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appletree
21-Apr-2015, 10:42
Hi all! I hope this is in the right place, if not feel free to move Mods.

Thanks always for the sound advice and help. A few questions after shooting some still life's last afternoon/night. 6 total on expired Delta 100 for practice.

::Helpful information::
Camera: Chamonix 045N-2
Lens Owned: Schneider Symmar-S 210mm f5.6 and Nikon Nikkor 90mm f5.6

::Process::
I did the following (loosely): Got subject and camera in position. Focused roughly with the lens wide open. Then focused using my loupe. I kept my glasses on (for far distances) as it worked better. All under the darkcloth. After this I metered the scene and went back under darkcloth to check everything again. I had to view the image upside down (literally turning my head to visualize) haha...on a few images. I know I will get use to it, but I was worried about it being disproportionate/crooked, etc that my eyes might not catch with the image upside down on the ground glass. I made the subject horizontal and the edge of the table/background do it's own thing. Once everything checked out I put the film holder in. Closed the lens and cocked the shutter (messed up once and didn't close the lens! it was a 4s exposure so maybe not ruined, I noticed it wasn't triggering the shutter after a few seconds and quickly closed the lens). Took out the darkslide and took the photo. Reversed the darkslide and inserted. Then noted everything down.

::Questions::
1) First of all how do I know which hole to use for my front standard? I google'd it and it seems no definitive answer. I guess there is no right or wrong? Just whatever works to give the user the most lateral movements?
For example, (if I understand correctly), I used a 210mm focal length lens for subject that was maybe 2-3ft away. Thus my lens was extended far out. No point mounting the standard on a hole closer to the film plan as I might run out of movement room or simply extend it much further than that which makes sense?

2) Movements. I didn't use any. Should I be using them if I want to focus on a different plane? For example on a diagonal line or something? Otherwise, am I "incorrect" in not using them?

3) One of the darkslides I noticed much later was not inserted all the way. About 90%. It seemed to have been hung up on the flap that is at the bottom of the film holder, had to "jam" it in to get the slide to go all the way down. Not sure if light was getting in or not. I should develop tonight and will find out.

4) Speaking of that flap. I felt like I didn't have enough fingers when loading film. I was so nervous about dust and scratching the negative. When I inserted the negative, film notches to the bottom right, I tried to hold down the flap from rubbing on the backside of the negative when being inserted in the grooves.

5) The negatives seem to move slightly once "seated" in the holder before closing the flap and darkside back. Is this normal?

6) I forgot to rap the film holders. Although I was very careful with dust. Had my rocket blower with me and cleaned em all off beforehand, then back into the ziplocs. Then only out of the ziplocs when loading or taking a shot.

7) Aperture. I guess this is no different than the other 3000 photos I have taken. Based on the subject, movement (wind, etc), and DOF I want I go from there. I metered and chose apertures the same as always, not sure if I am supposed to do something different or take bellows into account or anything? Delta 100, my meter was saying about 1/2s to 4s for f5.6, whereas a shot at f22 was 30s. Perhaps I should have taken reciprocity into account for the 30s shot. I should be a better photographer. Well, lots to learn!

A few random photos:
http://i.imgur.com/niX50Krl.jpg http://i.imgur.com/cumpAC5l.jpg http://i.imgur.com/XNLptu1l.jpg?1


Thanks for any advice in my first time adventure. Excited/hopeful to see if I made any images!

DrTang
21-Apr-2015, 11:26
dude..your apple is upside down.. maybe your camera is broken

appletree
21-Apr-2015, 11:30
Nah, I may be new, but I know it's supposed to be upside down. My mind just has not gotten use to it yet! I only did it (turned my head around like a goofball) for two images to make sure I had the proper angles and POV that I wanted. My brain will adjust in time.

mmerig
21-Apr-2015, 12:01
Please read the basic articles on operating the camera, loading film, etc. on the LF home page, if you have not already done so.

"Once everything checked out I put the darkslide in." Do you mean film holder? If not, you probably exposed the film before realizing it.

Regarding loading film in the film holders (question #3) : avoid jamming the slide, or otherwise forcing things. If you have to force something, that usually means something is mis-aligned. I would test that film holder for light leaks before using it for an important picture.

