailor to your style and camera weight.

Freestyle is fine...I've bought from them before and am currently awaiting some items. Usually B&H is pretty responsive too. But heads up on Amazon, I've ordered some Foma film and it took over a month before it reached my front steps....just saying.

Les

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 06:44
Thanks all.

I am going to pursue the Deardorff angle a bit further. I'm also going to look into older lenses - like the Kodak Ektars folks are suggesting.

I will need a tripod and head. Is wood feasible? Or just heavy vs carbon? I love the romance of wood.

Is Freestyle photo recommended as a place to buy film? I notice they have the big three names but also some other interesting choices.

Best

M
Freestyle's Arista .edu Ultra film is re badged Fomapan. Good stuff but doesn't seem to handle situations where reciprocity comes into play very well. Check the images posted by other photographers here and you'll see some incredibly fine results of images shot using Fomapan/Arista.edu Ultra.
For a real economical film, you may wish to try x-ray film. A search should bring up the posts on x-ray films with examples---probably not what you'd want for portraits however as they are Ortho.
Currently I'm shooting mainly Ilford, with Arista.edu Ultra as a back-up.

Luis-F-S
4-Apr-2017, 06:45
I'd get a Ries A-100 or the equivalent in your country

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 06:58
As far as the best place to buy film, ask your fellow 8x10 LF'ers in New Zealand----I'd imagine it is deuce-idly expensive and they'd know who has the best deal delivered.

In the US, I buy Ilford film from Badger Graphic, or B and H if Badger Graphic is out of stock, Arista/Fomapan from Freestyle, and x-ray from CXSOnline, but I don't know what any of their export policies or service would be like.

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 07:01
I'd get a Ries A-100 or the equivalent in your country
Aye, a Deardorff just needs to be on a Ries.
When hiking, I'll save some weight by leaving the head at home, Drew-style.

Alan Gales
4-Apr-2017, 07:31
I've owned both Berlebach and Ries wooden tripods. My Berlebach was really nice but I prefer the Ries with it's leg locks. Of course Ries is more expensive.

A Ries A100 would work great for a Deardorff. I use the lighter J100 for my lightweight Wehman 8x10. I think John Kasaian uses the J100 on his Deardorff V8. I trust his judgement.

If you do buy a Ries then make sure you pair it with a Ries double tilt head. They are more of a platform than a head and are as sturdy as you can get. They are also enjoyable to use.

I actually own both the A100 and J100 both with double tilt heads. They are very expensive new but I was able to find good deals used on Ebay.

Alan Gales
4-Apr-2017, 07:31
Aye, a Deardorff just needs to be on a Ries.
When hiking, I'll save some weight by leaving the head at home, Drew-style.

Hey, John. Don't you use the J100 with your Deardorff?

Thom Bennett
4-Apr-2017, 07:44
I know you specifically mentioned a wooden 8x10 but, as a former Deardorff user, I can recommend the Kodak Master (KMV). Metal, a bit more movements than a Deardorff, very quick focusing via the sliding front tracks, has front shift, and costs about 50 - 75% less than a Deardorff. Same size and weight. If you are looking for the charm of a wooden camera then you can't beat a Deardorff or even a nicely finished Kodak 2D. Just wanted to let you know there are options other than wood and pricey studio rail 8x10's.

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/kodak/masterview.html

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 08:06
Hey, John. Don't you use the J100 with your Deardorff?

Yes, but I also have an A100.
Funny how Ries tripods multiply, ain't it? ;)

Thom Bennett
4-Apr-2017, 08:33
Yes, but I also have an A100.
Funny how Ries tripods multiply, ain't it? ;)

No matter what camera you end up with it MUST be mounted on a Ries. Otherwise, the ground glass goes dark, all movements seize up and you will be banished to the nether reaches of medium format.

Luis-F-S
4-Apr-2017, 09:40
Yes, but I also have an A100.
Funny how Ries tripods multiply, ain't it? ;)

Have 3 a J-100 for the V5, a J-100-2 for the V8, and an A-100 for the V11.

