TRB Tripod Issues

[Smitty]

Anyone have one of these? It is plenty sturdy but I cant get a solid lock on the legs etc. No matter how tight I make the locks the legs will still move. With an 8x10 camera on top I am concerned that this will fail on me.
Thinking of making up a pin system to lock the slides on the legs and strap system to prevent the legs from spreading.

Steve

[mdarnton]

I don't think the legs are supposed to lock the way you are trying. Even when I tighten the legs on mine, they're still relatively floppy. That's why the metal brackets on the first level of leg locks have a little attachment loop in the inside for a chain--to set the leg spread if you don't have ground to jam the feet into.

I haven't dug in on experimenting because my slightly later tripod does have one-position leg locks, but I see that a later version of the same thing has levers nuts for tension. If we took ours apart, I bet that we would find that the connecting bolt threads are not long enough to allow the same kind of locking. I have wondered, though it's not important to me, if adding one or two washers under the nut would raise the nut enough to give an extra turn so that it would tighten enough to give the same kind of tension, but then I also wonder if the new models with the flippers have some sort of teethed gripping surfaces built in to provide friction, something we don't have.

I have also been wondering if just throwing an industrial boot shoelace ring down around the legs would be non-stretchy enough to keep the legs from moving. That would be easy enough.

Anyway, I see possible solutions, but they don't involve tightening the nuts as they now exist.

[mdarnton]

I assumed you were talking about spread. Were you referring to length locks? In that case, mine are fine, and I'm no help on that.

[Smitty]

Not seeing loops around the bottom leg locks... I am thinking perhaps a ratchet strap around the bottom of the lower leg locks.
Also, where the camera attaches to the tripod there is a round plate with like rubber and a 3/8 bolt. Was there no head above that where you could have movement of the camera without changing tripod settings? Literately have to screw the camera onto the tripod?
Used a Bogen 3050 with 3047 head on my last 8x10 camera...

[Smitty]

Michael,
We have spoken before regarding Verito. I have a 14.5", really hangs off front of the camera.
What are you shooting 35 with? Looks like M stuff.. All of your images very nice.

[Smitty]

Dummy me, just discovered the ball head. Put a ratchet strap around the bottom of lower locks. Seems to hold things in place

[Jac@stafford.net]

A ratchet strap is good. So is the previous suggestion of a spread-retention line. A rock bag also helps. There are both on this different tripod.

146661

[mdarnton]

Michael,
We have spoken before regarding Verito. I have a 14.5", really hangs off front of the camera.
What are you shooting 35 with? Looks like M stuff.. All of your images very nice.

Thanks. Mostly Leica M4s with a bit of Nikon SLR.

Look on the inside of the upper leg-length band, and there probably is a tiny loop pressed up out of the steel. It's not much, so you might have missed it. This is for a small hook. The original chain design is a ring in the middle with three short chains radiating out, each with a tiny s-hook on the end.

I have a Bogen 3039 head on my wood tripod. It seems just a bit big, but I know it will take the load. The 3047 is probably a better match by size, but not as stiff as the 3039. My favorite 8x10 head is the 3057, but that would be too silly-big on this tripod.

You don't say what camera you are using, but my two big cameras are Agfa-Anscos. They have two tripod holes, one too far forward, one too far back, since the original tripod has a platform head with screws for those holes. I have a 36cm Heliar on the 8x10, and it's a huge weight, so I made a platform for the camera that's 1/2" birch plywood, about 5 inches wide, that spans both tripod holes, bolted into them. Then, with the lens in place and the camera focused as I normally would, I found the balance point, and put a Bogen hex plate there. The platform stiffens up the camera a lot, too. I don't take that camera out, so it's not a logistical problem. That camera is on the 3057 head on a 3046 tripod. Great for the studio.

--M

[Smitty]

8x10 Deardorff and a couple of smaller lenses which should be no problem. Also 14.5" Verito which hangs out a bit, have been exploring Cooke options but that is honkin chunk of glass in 8x10 format. They are very heavy and wondering if too much for the camera. Is your Heliar a Universal? Was wondering if that is a pretty large lens.

S

[Bob Salomon]

You have an older Berlebach UNI tripod. As mentioned, there are small hooks on the inside of the legs to accept a spreader chain. You can also use some strong twine but the chain is better. You can see it if you go to the Berlebach web site. While you are there send them a note about your leg locks not working properly and they should be more then willing to help you. You can also check with the current Berlebach distributor, Omega Brandess but they will probably just refer you to the factory site.

[Chauncey Walden]

I give up, what is a TRB tripod? Is it a Berleback like Jac's picture?