The film should not move much in the film holder (maybe 1.5 millimeters in the short-direction). Of course it can move a lot in the long direction, but you should feel a positive stop in the film if it is fully inserted. If you decide to use a notching system on the flap to identify film, the notch won't show if the film is fully inserted (assuming you use a double sided film holder like a Riteway or Fidelity), so you will have to move it slightly back towards the flap.

Your first pictures could be test shots of things with a wide tonal range, to get used to film and processing, as well as checking shutter speeds if not already calibrated; close shots with long bellows extensions complicates the situation -- keep it simple when starting out. Also, movements can be tricky to evaluate on the ground glass. You may want to take scenes that don't really need it to make sure your basic focusing skills are good.

Expect to make a lot of mistakes in the beginning, and learn to slow down.

fishbulb
21-Apr-2015, 12:08
The trick I found for loading film holders: only slide the darkslide out about an inch before loading - don't take the darkslide all the way out. Then it is almost impossible to accidentally load the film into the slots that the darkslide slides in.

My loading process: I usually hold the film holder in my left hand, with my thumb and pinky on the sides. I use my first finger of the same hand to hold the flap back so it doesn't get in the way. With my right hand, I reach down and grab a sheet of film with my thumb and middle finger, and with my right first finger on the top (notched) edge to double check the orientation. Then I slide the film in.

As far as the plastic flaps, just make sure they are all closed - re-check them once you're done loading them - before you turn the lights on.

Leszek Vogt
21-Apr-2015, 12:13
If it helps any, put up a sticky note onto the camera...defining proper sequence...and just follow that. Ha, the tree could be upside down, so long the apple is right side up, eh ? :>).

Les

appletree
21-Apr-2015, 12:31
Thanks for the advice. Yes I meant film holder! I am fairly confident I did everything fine, other than a few bumps here and there. Overall ended up with a few easy questions, I would assume. Had someone been standing next to me, it would have been one sentence answers for most of my questions.

The play is only 1-2mm in the short range. I suspected it normal and for varying sizes of film from manufacturers.

And yes, I spent about 2hrs on the 6 photos. Just getting used to the camera, my tripod, focusing, playing with the apertures, etc.

I tested the speeds of the lens and it seems fine. And I agree, might be wise to have some test shots (which is what these were) of more distant subjects without the bellows extended and a wide tonal range.

Luis-F-S
21-Apr-2015, 18:07
#1. What holes? My Deardorff does not have holes.
#2. Don't overuse movements, only if you need to change the plane of focus.
#3 & #4 What flap? Load a holder in the light so you can see what the hell you're doing.
#5. Who cares?
#6. I thought rap had something to do with music. I haven't rapped holders in 30 years.
#7. If you're using Dagors, use f45. If modern lenses f22.

L

jcoldslabs
21-Apr-2015, 19:40
7) Aperture. I guess this is no different than the other 3000 photos I have taken.

Not necessarily. If your previous work was done with smaller format cameras then bellows extension factor was not, well, a factor. Keep in mind that when a lens is racked out to twice its focal length (420mm in the case of your 210mm) you need to either open the lens up two stops or extend the exposure time by two stops to compensate. In this hypothetical case a 15 second metered exposure would become 60 seconds.


Perhaps I should have taken reciprocity into account for the 30s shot.

Perhaps so. :)

J.

djdister
21-Apr-2015, 19:49
7) ... I metered and chose apertures the same as always, not sure if I am supposed to do something different or take bellows into account or anything? Delta 100, my meter was saying about 1/2s to 4s for f5.6, whereas a shot at f22 was 30s. Perhaps I should have taken reciprocity into account for the 30s shot...


Yes and yes. You probably should have corrected for both reciprocity failure and bellows extension factor.

This from the Delta 100 data sheet, which is similar to other Ilford B&W films in terms of reciprocity correction needed:

For exposures between 1/2 and 1/10 000 second, no adjustments are needed for reciprocity law failure. When exposures longer than 1/2 second are given,
100 DELTA Professional along with other films, needs to be given more exposure than indicated by a meter.

Mark Barendt
21-Apr-2015, 20:24
1) Whatever.
2) Whatever makes it look right on the ground glass.
3) Yes light got in. Jamming isn't normal.
4) Good
5) A little wiggle is normal. After developing, use sheet from question 3 to practice loading in the light.
6) Meh, so what. All that counts is clean.
7) Yes f/8 is f/8 is f/8, but you have to do the math.

f = focal length, the real focused focal length not the marked focal length.