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 11:47
No matter what camera you end up with it MUST be mounted on a Ries. Otherwise, the ground glass goes dark, all movements seize up and you will be banished to the nether reaches of medium format.

This only happens with V8 'dorffs. Other 8x10 cameras don't seem to have this issue.
I have it on good authority that once, when a studio mistakenly mounted a V8 'dorff on a Gitzo it caused the New York Blackout of 1977!

bgh
4-Apr-2017, 12:59
This only happens with V8 'dorffs. Other 8x10 cameras don't seem to have this issue.
I have it on good authority that once, when a studio mistakenly mounted a V8 'dorff on a Gitzo it caused the New York Blackout of 1977!

Well, things makes more sense now. I have my Korona, and formerly the KMV, mounted on an entirely inadequate tripod and head, and I thought that I noticed flickers in the power around me. Clearly, it is time to indulge my lust for a Ries, to keep harmony in the grid.

Bruce

Jim Noel
4-Apr-2017, 13:54
No matter what camera you end up with it MUST be mounted on a Ries. Otherwise, the ground glass goes dark, all movements seize up and you will be banished to the nether reaches of medium format.

No thanks. I prefer an Otto which is lighter and stronger than similar sized Ries. I have three Otto's as well as a couple of Ries. I'll use one of the Otto's 9 out of 10 times.

Thom Bennett
4-Apr-2017, 14:07
No thanks. I prefer an Otto which is lighter and stronger than similar sized Ries. I have three Otto's as well as a couple of Ries. I'll use one of the Otto's 9 out of 10 times.

Jim, we're going to have to give you 20 lashes with a wet piece of Tri-X and banish you from the land for your transgressions.

Jac@stafford.net
4-Apr-2017, 14:12
I generally like fine things and am attracted to the idea of finding a camera first time

Therein is the root of your issue. Fine things are not always good things. Your first camera is unlikely to be your last unless you quit the format. LF is not complicated enough to cause a search for the Grail.
.

Luis-F-S
4-Apr-2017, 14:29
Why I said don't pay stupid money, that way if you decide a certain camera is not a good fit for you, you can always sell it for (around) what you paid for it. If you buy new, you're going to take a serious hit!

Alan Gales
4-Apr-2017, 14:32
Therein is the root of your issue. Fine things are not always good things.
.

Yeah, the snobby crowd can keep their caviar, escargot and fine wine. I'll take a bratwurst, some fries and a cold beer any day!

I guess that's why I bought a used Wehman. Nothing fancy. It just works.

Jac@stafford.net
4-Apr-2017, 14:55
Yeah, the snobby crowd can keep their caviar, escargot and fine wine. I'll take a bratwurst, some fries and a cold beer any day!

I guess that's why I bought a used Wehman. Nothing fancy. It just works.

Indeed! Oi, what a cheat! A view camera that works well without prestige! I sympathize with new persons who might be correct in choosing expensive everyday technology think the same applies to a technology such as LF photography which has a 160 year history.

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 15:11
Finding a used 8x10 is sort of like what happens in the original Planet of The Apes.
I went from a B&J to a KMV and finally settled down with a V8 'dorff.
It's a good fit for me and how I shoot (I find it intuitive, I guess that's what they call it.)
If an affordable 'dorff (this was when catalog houses were selling off 8x10s and 'dorffs were a glut on the market) hadn't presented it's self to me when it did, I could have easily been smitten by an Agfa Ansco or Century Universal---most likely the Century Universal for the clam shell design and lighter weight---I don't think my negatives would have known the difference either way.
If you have the luxury of availability, you can pick and choose what works for you.
Oh, and The Planet of the Apes?
We never did learn if Linda Harrison is Charlton Heston's idea of a 'dorff or KMJ or Wehman or Ebony, only that they ride off together to re-establish the human race.
In the rarefied atmosphere of 8x10 photography, sometimes you just have to take what's available (not meaning to imply that Linda Harrison is chopped liver, LOL!)

