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Melnick Studios Inc.
24-Apr-2015, 01:27
:D New Drum Scanner (for me): CROSFIELD CELSIS 240 / HOWTEK D4500

I plan on starting out with Silverfast 6.6 and if I feel the need I'll upgrade to DPL 8.0. Can anyone recommend a stable SCSI card and cables for my system(s) please?

SYSTEM 1:
Processor: Intel Core i7-3930K CPU @ 3.20GHz
Installed memory (RAM): 32.0 GB
System Type: 64-bit OS
Motherboard: ASUS P9X79-PRO
Slot Type: PCI-e

SYSTEM 2:
Processor: Intel Core i7-2700K CPU @ 3.5GHz
Installed memory (RAM): 16.0 GB
System Type: 64-bit OS
Motherboard: ASUS P8Z68-V LX
Slot Type: PCI-e and PCI (LOW PROFILE ONLY - 2U SERVER CASE)

Thanks!

-Jeremy

vinny
24-Apr-2015, 05:41
Correct me if I'm wrong but you need a scsi to firewire converter like this (http://www.ratocsystems.com/english/products/FR1SX.html) to get it to work.

fishbulb
24-Apr-2015, 06:00
The recommended card for the 4500 is the Adaptec 2930cu SCSI card.

That card, and DPL, only work with 32bit operating systems. Windows 7 32bit would be the newest one that would be supported. I have a separate hard drive with Win 7 32 that I boot off of when I need to run my 4500 and DPL

See my posts here for help understanding what setting up a 4500 involves http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?112737-DPL-users-owners-of-Howtek-Aztek-scanners&p=1206460&viewfull=1#post1206460. There are some good links there too

Before updating firmware you should confirm with Aztek that it will work properly on your crosfield model.

Aztek support I excellent so they may be able to help you with other questions as well.

Melnick Studios Inc.
24-Apr-2015, 06:53
I have some older WinXP 32-bit P4 4-GB-RAM computers that I somtimes use to capture video from firewire devices. Should I just resort to those machines or will they not be as speedy as a modern computer when scanning from the Howtek 4500?

fishbulb
24-Apr-2015, 07:07
They will be fine for scanning. 32bit operating systems can only use 3GB of RAM anyway. Then you can copy the .TIFF file to another computer for editing work, where a 64bit operating system helps a lot for handling the large files. This is basically what I do - I have Win 7 32 and Win 7 64 on two separate drives and then I save the .TIFF files to a third drive that both operating systems can "see". Then I reboot back into x64 once I am done scanning.

Supposedly Aztek is developing a 64bit compatible version of DPL for the next software release (version 9 I suppose) but because Adaptec hasn't produced 64bit drivers for the 2930cu (and probably never will) it would likely require most people to upgrade their SCSI cards.

Regarding your other question on where to get drums and a mounting station, I would say set up an eBay alert (it will email you when new listings come up that match your search criteria, such as "Howtek") and also subscribe to the Yahoo Group high end scanning: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ScanHi-End/info because these items do come up for sale occasionally.

Greg Davis
24-Apr-2015, 07:52
DPL 8 was just released with 64 bit support.

fishbulb
24-Apr-2015, 08:12
Really! I thought I already had "version 8" but it looks like I have "7 point 8".

Ah. It looks like they are not doing the "Standard" version anymore. $900 for the upgrade to Pro (http://www.aztek.com/digital_photolab.html). Ouch.

Melnick Studios Inc.
24-Apr-2015, 10:05
I guess with Silverfast I'm stuck using my P4 32-bit computers with the Adaptec 2930cu SCSI card? Is anyone else using this configuration successfully?

fishbulb
24-Apr-2015, 10:46
I guess with Silverfast I'm stuck using my P4 32-bit computers with the Adaptec 2930cu SCSI card? Is anyone else using this configuration successfully?

That does appear to be the case, based on Silverfast's website: http://www.silverfast.com/get_demo/en.html

It looks like you can run more modern versions of Silverfast on a 64bit operating system, but the latest version that still supports the 4500 is 6.6, which only runs on Windows XP. Silverfast doesn't list the Crosfield 240 as a supported model (only the 200), so you'd want to confirm with them or someone else that it does work, before you buy the software.

Provided that DPL supports the Crosfield (which it should, but you should probably call them), then really DPL is going to be the best software for you, hands down. It provides support for the 4500 through all of its versions, and all the anecdotal evidence I've read on here and other forums is that DPL is needed to get the best scans out of the Howtek scanners.

But if you want to use a 4500 with a 64bit OS, it's got to be DPL v8... I will probably upgrade once I can convince myself to spend the money. Which will probably be the next time I have to boot into Win 7 32-bit again ;-)

Vord
24-Apr-2015, 22:31
For my Crosfield Magnascan 200i (Howtek D4000) I use a P4 system on XP with Silverfast. It works fine, I've had no issues.

Shame to see they don't offer a standard version of DPL anymore, that pretty much kills it for me.
I've been hoping to find someone selling a Trident dongle for a reasonable price since my other scanners work on Powermac G4s but no luck yet.

onnect17
25-Apr-2015, 01:46
The Crosfield 240 is the same D4500 with a different front label. Same firmware and lists itself as a D4500 SCSI device.

Not sure how or why FireWire was mentioned.

Be aware that multiple SCSI drivers could lead to problems. Silverfast installs their own and fights for access to the devices if installed together with Adaptec's ASPI driver.

Melnick Studios Inc.
26-Apr-2015, 20:55
What's the longest SCSI cable allowed for these scanners?

onnect17
27-Apr-2015, 05:32
I use 10' cables from Monoprice without any issues but here's the answer according to ADAPTEC.

The maximum total length (internal plus external cables) is determined by the number of devices on the controller and the maximum desired bandwidth.

A longer total cable length limits the maximum bandwidth due to attenuation, impedance of the devices, and propagation delay of the signals.

Here is a rule of thumb for maximum cable length:

SCSI-1 (5MB/Sec) 6 meters (<=18ft)
SCSI-2 (5MB/Sec) 6 meters (<=18ft)
SCSI-2 fast (10MB/Sec) 3 meters (<=9 ft)
SCSI-2 fast/wide, ULTRA (20MB/Sec) 3 meters (<=9 ft)
SCSI-2 ULTRA Wide (40MB/Sec) 1.5 meters (> 4 devices)
SCSI-2 ULTRA Wide (40MB/Sec) 3 meters (< 4 devices)
SCSI-3 ULTRA2 Wide (80MB/Sec) 12 meters (> 2 devices)
SCSI-3 Ultra 160 (160MB/Sec) 12 meters (> 2 devices)
SCSI-3 Ultra 320 (320MB/Sec) 12 meters (> 2 devices)

fishbulb
27-Apr-2015, 07:31
The Aztek setup guide (http://www.aztek.com/Support/Digital%20PhotoLab%20Quick%20Start%20Guide_Premier.pdf) recommends 10 feet (3 m) or less. The 4500 Users Guide (http://www.aztek.com/Howtek%20Pages/Guides/Scanners/Scanmaster4500.pdf) recommends 19 feet (5.8 m) or less in the entire SCSI daisy chain.