If the marked focal length is 210 then f=210 at f/8 is 210/8 so aperture diameter at the f/8 mark is 26.25

If the marked focal length is 210 then 210 is where it focuses at infinity.

If you extended out to say 315 that means 315/26.25 = 12 so f/12 at the f/8 mark

If you extended out to say 420 that means 420/26.25 = 16 so f/16 at the f/8 mark

Tim Meisburger
21-Apr-2015, 20:48
Yes, I'm guessing that in #3 your film was loaded incorrectly and that is what you had trouble getting the slide back in. There are two cut-outs at the top of the film tracks and if you keep a finger on each you will know if the film is sliding into or above the tracks. Its just practice.

When you look at the holder face on the notch should be in the upper right (or lower left). If your notch is in the lower right, you loaded the film upside down.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 06:55
Well then. It seems like I messed up. This is why I used expired film.
I am trying to do the math now, but pretty sure I won't even be able to save much of the exposures during developing by pushing the film. I can't even find tables for +2 stops on Delta 100. And D76, although D76 might not be best to push with, IDK. I usually have the lap push/pull a roll if I need one done.

I loaded the film yesterday in a mod54. No questions regarding that. I practiced with a sheet of film I burned on purpose to practice with.

But some feedback! A few of the negatives came out really really easy. I suspect (using Toyo new style holders) I didn't make it under the groove in a few instances. I practiced a lot in the dark and in light after loading my tank. One negative was stuck (most likely sheet #5 which was hung up or something), but once removing could not feel any damage on the negative edges. On further study of this particular side of the film holder the darkslide sometimes catches early. Right before it makes its way into the flap at the bottom of the holder or as it enters it. I might contact the person I bought them from to see if he had any problems with it. Anyway, I won't bog down the thread with my film holder problem. I mainly just needed more practice.

::So additional questions my compadres::

1) The holes I was mentioning that someone asked, "what holes", refers to a series of threaded holes on the "rail" (not sure the term) that racks in and out from my camera. There are 5? I think, total holes to which one can mount a lens. I mounted the 210mm to the furthermost hole. Doesn't seem to matter though, now that I understand, it just means where the starting distance of my lens is from the film plane. In a wide angle lens it might be wise to use a hole closer to the film plane, etc etc. I pretty sure I explained this one to myself. Had to wrap my brain around everything.

2) For measuring lengths I am not sure which is right. Ok Mark, you explained some great stuff. Thank you! 210mm though. What reference is this? The front of the lens to the film plane? The standard to the film plane? These are my measurements (to do the math now...after the fact haha):

NO EXTENSION
front of lens to film plane: 9.5" or 241.3mm
front standard to film plane: 7 5/8" or 193.675mm

EXTENSION
*used the photos as reference and extended it out very similar to that during take these shots
front of lens to film plane: 14" or 355.6mm
front standard to film plane: 12 1/8" or 307.975mm

In BOTH cases the additional extension adds up to 114.3mm.

3) I was trying to use an app that takes reciprocity factor and bellows extension into account. Now, that is, not when I took the photos, my brain lapsed!
My 30s exposure at 210mm focal length, Delta 100, and 420mm bellows extension gives 21mins haha.

I just wasn't thinking clearly. I know/it is logical that when moving a lens further away not only do you have to compensate for this, but you have a lot of additional area inside the bellows which much get light to the film.

4) When using this app, I enter focal length (210mm, for example). For bellows extension would I enter the distance I extended out, say 114mm or the full length? And likewise to question 2, do I measure from the film plane to the bellows/standard or front of the lens?


Thank you all. I will keep practicing!

Deval
22-Apr-2015, 06:57
The drawings in most large format instruction books greatly exaggerate the amount of movements necessary to get an object in focus. The drawings always look like 40 + degrees when often 5-15 works. Steve Simmons has a nice YouTube video on focusing the lf camera.

Mark Barendt
22-Apr-2015, 07:11
Ok, focus the camera at something a long way away, 1/4 mile or more, you are finding infinity focus. Now if you measure from the film to roughly the middle of the lens it should be darn close to 210mm. Now you can use those same two points to find the real focal length for any other shot you may take.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 07:25
Ok, perfect. So it is from the film to about where the lensboard is? Sorry for my confusion. "Middle of the lens" is vague for me. You have an outer and inner element. Outer is screwed to a shutter. To which the whole thing sandwiched to a lensboard. Correct? Sorry, still getting the hang of it all.