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 15:21
No thanks. I prefer an Otto which is lighter and stronger than similar sized Ries. I have three Otto's as well as a couple of Ries. I'll use one of the Otto's 9 out of 10 times.

I thought Ottos were built by Ries under contract and sold by Otto Engineering as surveyor's tripods?

Jac@stafford.net
4-Apr-2017, 15:33
John Kasaian mentioned the Deardorff V8, and because I am divesting I've nothing to lose by my opinion that the Deardorff V8 is the Harley Davidson Dresser of cameras - overbuilt, overweight, clumsy, over-rated. Whew! My conscience is purged. :)

I sincerely look forward to correction from our participants.
.

Jim Galli
4-Apr-2017, 17:24
John Kasaian mentioned the Deardorff V8, and because I am divesting I've nothing to lose by my opinion that the Deardorff V8 is the Harley Davidson Dresser of cameras - overbuilt, overweight, clumsy, over-rated. Whew! My conscience is purged. :)

I sincerely look forward to correction from our participants.
.

Jac, Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, as usual. The only reason I don't still have an 810 Deardorff is that the front standard is not strong enough to hold up those exasperatingly heavy portrait lenses that you also likely think are folderol :cool:

Luis-F-S
4-Apr-2017, 17:38
Holds all the Dagors and Artars I use just fine, up to the 30" one!

John Kasaian
4-Apr-2017, 19:36
Legend has it that the mahogany used to build Deardorff's came from Chicago bars that were closed down during Prohibition.
When the light isn't right, or while waiting for the wind to calm, the intrepid 'dorff shooter can contemplate such things.

Sometimes when I'm with that old 'dorff I swear I can hear this playing in my head---
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKc06R-zNvk&index=21&list=RDwqDIIuZ-joU

Duolab123
4-Apr-2017, 19:40
I use my Saltzman tripod and head for my V8. Of course the tripod is so heavy I haven't been outside with the Deardorff in 2 years. I found my V8 in a second hand store, bought it from a 80+ year old piano tuner, who is still tuning pianos out of his retirement center. The Deardorff is a thing of beauty, no refinishing this, it's seen some use but not abused. I absolutely love it. I am going to get out, but I need to hire a interested young person to help lug the tripod.

It's one of the last things I will let go, there's definitely something to be said for getting the one you want first. I just had to wait 40 years to find mine. I vote for the Commercial Ektars as well, they are perfect for a nice old Deardorff, or a Kodak Master View.
Mike

Jac@stafford.net
5-Apr-2017, 13:49
Jac, Wrong, Wrong, Wrong, as usual. The only reason I don't still have an 810 Deardorff is that the front standard is not strong enough to hold up those exasperatingly heavy portrait lenses that you also likely think are folderol :cool:

Wrong as usual? Gee, Jim, I'm still an apprentice at 71 years-old. You are you so strident! :)

I have a cure for long, heavy lenses. You have used one of mine, I hope, a Voigtlander #7.

163483

When all else fails I use a lens support like this which accommodates the Deardorff V8 or any LF of 8x10 or smaller.

163484

Shown above is a heavy true 3" Bigon, not a 75mm, nor a typical military 75mm. It has an image circle far greater than either of them because its rear element is larger than 4". I can post examples.

Okay, this is a picture of the 3" focused at infinity with the bellows removed.

163485

Jim Galli
5-Apr-2017, 14:08
Wrong as usual? Gee, Jim, I'm still an apprentice at 71 years-old. You are you so strident! :)

I have a cure for long, heavy lenses. You have used one of mine, I hope, a Voigtlander #7.
.

The cure is to send those heavy old things to me. I was hoping you'd have a laugh. Of course the big cannons were never meant to leave the studio in the first place. But the Kodak 2D can handle sizes well beyond what the Deardorff would tolerate. Plus it has room inside for a Packard shutter. So the 2D became my "do-all" machine these many years.

