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Duolab123
24-Nov-2015, 20:24
I just picked up a nice zone vi vc cold light. Very good condition, works as expected. No fancy timer but has a photo cell and a ready light. Instructions claim if you do a quick blank exposure before you make your print it will give consistent prints. I use Beseler dichro 45s head for vc printing with excellent results but I would like to be able to do split exposures, this unit allows you to change filtration without touching the head from the box.
Just looking for any comments or advice on using, the rheostats for the two tubes have letters, not really sure if there is any chart that translates to paper grades, but if both dials are set to the same letter I would expect grade 2.

Anyone who has some experience with this head I would like to hear your experiences, comments.

Thanks, Mike

peter schrager
24-Nov-2015, 20:41
I did have a chart for the settings at one time. Photo techniques magazine had an as article I believe. Although I was a great follower of Fred picker and zone vi
I felt the 5x7 enlarger and the 2 light system never lived up to the hype. I do have the 5x7 cold light with one tube that I adapted to a Burke and James enlarger...just use filters now...

Luis-F-S
24-Nov-2015, 21:15
Although I was a great follower of Fred picker and zone vi I felt the 5x7 enlarger and the 2 light system never lived up to the hype. I do have the 5x7 cold light with one tube that I adapted to a Burke and James enlarger...just use filters now...

I had both the Type I & II and never cared for either. Ended up replacing them with a Durst. L

neil poulsen
25-Nov-2015, 00:14
I had the Type I enlarger and currently have the Type II. Type I was dismal for 5x7; it was actually an oversized 4x5 that "mistakenly" got dubbed a 5x7. So, it didn't cover 5x7. Nor was it consistent in contrast from print to print, even with the Zone VI, compensating enlarging timer.

I currently use my Type II chassis with a 45s head for 4x5 and smaller negatives. (I have one of the few Beseler adapters that were made for the Zone VI enlargers.) I just recently purchased a Type II 5x7 head.

Reading your post between the lines, I gather that you have the Beseler Zone VI head that Calumet designed and sold at about the time that they upgraded the Type I Zone VI enlarger to the Type II? If so, expect longer than typical exposure times. I've not tried one, but they have that reputation. I saw one for the first time at a traveling exhibit that Calumet was doing after they purchased Zone VI, and even the Calumet rep was saying that the Zone VI head designed for Omega D series enlargers was more consistent than that designed for Beseler enlargers.

If you want to do split printing, I wouldn't mess with both dials at the same time. I believe that you would have a wider contrast range, if you split-print with Green (OFF) Blue (ON) for for the hard exposure, and Green(ON) Blue (OFF) for the soft exposure. I suppose that you could vary the times and/or the dials for each exposure.

In spite of Calumet's claims (at the time) that the Type II heads are internally controlled for consistency separately for green and blue, I would still try to find a Zone VI compensating enlarging timer. I think that you would get better results. If you do split-printing in the fashion described in the previous paragraph using the Zone VI compensating timer, as you change the dials, the timer will counter compensate. But, I would still advise getting the timer.

Nor would I assume that, if the dials are set to the same letter, one could expect a Grade 2 exposure. I wouldn't even assume that A-A = B-B = C-C, etc. in contrast.

For split printing with the Zone VI head, you might consider doing some testing to determine what combination of hard and soft exposures gives you a contrast that's about the same as that from your 45s without filtration, and call that your medium (Grade 2?) contrast. Then, vary your contrast as appropriate from there.

Peter Lewin
25-Nov-2015, 05:32
As Neil points out, for split grade printing you don't need the contrast chart. Nonetheless, here is the link: http://www.bnimages.com/files/zonevicontrast.pdf

ic-racer
25-Nov-2015, 06:04
Use it to print 'freestyle.' After a test print, you can add more green to darken highlights and less green to lighten highlights. Likewise you can use more blue to darken shadows and less blue to lighten shadows. The letters on the dials are for your own future reference if you want to duplicate something.

John Layton
25-Nov-2015, 06:18
I picked up a complete Zone VI series 2 setup - XL enlarger, 5X7 VC head, compensating timer w/light cell, and light controller box, all in mint condition for a song a couple of years ago...and have been using this for split grade printing. The main driver of my deciding to go with this enlarger setup is that its well configured to fit into my existing darkroom setup. I had been offered a Durst 810 for free earlier, but it simply would not fit!