I am not trying to be a pain! Thank you.

Mark Barendt
22-Apr-2015, 07:30
Yeah roughly. The exact point in the lens doesn't matter. just pick two points where you can easily measure 210. It's a relative measurement.

djdister
22-Apr-2015, 07:33
Ok, perfect. So it is from the film to about where the lensboard is? Sorry for my confusion. "Middle of the lens" is vague for me. You have an outer and inner element. Outer is screwed to a shutter. To which the whole thing sandwiched to a lensboard. Correct? Sorry, still getting the hang of it all.

I am not trying to be a pain! Thank you.

For "middle of the lens" imagine where the shutter lies, and use that as the lens reference point.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 07:34
Ok, thank you.

Michael W
22-Apr-2015, 08:01
If you have an iPhone, the Reciprocity Timer app is great for calculating stuff like bellows extension and reciprocity correction.

Mark Barendt
22-Apr-2015, 08:11
One other thought that will make your large format life more enjoyable.

Allow for vagueness, embrace it.

For example your question about which hole and my answer of whatever. The real work that the framework of your camera does is position the lens and film in space.

You could, and some have, mount a lens on one tripod and the film on another and stretch a bellows between the two to make a camera.

The framework of your camera is just there to make it easier than that. There is no right or wrong way to use it.

fishbulb
22-Apr-2015, 08:28
One way to think about bellows extension is just that it's a measurement from one standard to the other.

If you are using a 90mm lens, focused at infinity, your front standard and rear standard will be about 90mm apart. If you are focused close, at 1:1 reproduction ("macro") the standards will be 180mm apart. How many stops do you need to correct? Take a zero off the mm and convert them to apertures - 90 vs. 180 becomes f/9 vs. f/18. Then you can look at your aperture ring on your lens and count the stops - 2 stops. So if you're at 1/60th shutter, you really should be at 1/15th, all else equal.

Let's say you have a 90mm lens, and it's focused closer than infinity, but not 1:1. Say you measure 135mm between your standards. f/9 vs. f/13.5, kind of weird, but that's about one stop. So instead of 1/60th, you use 1/30th.

Let's say you have a 90mm lens, focused at 2:1 macro. You've got 360mm between the standards. How many stops? f/9 to f/36? Looking at the aperture ring on the lens, and count off four stops, or about the same as f/8 to f/32.

A good thing to carry with you is a small measuring tape, or just remember that your first finger is Xmm long, and your thumb is Ymm long, etc.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 08:33
Thanks. And yes, now that I am grasping the actual workings of lens, film, camera, it helps me to comprehend it. Yeah I can use my Hasselblad and Leica and other cameras, but never did I think much about the science behind it all. Literally moving the lens back and forth, is new to me...in a way. Although I understand now this was always happening when focusing any analog camera, just more pronounced and apparent in a view camera.

Because I didn't fully understand what I was doing, is why my mind was rambling for, "well shit, which hole do I use?"

Just growing pains.



And for the app, yes that is what I am using (well not when I took the shots)! For "bellows extension" am I correct inputting the distance from "middle of the lens" to the film plane. Not the total distance minus the focal length or anything "additional extension". For instance:

Focal Length: 210mm (8.3")
Bellows Extension: 310mm (12.2")

Meaning it is an additional 3.9" beyond where it would/should be in focus for a scene at infinity. Correct, no?

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 08:34
One way to think about bellows extension is just that it's a measurement from one standard to the other.

If you are using a 90mm lens, focused at infinity, your front standard and rear standard will be about 90mm apart. If you are focused close, at 1:1 reproduction ("macro") the standards will be 180mm apart. How many stops do you need to correct? Take a zero off the mm and convert them to apertures - 90 vs. 180 becomes f/9 vs. f/18. Then you can look at your aperture ring on your lens and count the stops - 2 stops. So if you're at 1/60th shutter, you really should be at 1/15th, all else equal.

Let's say you have a 90mm lens, and it's focused closer than infinity, but not 1:1. Say you measure 135mm between your standards. f/9 vs. f/13.5, kind of weird, but that's about one stop. So instead of 1/60th, you use 1/30th.

Let's say you have a 90mm lens, focused at 2:1 macro. You've got 360mm between the standards. How many stops? f/9 to f/36? Looking at the aperture ring on the lens, and count off four stops, or about the same as f/8 to f/32.