For the 'dorff fans, I maintain an 11X14 V11 and a 4X5 5X7 Deardorff in my arsenol. But 2 lovely 8X10's have come and gone.

Jac@stafford.net
5-Apr-2017, 14:29
The cure is to send those heavy old things to me. I was hoping you'd have a laugh. [...] But 2 lovely 8X10's have come and gone.

I sent you one, the Voigtlander #7, and thank you, I did have a laugh.

I'm dumping my very clean Century 1 because although it is very lightweight and handy, I will persist with a Green Monster because it is rigid, precise. I will use it for as long as I can carry it, which I fear is not much longer.

Best,
Jac

John Kasaian
6-Apr-2017, 06:44
Since the OP already shoots a 4x5 Linhof, I'll suggest a Kodak Master View might be on option to his liking as, being metal, it brings a lot more precision to the 8x10 party.
And all that money saved from not buying furniture polish could then be channeled into film!

Alan Gales
6-Apr-2017, 09:09
Since the OP already shoots a 4x5 Linhof, I'll suggest a Kodak Master View might be on option to his liking as, being metal, it brings a lot more precision to the 8x10 party.
And all that money saved from not buying furniture polish could then be channeled into film!

I did a lot of research before I bought my 8x10. I wanted something below $1000 but couldn't find anything I liked. I sold some gear and raised my price to $1500 and started looking at Deardorff's, Kodak Masters and used Wehmans. Fortunately, a used Wehman came up on Ebay for $1500 starting bid. Lucky for me, I was the only bidder.

I'm happy with the Wehman. It's lighter weight is nicer on my bad back. Besides the little extra weight, the Deardorff and Kodak Master seem like very nice cameras. I don't think anyone could go wrong with any of the three.

Phovsho
6-Apr-2017, 18:25
Thanks everyone

At this stage I'm probably going to wait until I can see the "for sale" section here, feeling its probably less risky than eBay. Though if something special comes up on eBay...

I'm tending towards the Deardorff option, or a late example of some of the newer cameras. I think I will go for the Kodak Commercial Ektar 14" as my portrait lense - or similar. I will look for a similar vintage as a normal or slightly wide lense. I have relatively modern Rodenstock lens for my 4x5, so though going for old school lenses would make sense. I am looking at the wooden tripod options, as advised by some of the folks above, but want to make sure I can source a camera before I get those bits.

If anyone has a camera or a lens they think I could be interested in, or come across one, don't hesitate to ping me.

I found the suggestion that I look at some of the photos in other parts of the forum very useful, especially the rolling monthly portrait series. Thank you for that.

Thanks again.


Murray

carylee2002
6-Apr-2017, 19:39
I just recently purchased from Ebay an old 8x10 Kodak 2d in relatively very good to mint condition for around $550.00 including an 5x7 reducing back. I find that after using both my Ebony 4x5 and Anniversary Graflex for using my old brass lenses, having the 8x10 is a good option..especially if you already own old RR brass lenses to cover the whole 8x10 focal plane. In addition...im currently looking for a small brass Darlot pillbox lenses for landscape work.

Vaughn
6-Apr-2017, 22:20
I have the Zone VI 8x10. Almost as good as a Deardorf. After carrying it around for a decade or so, I sure would not mind something lighter. But then, I just added a Fuji W 360mm/6.3 to my camera pack - a heavy lens!

My only lens for the 8x10 for a long while was a Fuji W 300/5.6. Big Japanese glass, but perhaps something similar in German glass might suit you. Slightly wide...a wide normal. Just spent two weeks in the desert and I was surprised to see my 300mm not get a lot of use. Had fun playing with my new 360mm, especially with the longer views one can get in the desert. But I also use my Fuji W 250mm/6.7 a lot. I have a modified darkslide that puts two 4x10 images on a sheet of 8x10 film. The 250mm was used a lot for 4x10s this trip.

If you get the 14" lens (355mm), then perhaps something around 240 or 250mm (or up to 300mm) would be a good landscape lens to pair up with it. I suggest modern glass/shutter for your landscape lens -- just for reliability.