[mdarnton]

Theodore Bromwell..... imported Berlebachs under his own name. The i.d. tags have only the large "TRB" letters. This is the version I have, with a spring-loaded vertical pin to limit leg spread by catching the metal crossbar between the sides of the leg: http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/naIAAOSwzgRWvjmU/s-l1600.jpg

[mdarnton]

I just found this: https://www.berlebach.de/?bereich=details&id=115&sprache=english
Maybe you aren't the only one with this problem!

Here's the chain: https://www.berlebach.de/?bereich=details&id=71&sprache=english

[mdarnton]

I went to the hardware store this weekend and bought six wavy spring washers (two per leg) to put directly under the acorn nuts on my tripod legs. The fundamental problem is that the nuts bottom out before full pressure is reached; great for keeping the nuts there, not so good for tightening the legs. With the washers in place the legs are now just tight enough to stay where they're put until they are on the ground. This isn't enough to hold them where you put them for supporting purposes, but it's nice not to have the legs flopping all over the place.

The nuts are no longer locked in place by bottoming out, but I assume I will notice them loosening as the legs start to get floppy.

[Jac@stafford.net]

I went to the hardware store this weekend and bought six wavy spring washers (two per leg) to put directly under the acorn nuts on my tripod legs.

An excellent solution!

For those unfamiliar they are also called wave disc springs and are very cool because they can be stacked in parallel or in series, depending upon orientation. In series the total force is equal to one spring, but the deflection (compression) is twice the distance; in parallel they have twice the force and the deflection of one spring. With enough room for deflection they can be mixed!

[Bob Salomon]

I went to the hardware store this weekend and bought six wavy spring washers (two per leg) to put directly under the acorn nuts on my tripod legs. The fundamental problem is that the nuts bottom out before full pressure is reached; great for keeping the nuts there, not so good for tightening the legs. With the washers in place the legs are now just tight enough to stay where they're put until they are on the ground. This isn't enough to hold them where you put them for supporting purposes, but it's nice not to have the legs flopping all over the place.

The nuts are no longer locked in place by bottoming out, but I assume I will notice them loosening as the legs start to get floppy.

2 months ago I told you that you have a Berlebach and to contact the factory. Did you do this? They have excellent support.

[mdarnton]

That was not me--that was another poster. I'm fine with fixing stuff myself. Anyway, in this case the problem was an intentionally incorrect design, from the user's standpoint, not a defect. I understand what they did..... and it was wrong. They were trying to prevent the user from controlling something they themselves couldn't control because of seasonal wood expansion, without allowing that the user might actually have a brain: idiot-proof vs good. Lots of companies do this, much to our loss.

[mdarnton]

In that vein, I refer you to this amusing thread: http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155297

[Bob Salomon]

That was not me--that was another poster. I'm fine with fixing stuff myself. Anyway, in this case the problem was an intentionally incorrect design, from the user's standpoint, not a defect. I understand what they did..... and it was wrong. They were trying to prevent the user from controlling something they themselves couldn't control because of seasonal wood expansion, without allowing that the user might actually have a brain: idiot-proof vs good. Lots of companies do this, much to our loss.

Then perhaps the factory would be interested in your findings.

[Jac@stafford.net]

What Berlebach could be. This is mine. The levers are clutches that allow one to pull a lever out, then tighten to set tension and it is done. To readjust position, just pull a lever out again and move the it to a convenient position to clear working space, which is rarely necessary.

IMHO (emphasizing Humble) this how they should have been made. I got my original when they were considered bargains at less than $100USD.

149220

Anyone can add these lever clutches, but a more economical and effective solution has been posted by Michael Darton.

[Bob Salomon]

What Berlebach could be. This is mine. The levers are clutches that allow one to pull a lever out, then tighten to set tension and it is done. To readjust position, just pull a lever out again and move the it to a convenient position to clear working space, which is rarely necessary.

IMHO (emphasizing Humble) this how they should have been made. I got my original when they were considered bargains at less than $100USD.

149220

Anyone can add these lever clutches, but a more economical and effective solution has been posted by Michael Darton.

Sorry, but that is how they have been made for several years.

[Jac@stafford.net]

Sorry, but that is how they have been made for several years.

Yes, for their overpriced high-end models. It was not always that way. Any of us can add that feature after a trip to the hardware store.
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[mdarnton]

I actually have flip handles on order from China, $8 for three, I think. But I figured I'd try washers while waiting.

[Bob Salomon]

Yes, for their overpriced high-end models. It was not always that way. Any of us can add that feature after a trip to the hardware store.
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It has been on all models for at least a decade.

[Jac@stafford.net]

It has been on all models for at least a decade.

There might be one such for the center column, but for each leg? Show me.

[Bob Salomon]

There might be one such for the center column, but for each leg? Show me.

Go to their web site

[Jac@stafford.net]

Go to their web site

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