Right away I noticed that the blue channel flickered a bit when powered up to full...so I cut the central (main power) control down to a setting of "6." In this way I can still set each channels separate intensity to "full" without needing to see in the dark each time I set the channels for split printing - and while the overall intensity is now somewhat diminished, I can do effective and efficient splits with no flickering.

A good friend has found that with his Z-VI setup, gluing mirror strips into the VC light head (around the inside perimeter underneath the light tubes) both evens out and slightly intensifies the light output. I have not done this yet - but might.

As for your original question regarding the efficacy of the Zone VI VC light sources - I have heard some noise, earlier on the forum, regarding Fred Picker's early negotiations with Aristo going badly...with the result that he needed to settle for "inferior" tubes from a different company. Not sure about the factual accuracy of this - but my other cold light heads are all manufactured by Aristo, and they have always performed perfectly - with no hint of flickering or other inconsistencies.

And yes, due to the Zone VI VC tubes visibly changing outputs...not only during initial warmup but also a tendency to, occasionally, vary slightly during actual printing despite having been "stabilized," I completely agree with the suggestion to acquire the meter-cell driven, compensating timer. Amazing to hear the duration between beeps change as the intensity changes - a brilliant solution to a problem which should not exist in the first place!

cowanw
25-Nov-2015, 06:53
and there is this
http://www.jbhphoto.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/vcclcaljbharlin1.pdf

John Layton
25-Nov-2015, 07:40
Regarding the above link...yes - this offers a methodology for calibrating for various VC papers responses to blue and green light - with the aim of assigning specific color channel settings to achieve good equivalents of specific contrast grades for each paper.

True split grade printing, on the other hand, requires no such testing - as all that's needed, for any VC paper, is a test strip run through either (blue or green) channel, followed by a second test which overlays the "best time" exposure of this first channel with a series of exposures with the other channel, and from the result of this obtaining an approximation of what will work for the image in question. Admittedly this is very intuitive - although over time I've found it getting easier to "pre visualize" a generally close ratio of blue to green light to acquire a decent "base image" prior to fine-tuning. At this point I don't even consider the numerical equivalents to contrast values. I simply go with what looks right. But I can see two sides to this, and that I may in fact be losing my sense of "numerical exactitude" while enhancing my intuitive skills.

Although generally I'm finding that the split grade approach offers, at least for a certain portion of my images, a very powerful tool in the moderation of local contrasts within a given negative, I do admit that there are those cases for which the split grade approach simply makes no sense, and only remains to present extra work (logistically and mentally) to achieve the same results. Thus the above mentioned methodology for assigning contrast grade equivalents is a great suggestion - which I vow to follow at some point!

Peter Lewin
25-Nov-2015, 07:49
A couple of comments on the ZoneVI "wandering intensity" issue. First, the compensating enlarging timer is definitely a worthwhile addition for anyone using the ZoneVI head, since it changes the timing interval depending on the reading from the cell inside the head. I print with the blue and green tubes simultaneously, more or less following the contrast chart I linked to in an earlier post, and the timer also compensates for the effective intensity changes as you fine-tune the contrast. The second "work around" is that despite the built-in heater in the head, and the compensating timer, I throw the enlarger into "focus" mode once my print is in the fixer, so that the tubes stay well warmed up; when I put the enlarger back into "timer" mode and slide another sheet of paper into the easel, there isn't much time for the tubes to change temperature.

neil poulsen
25-Nov-2015, 08:09
One advantage I noticed with split printing is the ability to dodge/burn separately for low and for high contrast areas.

None the less, I tried split printing and decided that my style of printing didn't align well with this really interesting method of exposure.

John Layton
25-Nov-2015, 08:17
A question I have regarding the use of the compensating timer while printing with two channels simultaneously...assuming that each tube may vary in intensity during an exposure - would each tube to this simultaneously? And if not - would this mean that the color ratios would therefore change...and that, regardless of the compensation, the assumed contrast might still not be accurate? Just a thought.