Phovsho
6-Apr-2017, 23:42
Thanks for the advice.

I'm going to take my time. Find a nice example and have a system I can be happy with for years.

Best

Murray

Phovsho
8-Apr-2017, 19:51
Any suggestions for a good focusing cloth?

Thank

M

Alan Gales
8-Apr-2017, 20:09
I use a BlackJacket with my 8x10. If you want really dark then you can't beat it. It is a bit slower to use with it's sleeves but I'm never in a hurry with 8x10.

I used to use BTZS with 4x5. They are plenty dark enough for most people and quicker to use than the BlackJacket.

Both are fine focussing cloths. There are others out there or you could make your own.

Phovsho
8-Apr-2017, 22:54
Thanks Alan.
Where can I buy one of the Blackjackets? They don't seem to be stocked at B and H. Is there a website?
Thanks for the heads up.
Best
Murray

Robert Brazile
9-Apr-2017, 03:35
The URL I have for the Blackjacket is this one (http://quietworks.com/FRAMES_FILES/BJ_SPECIFICATIONS/BJ_NEW_HOME_FRAME_.htm).

Robert

John Kasaian
9-Apr-2017, 07:55
I asked my bride to sew one for me, black on one side, white on the other.
Dimensions are found in Steve Simmons' Using The View Camera which I highly recommend.

Alan Gales
9-Apr-2017, 09:15
Thanks Alan.
Where can I buy one of the Blackjackets? They don't seem to be stocked at B and H. Is there a website?
Thanks for the heads up.
Best
Murray

Robert gave you the correct URL. I believe Quietworks is the only distributer. At least that is what they say on their website. I own the Hybrid model myself. It's pretty big so after I insert my film holder, I drape the BlackJacket over my bellows to protect against light leaks.

Alan Gales
9-Apr-2017, 09:20
I asked my bride to sew one for me, black on one side, white on the other.
Dimensions are found in Steve Simmons' Using The View Camera which I highly recommend.


+1 on the Steve Simmons' book. I own a copy myself. It's kind of like a large format for dummies book. It's real easy to understand with plenty of pictures to demonstrate what Mr. Simmons is telling you. ;)

Phovsho
9-Apr-2017, 22:18
Thanks Alan

I have one on the way

Best

M

Duolab123
10-Apr-2017, 21:45
Thanks Alan.
Where can I buy one of the Blackjackets? They don't seem to be stocked at B and H. Is there a website?
Thanks for the heads up.
Best
Murray

I have a blackjacket for my 8x10, awesome. Get one you won't be disappointed.

angusparker
11-Apr-2017, 06:35
My two cents:
Buy new holders - the Toyo ones. They are precision and won't leak. Why have a weak link in you system when film is so pricey? That is really the only thing new you need in your kit IMHO.

Consider Fujinon lenses - cheap, multicoated, modern shutters, some are quite small. The dark horses of the modern lens manufacturers.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Louis Pacilla
11-Apr-2017, 09:11
My two cents:
Buy new holders - the Toyo ones. They are precision and won't leak. Why have a weak link in you system when film is so pricey? That is really the only thing new you need in your kit IMHO.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This just simply has NOT been my experience. I bought used Fidelity/Regal that looked to be in great condition & I have never had a light leak I have probably 45 or more 8x10 plastic holders all in great condition.

angusparker
11-Apr-2017, 09:13
This just simply has NOT been my experience. I bought used Fidelity/Regal that looked to be in great condition & I have never had a light leak I have probably 45 or more 8x10 plastic holders all in great condition.

Light leaks are less of an issue than the holders not being square / flat. The modern plastic Toyo holders have much higher tolerances than any of the old wooden holders.

John Kasaian
11-Apr-2017, 09:58
I've never owned Toyos so I can't comment on them, but I seldom have any problems with my plastic Lisco Regals and black wooden Graflex made for Eastman Kodaks.
If you store them correctly, they shouldn't warp.