A good thing to carry with you is a small measuring tape, or just remember that your first finger is Xmm long, and your thumb is Ymm long, etc.

Ahaha. Got it sir. That is what I began to think. Perfect!!!! Thank you.

Mark Barendt
22-Apr-2015, 08:58
Thanks. And yes, now that I am grasping the actual workings of lens, film, camera, it helps me to comprehend it. Yeah I can use my Hasselblad and Leica and other cameras, but never did I think much about the science behind it all. Literally moving the lens back and forth, is new to me...in a way. Although I understand now this was always happening when focusing any analog camera, just more pronounced and apparent in a view camera.

Because I didn't fully understand what I was doing, is why my mind was rambling for, "well shit, which hole do I use?"

Just growing pains.



And for the app, yes that is what I am using (well not when I took the shots)! For "bellows extension" am I correct inputting the distance from "middle of the lens" to the film plane. Not the total distance minus the focal length or anything "additional extension". For instance:

Focal Length: 210mm (8.3")
Bellows Extension: 310mm (12.2")

Meaning it is an additional 3.9" beyond where it would/should be in focus for a scene at infinity. Correct, no?

Not sure about how to use the app, don't use it. No need to be that exact.

In the interest of embracing the vague make the math super simple. If you double the focal length add two stops of exposure, half way between (310ish) just add half that, 1 stop. It's an infinite scale between the two, with a little practice you can just know that I'm stretching out a ways I need to add a "some" extra.

Negative film has a huge usability range, a little under the meter or a fair chunk over, generally ain't no thing to worry about, you adjust for differences when you print. Perfect textbook exposure only counts when you are shooting slides, not negs.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 09:02
Thus the following. Using my previous posted numbers.

210mm focal length lens.

NO EXTENSION
front of lens to film plane: 9.5" or 241.3mm
front standard to film plane: 7 5/8" or 193.675mm

EXTENSION
*used the photos as reference and extended it out very similar to that during take these shots
front of lens to film plane: 14" or 355.6mm
front standard to film plane: 12 1/8" or 307.975mm

The only number I really need is that one.
210mm at infinity would be f/21.
310mm extension would be f/31.
Thus about 1/2 a stop additional would be needed, plus whatever reciprocity factor is included in.
No! Wrong. A full stop. Half stop would be like f27 or something weird.

So, from this exercise and me thinking about 90mm vs 210mm, I was wrong, I think...
I thought I would be able to get more macro/closer to the subject with my 210mm lens. But I think this is wrong. Because I could start with the lens further back (closer to the film plane) and not need to extend the bellows as much to double the distance to 180mm.
Or am I way off/confused?

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 09:04
Not sure about how to use the app, don't use it. No need to be that exact.

In the interest of embracing the vague make the math super simple. If you double the focal length add two stops of exposure, half way between (310ish) just add half that, 1 stop. It's an infinite scale between the two, with a little practice you can just know that I'm stretching out a ways I need to add a "some" extra.

Negative film has a huge usability range, a little under the meter or a fair chunk over, generally ain't no thing to worry about, you adjust for differences when you print. Perfect textbook exposure only counts when you are shooting slides, not negs.
Ok, understood and thanks. Simple math is always a struggle for me...I am an engineer and a perfectionist. But for the sake of all things considered yes you are right. As long as I expose for the shadows (slightly overexpose) and develop for the highlights (slightly underdevelop). I mean film (negatives, from my experience) is very forgiving.

Mark Barendt
22-Apr-2015, 09:27
My daughter is an engineer too, we joke that she can't handle "real" numbers just "fake" ones, so yes I understand.

As for forgiving, I develop all my negatives normally, my contrast adjustments are done when printing with VC paper. Under and over developing film is only important for matching the paper you use. If you aren't using single grade paper then...

As to exposure, shot anywhere from 1 under to 2 or 3 over I can print exactly what I want. Try it sometime, meter and do all the math then shoot one sheet at 1-under and one at 2 or 3-over and then try and make the same print from both. I can do either reliably. Knowing that allows me to set exposure like I salt my steak, a good guess is typically plenty close.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 09:43
Great. Thanks for all your help.

And I would test it easier, but I rent a lab to do my printing. :(
And I have printed primarily on Ilford MGFB Warmtone Semi-Matte paper. As well as Ilford MG Art 300 paper.