Duolab123
25-Nov-2015, 20:03
I had the Type I enlarger and currently have the Type II. Type I was dismal for 5x7; it was actually an oversized 4x5 that "mistakenly" got dubbed a 5x7. So, it didn't cover 5x7. Nor was it consistent in contrast from print to print, even with the Zone VI, compensating enlarging timer.

I currently use my Type II chassis with a 45s head for 4x5 and smaller negatives. (I have one of the few Beseler adapters that were made for the Zone VI enlargers.) I just recently purchased a Type II 5x7 head.

Reading your post between the lines, I gather that you have the Beseler Zone VI head that Calumet designed and sold at about the time that they upgraded the Type I Zone VI enlarger to the Type II? If so, expect longer than typical exposure times. I've not tried one, but they have that reputation. I saw one for the first time at a traveling exhibit that Calumet was doing after they purchased Zone VI, and even the Calumet rep was saying that the Zone VI head designed for Omega D series enlargers was more consistent than that designed for Beseler enlargers.

If you want to do split printing, I wouldn't mess with both dials at the same time. I believe that you would have a wider contrast range, if you split-print with Green (OFF) Blue (ON) for for the hard exposure, and Green(ON) Blue (OFF) for the soft exposure. I suppose that you could vary the times and/or the dials for each exposure.

In spite of Calumet's claims (at the time) that the Type II heads are internally controlled for consistency separately for green and blue, I would still try to find a Zone VI compensating enlarging timer. I think that you would get better results. If you do split-printing in the fashion described in the previous paragraph using the Zone VI compensating timer, as you change the dials, the timer will counter compensate. But, I would still advise getting the timer.

Nor would I assume that, if the dials are set to the same letter, one could expect a Grade 2 exposure. I wouldn't even assume that A-A = B-B = C-C, etc. in contrast.

For split printing with the Zone VI head, you might consider doing some testing to determine what combination of hard and soft exposures gives you a contrast that's about the same as that from your 45s without filtration, and call that your medium (Grade 2?) contrast. Then, vary your contrast as appropriate from there.

Thanks for your comments, Yes I have the Beseler adapter model, I use my 45S Dichro, Yellow and Magenta simultaneously to allow for constant exposure, I think I got the chart out of Ansel's last big book. This seems for the most part to allow for constant exposure times while letting you adjust contrast, I will probably continue to do this for most of my printing.

I have an extra Beseler chassis so I figure I will put this head on it and play with it. I'm mainly interested it doing the split double exposure and adjustable burning etc. for difficult negatives. I've never been a big fan of cold lights, but I got this for 200 bucks, so I figure I will have some fun with it. I will probably take a negative that is pretty "Normal" make prints with my current set up at 1, 2, 3 and then try to duplicate with the cold light head.

No matter what procedure I use, I rarely try to make a finished print in one session I do some ring around prints dry them, then come back and make the final prints. Something tells me that this setup may require some patience from me to master.

So if my head has the light sensor does this make it a "Type II" the head has the little green light on it, phone cord to the controller etc. just like you describe. Really appreciate your input. Everything you are saying here make sense to me. Not sure I want to spend any real money for one of the fancy timers, But I may get to really like this.

Duolab123
25-Nov-2015, 20:16
A question I have regarding the use of the compensating timer while printing with two channels simultaneously...assuming that each tube may vary in intensity during an exposure - would each tube to this simultaneously? And if not - would this mean that the color ratios would therefore change...and that, regardless of the compensation, the assumed contrast might still not be accurate? Just a thought.

This thought came to me last night, while reading everything I could find on this, there is a YouTube video of a fellow, demonstrating the timer.

Seems like this would only work by using 1 tube at a time?? Maybe I will just try the thing and see what happens.

Keith Pitman
26-Nov-2015, 07:31
I've never seen one except in pictures, but I believe the first version VC heads had a very large control box where the later control boxes were much smaller. I don't think the first version heads were made for Bessler enlargers. If you posted a picture, you could get a definitive answer.

On the control box, set the Brightness setting to a midpoint--I use 5 1/2. As someone indicated earlier, the bulbs are more stable if not set to the highest level.