Alan Gales
11-Apr-2017, 11:41
I've never owned Toyos so I can't comment on them, but I seldom have any problems with my plastic Lisco Regals and black wooden Graflex made for Eastman Kodaks.
If you store them correctly, they shouldn't warp.

Awwww, John. You ought to try the Toyos. Make sure you buy at least five so you can load a box of ten negatives. Here is a link.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/61078-REG/Toyo_View_180_908_8x10_Sheet_Film_Holder.html

Seriously, the Toyo's are really nice. I've got five or six 4x5 Toyo holders that I picked up very slightly used off Ebay. I wish I could afford the 8x10 Toyo holders but as you well know, it's no biggie that I can't. My used Fidelity Elites work fine.

Jim Galli
11-Apr-2017, 13:16
Any suggestions for a good focusing cloth?

Thank

M

I'm the guy that's an embarrassment at a large gathering of LF folks. I insist on using an old blue heavy sweatshirt. Poke your head in the head hole backwards and wrap the waist area around the camera. Sometimes I even use the sleeves for the focus glass. (which is an old Nikon 50mm f1.8E held backwards). Every time I save enough money to look proper, I buy another antique lens instead, so guess I'm doomed to using the "poor boy" black jacket. But, and this has happened multiple times, if the wind comes up and temp drops, my dark cloth can keep me warm on the way back to the truck.

Phovsho
11-Apr-2017, 14:25
On the issue of film holders, what about a good and suitably sized film changing tent? Any recommendations?

Best Murray

biedron
11-Apr-2017, 14:35
On the issue of film holders, what about a good and suitably sized film changing tent? Any recommendations?

Best Murray

The Harrison changing tent by Camera Essentials is great. For 8x10 the "Jumbo" size is much more comfortable to use, but the "Regular" size will do in a pinch, or if you mostly shoot 4x5 and only occasionally shoot 8x10.

Bob

Alan Gales
11-Apr-2017, 16:53
I use the Harrison Jumbo tent myself. Here is a link. Notice it has a 5 star rating.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/search?Ntt=Harrison%20Jumbo%20tent&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&typedValue=&Top+Nav-Search=

Just never ever use the tent while wearing mosquito repellant (DEET). The DEET has a chemical reaction with the tent material and makes it sticky. Some of our forum members found this out the hard way.

Phovsho
11-Apr-2017, 17:41
Thanks for the heads up. Will order one.

Best

John Kasaian
11-Apr-2017, 17:42
On the issue of film holders, what about a good and suitably sized film changing tent? Any recommendations?

Best Murray

I have a old Panavision changing bag. These were originally for the magazines used on Panavision film cameras used by motion picture production companies. Nice if you can find one.

vlad
12-Apr-2017, 06:47
Intrepid are about to run Kick-starter campaign for 8x10 camera if the budged is issue. They will be going for 450.- brand new, which is fantastic price!

Alan Gales
12-Apr-2017, 07:57
Intrepid are about to run Kick-starter campaign for 8x10 camera if the budged is issue. They will be going for 450.- brand new, which is fantastic price!

That's great news! The Intrepid people were on APUG a few years ago asking what members wanted in a budget 4x5 camera. I told them then that there were not a lot of great options out there for budget 8x10 cameras.

vlad
12-Apr-2017, 10:13
That's great news! The Intrepid people were on APUG a few years ago asking what members wanted in a budget 4x5 camera. I told them then that there were not a lot of great options out there for budget 8x10 cameras.

I can't wait for this. I'm working with 4x5 for quite some time, always wanted to try 8x10 but never really felt like spending that crazy money these cameras usually go for. Plus the weight in indeed unpractical. Intrepid are making wooden constructions that look solid enough. Light for sure!

angusparker
12-Apr-2017, 10:54
The Harrison changing tent by Camera Essentials is great. For 8x10 the "Jumbo" size is much more comfortable to use, but the "Regular" size will do in a pinch, or if you mostly shoot 4x5 and only occasionally shoot 8x10.

