Graflok Back Lock Standard - Does it exist?

[rbultman]

I am not talking about the standard for DDS film holder, i.e. ANSI-IT3.108.

I wondering about the dimensions relating to the slides that allow one to attach a roll film holder, or example, to a Graflok back, thickness of the flange that is engaged by the locks, etc. Is this a standard?

Thanks,
Rob

[vinny]

Calumet roll film holders fit graflok backs. As well as others.

[rbultman]

Calumet roll film holders fit graflok backs. As well as others.

Yes, but I'm wondering of the interface dimensions were every standardized through ANSI or some other standards body.

[IanG]

I think the Graflok came out after the ANSI/BS standards for sheet and plate holders.

No there's no standard for the Graflok but the way the sliders work allows them to be flexible and there's no standard for the thickness of DDS either. In fact the Graflok gg frame from a a Pacemaker Graphic won't fit a Super Graphic, there's two differing Cambo style Grafloks as well, those are the ones I have experience with.

Ian

[BrianShaw]

That surprises me a bit that there was no standard, but nothing is too surprising anymore. I would think that the data that might be associated with a standard could be collected easily by measuring a couple of samples.

[Dan Fromm]

I am not talking about the standard for DDS film holder, i.e. ANSI-IT3.108.

I wondering about the dimensions relating to the slides that allow one to attach a roll film holder, or example, to a Graflok back, thickness of the flange that is engaged by the locks, etc. Is this a standard?

Thanks,
Rob

Slides? What slides?

Cambo offered a couple of "International" backs without Graflok sliders for the 2x3 SC-1 that accept 2x3 roll holders that attach to Graflok backs. The backs have a rectangular gate, as you'd expect, with edges that slide into the roll holder's grooves. Regular normal 2x3 Graflok backs' sliders engage those grooves.

Cambo's little 2x3 International backs can't hold sheet film holders in place. Cambo offered a 2x3 bail back for them.

[IanG]

That surprises me a bit that there was no standard, but nothing is too surprising anymore. I would think that the data that might be associated with a standard could be collected easily by measuring a couple of samples.

Some of the items used with a Graflok back existed before Graflex introduced the Graflok system, their film packs holders for instance, and roll film holders for spring backs as well.

The term International back was used in the UK to indicate a Large format back that accepted modern ANSI/BS plate and film holders, it shouldn't be confused with the Graflok and similar removable GG screen frame and the sliders used to hod accessory backs in place.

Ian

[Dan Fromm]

Ian, my Cambo accessories list calls backs that accept Graflok accessories International backs. Language isn't standardized either.

[IanG]

Ian, my Cambo accessories list calls backs that accept Graflok accessories International backs. Language isn't standardized either.

I agree, in the UK book form plate holders were the norm before WWII although a few cameras used modern style plate/film holders which were almost standard in the US. So in our market the adaption of the new ANSI/BS/DIN standard for film & plate holder was the first International standard that allowed modern DDS to be used in almost all new LF cameras of the same format and allowed inter changeability between US/UK inch sizes and their equivalent European metric sizes and also the UK half plate with the US 7x5 DDS.

Ian

[rbultman]

Slides? What slides?

Cambo offered a couple of "International" backs without Graflok sliders for the 2x3 SC-1 that accept 2x3 roll holders that attach to Graflok backs. The backs have a rectangular gate, as you'd expect, with edges that slide into the roll holder's grooves. Regular normal 2x3 Graflok backs' sliders engage those grooves.

Cambo's little 2x3 International backs can't hold sheet film holders in place. Cambo offered a 2x3 bail back for them.

I obtained the attached picture from this site: http://lommen9.home.xs4all.nl/Graflex%20Holders/index.html

No idea if this is acceptable or not. Mods, please delete this post if it violates any policy or copyright.

The slides I am referring to are the ones used to remove the ground glass panel and attach roll film holders onto the back of the 4x5 camera. As others have stated, many cameras use this mechanism to allow attachments from other manufacturers to be attached to their cameras. I call them slides -- perhaps they have other names.

I suppose that it is not the actual slides themselves that are important as there exist both slide designs and rotating "D-wheels" designs for securing backs. What is important would be the dimensions of the flanges and other features that mate to the slides relative to the back. It would seem to be an extension of the DDS standard as both use the same features on the back.

144859

[Dan Fromm]

I know what you mean by slides. I call 'em Graflok sliders.

You're right, what's important is the dimensions of the plates' edges. You call these flanges and with 4x5 that makes great sense; not so much with the not-to-be-mentioned here 2x3. If you look at how they go on the camera, you'll see that the plates have to be the same size -- length and width -- as standard sheet film holders. If larger they won't fit the camera, if smaller they risk not being light tight as well as falling off.

I just measured the edges of Graflex RH-8 (to fit 2x3 Graflok), 2x3 (to fit 4x5 Graflok) Linhof Super Rollex and 6x12 Sinar (to fit 4x5 Graflok) roll holders. 4.80 mm. 5.90 mm, and 5.65 mm respectively. If there is a standard Graflex made it. Ain't no standard.

Side comment. I think of Sinar roll holders as insertion types but they have slots that Graflok sliders will grab. They're more securely attached with the sliders engaged.

[europanorama]

Beside this i have an information from most probably tony sansone(yes he is around but busy):
Its about register: hope its the right term here.
comparing these 6x12 filmbacks:

Horseman
Linhof
Arca Swiss
Sinar
Horseman and Arca Swiss have different register than the others.

[Oren Grad]

Side comment. I think of Sinar roll holders as insertion types but they have slots that Graflok sliders will grab. They're more securely attached with the sliders engaged.

Most of them. The very latest ones - IIRC only the Zoom2 model - lost the slots.

[Oren Grad]

The slides I am referring to are the ones used to remove the ground glass panel and attach roll film holders onto the back of the 4x5 camera.

This is two different things. The design of the hook or other catch that retains the GG panel is not at all standardized. I don't think the thickness of the Graflok mounting plate for whatever the accessory is, is strictly standardized either, but in 20 years of fiddling with a variety of back/accessory combinations, I can't recall encountering a Graflok accessory with a mounting plate that was too thick for the sliders on any camera back I tried it with.

[IanG]

This is two different things. The design of the hook or other catch that retains the GG panel is not at all standardized. I don't think the thickness of the Graflok mounting plate for whatever the accessory is, is strictly standardized either, but in 20 years of fiddling with a variety of back/accessory combinations, I can't recall encountering a Graflok accessory with a mounting plate that was too thick for the sliders on any camera back I tried it with.

It's not even standard with Graflex cameras, the focus panel from a 5x4 Pacemaker Graphic Graflok back won't fit a Super Graphic. There's also two different Cambo types that aren't interchangeable.

Ian