In addition to the Zone VI compensating timer, the RH Designs Vario can connect to the Zone VI head (with the correct cable) as can the Metrolux timer. The Vario facilitates F-Stop printing.

I occasionally do split grade printing, but usually use both lights together. After testing to find the alpha dial setting that are equivalent to paper grades (which are not consistent between papers anyway), I now use a more seat of the pants approach. I usually start with a setting of E-E for soft and hard contrast for tests strips and first prints, and then vary the dials to zero in on the appropriate contrast for the image. After using this approach a few thousand times, I have pretty good judgement of how much adjustment is needed.

Zone VI enlargers are a little like ball heads: some people hate them, some like them, and some of us learn to make them work.

ic-racer
26-Nov-2015, 08:10
I occasionally do split grade printing, but usually use both lights together.

That is not split grade printing.

Keith Pitman
26-Nov-2015, 09:27
That is not split grade printing.

Read my post again.

Duolab123
26-Nov-2015, 09:44
I've never seen one except in pictures, but I believe the first version VC heads had a very large control box where the later control boxes were much smaller. I don't think the first version heads were made for Bessler enlargers. If you posted a picture, you could get a definitive answer.

On the control box, set the Brightness setting to a midpoint--I use 5 1/2. As someone indicated earlier, the bulbs are more stable if not set to the highest level.

In addition to the Zone VI compensating timer, the RH Designs Vario can connect to the Zone VI head (with the correct cable) as can the Metrolux timer. The Vario facilitates F-Stop printing.

I occasionally do split grade printing, but usually use both lights together. After testing to find the alpha dial setting that are equivalent to paper grades (which are not consistent between papers anyway), I now use a more seat of the pants approach. I usually start with a setting of E-E for soft and hard contrast for tests strips and first prints, and then vary the dials to zero in on the appropriate contrast for the image. After using this approach a few thousand times, I have pretty good judgement of how much adjustment is needed.

Zone VI enlargers are a little like ball heads: some people hate them, some like them, and some of us learn to make them work.

Thank you for your input. I have looked at the Vario timer, just a little out of my budget right now. I think I will just start by making some split exposures and see where that takes me. My current color head gives me very consistent results on straight prints for easy negatives, but I occasionally run into a negative that requires a lot of dodging and burning. I watched the video of "Darkroom Dave" and became very interested. Thanks to everyone for the info, I need to get to work.

neil poulsen
26-Nov-2015, 10:06
This thought came to me last night, while reading everything I could find on this, there is a YouTube video of a fellow, demonstrating the timer.

Seems like this would only work by using 1 tube at a time?? Maybe I will just try the thing and see what happens.

This was exactly the problem with the Type I, even with 4x5, which it could abundantly cover. The "overall exposure" (whatever that means) would remain constant using the compensating timer, but the contrast could vary. And yes, I think that the Type I enlarger could be excellent (with the compensating timer) for split printing. Type I was quite bright. It powered the head from the huge control box, versus the Type II, which powers the unit from within the head. Of course, this places constraints on the weight of the transformers, etc. I was really disappointed, when I discovered this contrast problem with my Type I. It's why I purchased the Type I Beseler adapter from the remaining Type I stock that Calumet received from their Zone VI purchase.

Calumet was aware of this contrast problem, when they redesigned the Type I as the Type II enlarger. Their fix was to include two sensors, one for green and one for blue, and thereby internally compensate the power for each to maintain the same contrast. I'm not positive about this, but I believe that there's a third sensor that's accessed by the Zone VI compensating timer to control overall exposure.

It's worth noting that Calumet also designed a separate, smaller head, that included the Type II technology, but that adequately covered 5x7 and could be used on a Type I chassis. (That was classy on their part.) They even sold it at a substantially lower price, if one could produce their original Zone VI receipt for their Type I.

When I've used my Type II head (that I'm pretty sure has the same design as yours), I've enjoyed the process. I dial in a beginning setting and vary from there to achieve the print that I want. Thereafter, I record the settings in the print notes for that negative.

Just to confirm, there was no Beseler, nor Omega design based on the Type I technology.