Bob

+1

Phovsho
12-Apr-2017, 16:19
Is there any information on the web about the intrepid/kickstarter project ?

Qamaro
12-Apr-2017, 18:45
Well they released a video on their social media channels that the kickstarter will be out in May for the 8x10.

https://twitter.com/Intrepidcamera

carylee2002
13-Apr-2017, 02:56
Intrepid are about to run Kick-starter campaign for 8x10 camera if the budged is issue. They will be going for 450.- brand new, which is fantastic price!

If the camera can't handle vintage brass lenses..it is a no go for me....That is why i chose to get Kodak 2D 8x10's.

Phovsho
16-Apr-2017, 15:17
Hi Everybody

I've been given a lot of advice from a number of members, but a special thank you to Luis.

As an update I have purchased a Deardorff V8 from a forum member - which looks to be beautiful.
I also purchased from a forum member an Artar 18", which has been much loved. Now looking out for a Kodak WF 250mm/10" Ektar - so anyone with any leads would be much appreciated.
I scored a few second hand 8x10 holders off ebay. Still looking for 2-3 more.
I ordered a Ries J200-2 Tripod + J250-2 Head.
I have a BlackJacket coming.

What more do I need?

1. a long throw cable release
2. a loupe for focusing
3. A backpack for taking my Deardorff, a few lenses, some film holders etc into the field.

Any advice on products and where to buy, would be much appreciated.

I have to say how encouraged I am by the constructive nature of this forum. A very different set of cultures and attitudes than the Leica forum I used to frequent!

Thank you.

Murray

Luis-F-S
16-Apr-2017, 16:12
Hi Everybody

I've been given a lot of advice from a number of members, but a special thank you to Luis.

As an update I have purchased a Deardorff V8 from a forum member - which looks to be beautiful.
I also purchased from a forum member an Artar 19", which has been much loved. Now looking out for a Kodak WF 250mm/10" Ektar - so anyone with any leads would be much appreciated.
I scored a few second hand 8x10 holders off ebay. Still looking for 2-3 more.
I ordered a Ries J100-2 Tripod + J250-2 Head.
I have a BlackJacket coming.

What more do I need?

1. a long throw cable release
2. a loupe for focusing
3. A backpack for taking my Deardorff, a few lenses, some film holders etc into the field.

Any advice on products and where to buy, would be much appreciated.

I have to say how encouraged I am by the constructive nature of this forum. A very different set of cultures and attitudes than the Leica forum I used to frequent!

Thank you.

Murray

You're on your way Murray. Film, you need film, not much good without film! Hopefully you can get that in NZ without having to import if from here. If not, there are plenty of choices, B&W has been my film go to for 20 plus years! Can't help much with the cable release, I bought mine over 30 years ago and they still look like new! I think they were made in Japan, but don't quote me. Maybe Kumar can chime in. The Nikon AR3's look nice and B&H has them.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/37073-REG/Nikon_664_AR_3_Mechanical_Cable_Release.html

For focusing I use a pair of 5x reading glasses that I had made years ago. Also have a Toyo Loupe, but usually use the readers. I'm too old for a backpack. I'd rather a cart to pull behind me with the camera in a case. Daniel Stone makes great camera wraps, I've bought 4 from him and I just ordered a 5' x 7' darkcloth from him for the V11.

I think you'll be very pleased with the Deardorff, I would have bought that one myself if I hadn't just bought another one a couple of weeks prior! What are member's thoughts on using a 250 SF Fujinon instead of the WFE? I'm planing on using the SF as a wide lens for the V11 and just stop it down so it's sharp! Anyone's thoughts on this? L

Chris7521
16-Apr-2017, 16:22
Hi Everybody

I've been given a lot of advice from a number of members, but a special thank you to Luis.