I am a novice at printing! Self taught and not enough practice. It is an entire art form, I think Ansel said it is where the magic happens.

fishbulb
22-Apr-2015, 10:02
So, from this exercise and me thinking about 90mm vs 210mm, I was wrong, I think...
I thought I would be able to get more macro/closer to the subject with my 210mm lens. But I think this is wrong. Because I could start with the lens further back (closer to the film plane) and not need to extend the bellows as much to double the distance to 180mm.
Or am I way off/confused?

Yes, the trials and tribulations of macro photography. Bellows extension is just like using extension tubes on 35mm. You can get a better reproduction ratio with a wider angle lens and a shorter bellows (2:1 with a 90mm = 360mm bellows, versus 1:1 with a 210mm = 420mm bellows). But the tradeoff is that the angle of view on the 90mm is much wider than the 210mm, so at 1:1, the 90mm is much closer to the subject than the 210mm would be at 1:1.

Just like with 35mm macro work, you can use a shorter lens for subjects that aren't going to move and you don't mind getting your camera real close to them - inches away. For skittish subjects (bugs, lizards, whatever), or if you need space between the camera and the subject to avoid casting shadows, then you need a longer lens with a narrower angle of view so you can keep the camera further away.

If you do really get serious about macro on large format, you may want to buy a dedicated macro lens like the Nikon Nikkor-AM ED 120mm f/5.6 or a similar lens from one of the other manufacturers. These lenses were specifically designed to be used at 1:1 reproduction - the tradeoff is that they don't perform well for other uses, but are excellent at 1:1. But they aren't that cheap ($500+ for the Nikon) so it's a lot of money to spend for a single-purpose lens.

djdister
22-Apr-2015, 10:11
So, from this exercise and me thinking about 90mm vs 210mm, I was wrong, I think...
I thought I would be able to get more macro/closer to the subject with my 210mm lens. But I think this is wrong. Because I could start with the lens further back (closer to the film plane) and not need to extend the bellows as much to double the distance to 180mm.
Or am I way off/confused?

You're just a bit off in your thoughts here. Consider the objective of macro photography - to get a large image on film relative to the size of the object. So, given the camera is at a set distance, which lens gives you a larger object size on film, the 90mm or the 210mm? The 210mm, right? In order to get a larger image size of a small object with a 90mm lens, you would have to get really close to the object, and you'd end up racking the bellows out (in effect, increasing the effective focal length). So this is why close-up product photography usually starts with a medium to long focal length lens, and still you will end up extending the bellows beyond the normal focal length. But at least the lens will not be 1/2 inch away from the object (if you had used the 90mm).

Make sense?

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 10:25
Yes, I believe both of your posts do make sense.

Example
Basically an apple on 4x5 inch film is say 3" tall on the negative (1:1). This could be done with both a 90mm and 210mm lens. For a 90mm lens you would have the "middle of the lens" at 180mm (theoretically) distance from the film plane. And for a 210mm lens you would have the "middle of the lens" at 420mm away from the film plane. The apple would be the exact same size in both images, yet the camera would be drastically close to the subject (apple) for the 90mm lens. And the perspectives would be different in each image?

Although, because you are limited on how much you can extend the bellows, you can actually take more "zoomed in" images with wider angle lenses. To get to 2:1 on a 90mm you reach 360mm extension, whereas a 210mm would need a whopping 840mm?!? Although 2:1 on a 90mm might look all weird or something?

I might test this tonight with an apple and my 90mm and 210mm lenses. Just for science's sake.

This does all make sense though, just from my experience using extension tubes on my hasselblad.

appletree
22-Apr-2015, 10:33
Oh and I ran the numbers using the app.

Here is what I got:
Sheet #1:
shot @: f5.6 1/4s
calculated: 1/2s
+1 stop

Sheet #2:
shot @: f5.6 1s
calculated: 3s
+1.5 stops

Sheet #3:
shot @: f5.6 1/2s
calculated: 1 1/8s
+1ish stop

Sheet #4:
shot @: f8 2s [forgot to close shutter, exposed film ~4s]
calculated: 22s
+2.5 stops

Sheet #5:
shot @: f8 2s [darkslide not fully inserted]
calculated: 8s
+2 stops

Sheet #6:
shot @: f22 30s
calculated: 8min 50s
+4ish stops

At the end of the day, I can call these all test shots. But it would be neat, to see if I even can get images. All of the negatives are already loaded. I might try pushing the Delta 100 in D76 a total of 2 stops. Then see if I even get anything.

appletree
23-Apr-2015, 07:12
Pretty sure I have a box of Microphen. Perhaps follow some of the suggestions here (http://www.ilfordphoto.com/photocommunity/forums/theforum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5093)?