I like the Zone VI enlargers that I've had. I think that Fred Picker and the Zone VI crew really did set out to design the best enlarger they could. It's built like a tank, it was oversized (for 4x5), both the Type I and II had interchangeable heads between 5x7 and 8x10, and they were careful to build in adjustment capability for each of the three planes. (Paper, lens, and negative.) It was Zone VI that innovated compensating timers for enlargers and for developing film. These timers were a substantial contribution to the field. They were also careful to design negative carriers that didn't exclude part of the image. (A pet peeve of mine, this is not true of even the Durst negative carriers that I've seen.)

I don't think that the Zone VI enlargers are quite as good as Durst enlargers of course, but being machined, the Durst enlargers (and the DeVere's, etc?) are in a class by themselves. I have the 8x10 head for my Type II, and I like it's less complicated design. It also doesn't take up the space of the Durst enlargers, which are huge. (I use mine with a 240mm enlarging lens.) It doesn't require the power consumption of the Durst heads. Etc. As one can probably tell, I'm quite satisfied with my choice of Zone VI equipment.

Duolab123
26-Nov-2015, 18:43
This was exactly the problem with the Type I, even with 4x5, which it could abundantly cover. The "overall exposure" (whatever that means) would remain constant using the compensating timer, but the contrast could vary. And yes, I think that the Type I enlarger could be excellent (with the compensating timer) for split printing. Type I was quite bright. It powered the head from the huge control box, versus the Type II, which powers the unit from within the head. Of course, this places constraints on the weight of the transformers, etc. I was really disappointed, when I discovered this contrast problem with my Type I. It's why I purchased the Type I Beseler adapter from the remaining Type I stock that Calumet received from their Zone VI purchase.

Calumet was aware of this contrast problem, when they redesigned the Type I as the Type II enlarger. Their fix was to include two sensors, one for green and one for blue, and thereby internally compensate the power for each to maintain the same contrast. I'm not positive about this, but I believe that there's a third sensor that's accessed by the Zone VI compensating timer to control overall exposure.

It's worth noting that Calumet also designed a separate, smaller head, that included the Type II technology, but that adequately covered 5x7 and could be used on a Type I chassis. (That was classy on their part.) They even sold it at a substantially lower price, if one could produce their original Zone VI receipt for their Type I.

When I've used my Type II head (that I'm pretty sure has the same design as yours), I've enjoyed the process. I dial in a beginning setting and vary from there to achieve the print that I want. Thereafter, I record the settings in the print notes for that negative.

Just to confirm, there was no Beseler, nor Omega design based on the Type I technology.

I like the Zone VI enlargers that I've had. I think that Fred Picker and the Zone VI crew really did set out to design the best enlarger they could. It's built like a tank, it was oversized (for 4x5), both the Type I and II had interchangeable heads between 5x7 and 8x10, and they were careful to build in adjustment capability for each of the three planes. (Paper, lens, and negative.) It was Zone VI that innovated compensating timers for enlargers and for developing film. These timers were a substantial contribution to the field. They were also careful to design negative carriers that didn't exclude part of the image. (A pet peeve of mine, this is not true of even the Durst negative carriers that I've seen.)

I don't think that the Zone VI enlargers are quite as good as Durst enlargers of course, but being machined, the Durst enlargers (and the DeVere's, etc?) are in a class by themselves. I have the 8x10 head for my Type II, and I like it's less complicated design. It also doesn't take up the space of the Durst enlargers, which are huge. (I use mine with a 240mm enlarging lens.) It doesn't require the power consumption of the Durst heads. Etc. As one can probably tell, I'm quite satisfied with my choice of Zone VI equipment.

Thanks so much for your comments and everyone's help in bringing me up to speed on this equipment. Now I need to get into the darkroom and get going.

Duolab123
9-Apr-2017, 20:00
A year and a half later now. I recently aquired a helluva deal on darkroom stuff. Including a like new Metrolux II timer. I am still learning, but the Metrolux works great with the Zone VI head. I do what Darkroom Dave recommended start with a test strip at both tubes around 2 1/2 contrast then divide that time in two and make two exposures at 0 and 5. This gets you in the ballpark. Sometimes you need to increase the soft grade but not the time. And sometimes you need to increase the time on the hard but leave at grade5. You just couldn't do this with cold light without an integrating timer.
Very cool.
Best Mike