As an update I have purchased a Deardorff V8 from a forum member - which looks to be beautiful.
I also purchased from a forum member an Artar 18", which has been much loved. Now looking out for a Kodak WF 250mm/10" Ektar - so anyone with any leads would be much appreciated.
I scored a few second hand 8x10 holders off ebay. Still looking for 2-3 more.
I ordered a Ries J200-2 Tripod + J250-2 Head.
I have a BlackJacket coming.

What more do I need?

1. a long throw cable release
2. a loupe for focusing
3. A backpack for taking my Deardorff, a few lenses, some film holders etc into the field.

Any advice on products and where to buy, would be much appreciated.

I have to say how encouraged I am by the constructive nature of this forum. A very different set of cultures and attitudes than the Leica forum I used to frequent!

Thank you.

MurrayOne thing you may want to come up with or purchase is protection for the ground glass during transport. I made my own but, I'm sure someone makes them.

Jac@stafford.net
16-Apr-2017, 16:27
One thing you may want to come up with or purchase is protection for the ground glass during transport. I made my own but, I'm sure someone makes them.

I used to make them as well. Here is the my last for a Deardorff V8, shown partially withdrawn. I would make a batch but I doubt there is enough demand to make it worthwhile.

163902

Phovsho
16-Apr-2017, 17:07
Hi Luis

For film I usually shop at Freestyle in the USA. I have been in touch with Kumar also.

I have ordered a few packs of B and W to get me started. Contemplating Velvia 50.

Best

Murray

John Kasaian
16-Apr-2017, 20:19
If you go with a 250 WF Ektar and it's in an Ilex Universal, then a Gepe release should fire it reliably.
That's the combination I use.
If your Artar is in a Acme or newer shutter then it probably shouldn't require a longer throw release, so if you opt for 250mm Fuji in a modern Copal instead, a longer throw release shouldn't be necessary.

John Kasaian
16-Apr-2017, 20:23
FWIW, Igor has both a 250W Fujinon and a 10"/250mm WF Ektar in stock
http://www.igorcamera.com/large_format_lenses.htm

Kevin J. Kolosky
16-Apr-2017, 21:51
You say you want a wooden camera, but let me suggest that you check out Sinar cameras. I have owned a Sinar F2 8 x 10 camera that was wonderful. Wish I would have never sold it. And now I own a Sinar P2 4 x 5 camera that is also wonderful. The beautiful thing about Sinar is their modularity. You can start with just about anything and end up with anything else that you want. I especially like the Sinar shutter. You just need one shutter for all of your lenses. Talk to Ken Lee about his Sinar. you can see a lot of the work he has done with his Sinar on this forum.

Luis-F-S
17-Apr-2017, 06:22
You say you want a wooden camera, but let me suggest that you check out Sinar cameras. I have owned a Sinar F2 8 x 10 camera that was wonderful. Wish I would have never sold it. And now I own a Sinar P2 4 x 5 camera that is also wonderful. The beautiful thing about Sinar is their modularity. You can start with just about anything and end up with anything else that you want. I especially like the Sinar shutter. You just need one shutter for all of your lenses. Talk to Ken Lee about his Sinar. you can see a lot of the work he has done with his Sinar on this forum.

Kevin, I own 3 Sinar F2's and a 4x5 & 8x10 P. Although they are wonderful cameras, I for field work, I always use my Deardorffs. The Sinars are just to heavy to practically move them around other than in the studio. I did use the F2 for architectural work, but that is a different animal than the P's. L

Kevin J. Kolosky
17-Apr-2017, 11:45
Luis

I don't disagree that Sinar Cameras are a bit heavy. Especially the P series, with the F being much lighter. I had no problem hauling around my F2 8 x 10 when I had it. The heavy stuff is the glass. If you don't want to carry around much weight you have to look for glass in the F8 or F 9 range instead of the f 5.6 range. And if you only need one shutter for all of your lenses you don't have to carry around the weight of a bunch of shutters.

Instead of worrying about weight do a few pushups every morning:D

The other great thing about them is their availability. Lots of them for sale in all configurations. If you don't see it this week it will probably be available next week.