Lenny Eiger
28-Apr-2015, 08:25
At the end of the day, I can call these all test shots. But it would be neat, to see if I even can get images. All of the negatives are already loaded. I might try pushing the Delta 100 in D76 a total of 2 stops. Then see if I even get anything.

One can't "push" film. This is a total misunderstanding. For all practical intents and purposes "exposure and development have nothing to do with each other". You can not develop to get more film speed. What you can do is add more contrast, or density in the highlights.

The basics of this are that the shadow areas (the clear areas) develop in the first three minutes. You can develop the film for a year and you won't get any more in there. You'll get some fog, to be sure, but no more detail. This is an extreme statement, but it's 99.35 % true. There is a little wiggle room, but not a single stop's worth. It's better to imagine its not there, and to learn to use one's meter.... and get consistent with where one points the spot meter.

Develop of the highlight areas continues for quite some time, until you totally blow out your highlights, and won't be able to print them. When people shoot in dark areas at high ISO, they simply give up on any shadow detail and increase the contrast to compensate for the low contrast lighting. However, as simple as I can make it, you can't increase the ISO of a film by developing longer. It just doesn't happen. The speed of the film is set by the materials used in its creation.

Lenny

appletree
21-May-2015, 16:03
Well, good news. I did in fact get photos on my first attempts. Finally arrived back home a few days ago and had a chance to develop the negatives. Here is so crude previews. Needless to say I was really excited. Used Microphen 1+0 (stock) for 10mins, agitated 10s every 60s. Film is expired Delta 100.

Thanks for all the help and advice. More shooting this weekend.

http://i.imgur.com/96ueWhf.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8mfizki.jpg

appletree
8-Jun-2015, 08:44
I went shoot this weekend and was curious about something. When shooting landscapes I seemed to mount my 90mm lens very far back (the last most hole) to ensure my scene was focused. I did not have a ruler, but I assume my lens plane was thus 3.5" (90mm) from the film plane. Thus, with a Chamonix 045N-2, could I ever use a 75mm lens or wider lens or is this my limits? I know 210 for portraits, but I wanted to use it to frame a shot through the truss (or trestle) of a bridge and down a river...in portrait. Thus I used my 210mm for a few shots. This was in turn the opposite and mounted on the furthest-most hole.

Am I doing/thinking about all of this correctly?

Deval
8-Jun-2015, 08:45
With a recessed lens board, you should be fine

appletree
8-Jun-2015, 08:58
Ah, so that is what recessed boards are for. Thanks. No intentions of going wider than 90mm, but I was "surprised" I was utilizing the closest hole. As I kept trying each one until the last one was already in pretty much perfect focus. Only minor knob adjustments. Wasn't sure if I did something wrong.

Thanks for the answer.

fj55mike
16-Jun-2015, 14:26
I use a 75mm on my 045N-2 with a standard lens board, no recess necessary.

RHITMrB
16-Jun-2015, 15:58
I went shoot this weekend and was curious about something. When shooting landscapes I seemed to mount my 90mm lens very far back (the last most hole) to ensure my scene was focused. I did not have a ruler, but I assume my lens plane was thus 3.5" (90mm) from the film plane. Thus, with a Chamonix 045N-2, could I ever use a 75mm lens or wider lens or is this my limits? I know 210 for portraits, but I wanted to use it to frame a shot through the truss (or trestle) of a bridge and down a river...in portrait. Thus I used my 210mm for a few shots. This was in turn the opposite and mounted on the furthest-most hole.

Am I doing/thinking about all of this correctly?

When using a 65mm lens with my Chamonix 045N-2, I don't use a recessed lensboard; I just slide the rear standard forward. In fact, I don't use the rearmost hole to mount the front standard, because with a vertical composition at 65mm the bed of the camera will be in the frame. Instead I slide my rear standard as far forward as possible, then use whichever hole is then the closest to the rear standard (can't recall exactly but I think it's the middle one).

A recessed lensboard would give the bellows more room for movements by making them less bunched up, but since my 65mm only just covers I don't use movements with that lens anyway.