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Kevin Crisp
1-Feb-2015, 20:27
I've been away from Ebay for a long time as a seller. I listed a Deardorff, making it as clear as I could that I wasn't shipping it except to the US or Canada. As the last minute I have a Chinese bidder. Anybody else had this problem and if so, what's the best thing to do? Thanks.

Kevin

diversey
1-Feb-2015, 20:48
A Chinese bidder from China or USA?

Keith Pitman
1-Feb-2015, 20:52
In the specs for the listing, you can limit bidders to the locations you will ship to and accept bids from. If you do that, Ebay will not allow a bid from unapproved geography.

I'd make sure he pays the full load for shipping as well as the inconvenience in filling out the custom forms at the post office. If he won't pay, cancel the sale. Just my two cents.

koh303
1-Feb-2015, 20:53
You do not have to sell to a buyer who has a shipping address which is not part of your listing terms (must be in the countries you ship to details when you set up the original listing). You cannot be faulted, no negative feedback or defect can be recorded.
If the item has not yet been paid for go to the order details page and click the "resolve a problem", follow the instructions form there or call Ebay SC, day time, on a weekday (so yo can speak to a US based agent), and ask for guidance.

If it has been paid (which could not be possible as you do not have international shipping listed), then you need to first refund the payment in full and then follow the above.

If you had international shipping as an option, you have to sell, and ship to your buyer or you will be at fault.

On a side note, i will offer an opinion even though it was not asked for, there is no reason not to sell to china. Just as many bad buyers in who happen to not speak english reside in NA, and many more nice buyers who speak excellent google translate english do not live here. If buyer is willing to pay for shipping (use USPS Priority Express mail international for some kind of signature confirmation, though not in china, or PM me on how to ship with DHL Express for a better rate then USPS), then why not? DHL takes care of all customs release and hand delivers anywhere around the world in 2-3 days, with signature. Paypal/Ebay offer the same protection for domestic sales as it does for international ones...

Good luck!

Bob Sawin
1-Feb-2015, 21:01
Offer to ship it to any address in the U.S. the buyer chooses (after the funds clear).

Kevin Crisp
1-Feb-2015, 21:02
Thanks for the pointers. I just asked for shipping address, always possible there will be a US address for that. So I'll find out.

Jody_S
1-Feb-2015, 21:08
If you're wondering how it can be done, I had one this month buying one of my items with a US address, then paying with Paypal with an address in China. I assumed the US address was a shipping service, for those sellers who won't ship outside the USA. As it happens, I'm more than happy to ship directly to China, however eBay calculated shipping to the US address, which was half of what shipping to China costs. A quick message and request for additional funds resulted in instant payment of the difference, but I suspect the buyer would have accepted shipment to the US address had I made a fuss. Obviously it would have cost him more, as he would have then paid for the shipping service to re-label the parcel and ship it to China. I believe some of the services inspect the item as well, due to the previously short inspection window eBay gave for returns.

I suggest contacting the buyer if you don't want to ship to China, he/she may have a shipping service or may know of them and be amenable to using one. However, and I don't care how many times I repeat this, over the years I have had far more problems with US buyers than with Asian buyers; if I were going to block one country from my auctions, it wouldn't be China.

koh303
1-Feb-2015, 22:29
In the specs for the listing, you can limit bidders to the locations you will ship to and accept bids from. If you do that, Ebay will not allow a bid from unapproved geography.

I'd make sure he pays the full load for shipping as well as the inconvenience in filling out the custom forms at the post office. If he won't pay, cancel the sale. Just my two cents.

if you go to the post office, you are not only wasting your time, you are also paying almost 30% more then you would have by printing the shipping label from the comfort if your own home, have ebay upload tracking info automatically, and order a USPS mail carrier to your door to pick up the package.

Ebay allows for multiple addresses. It is easy to have one with a US address, and then follow up after winning a sale with another address, perhaps in another country. In some cases the ebay system will catch it and not allow the buyer to change it, but sometimes it will allow and ask you to provide actual shipping cost to your buyer.

Jac@stafford.net
1-Feb-2015, 23:11
My best buyers for have been from Chinese who worked through a broker located in the USA who specializes in crazy expensive stuff for their Chinese constituents. The point is to deliver only to buyers with a USA shipping address. The deal terminates at the delivery point. One that I followed because I though he was out of his mind was located in a cheap industrial complex in LA and he had a tremendous volume, all through the 'Bay.

So, for those who beg to ship to China or any place outside of your declared shipping area, either ignore them or have a cut-n-paste that suggests "Please work though a USA resident broker." I ignore them. Thankfully, none have bid and won anyway which is simply a brief nuisance.
.

richardman
2-Feb-2015, 01:40
I have sent stuff to China many times. Never a problem.

pierre506
2-Feb-2015, 03:31
I bought lots of gears from the States and EU.
No problem so far.

richardman
2-Feb-2015, 04:08
I bought lots of gears from the States and EU.
No problem so far.

+1
*thumbs up*

"-)

BrianShaw
2-Feb-2015, 07:49
I've bought stuff from China, and no problem so far.

W K Longcor
2-Feb-2015, 08:32
No experience here, but I have heard stories about things getting "lost" in the postal systems in China and Russia. Anyone with experience here care to comment ---true or false?

Jody_S
2-Feb-2015, 09:19
I've bought dozens of small items from China, the $1-5 stuff with 'free shipping'. I think 2 parcels didn't arrive, and I got instant refunds when I filed the complaint within the proper delays. 1 arrived broken, I sent a pic, they sent a replacement. If I can afford to wait 3 weeks for whatever it is, I buy direct from China now. Everyone I've ever had to communicate with has been 100% professional.

Dennis
2-Feb-2015, 09:43
I sold a Rolleiflex to someone in china. The tracking on the package stopped when it arrived in china. The buyer didn't receive the camera for several days after that and I was getting pretty worried about losing everything but then he finally wrote that the camera had arrived. When I looked at the bidding for the camera I saw that had I insisted on American only I would have lost about 300 dollars.
Dennis

Old-N-Feeble
2-Feb-2015, 10:01
My best buyers for have been from Chinese who worked through a broker located in the USA who specializes in crazy expensive stuff for their Chinese constituents. The point is to deliver only to buyers with a USA shipping address. The deal terminates at the delivery point. One that I followed because I though he was out of his mind was located in a cheap industrial complex in LA and he had a tremendous volume, all through the 'Bay.

So, for those who beg to ship to China or any place outside of your declared shipping area, either ignore them or have a cut-n-paste that suggests "Please work though a USA resident broker." I ignore them. Thankfully, none have bid and won anyway which is simply a brief nuisance.
.

^^^This^^^


I have sent stuff to China many times. Never a problem.

^^^And this... except I did "nearly" have a problem once^^^

scheinfluger_77
2-Feb-2015, 10:08
I've bought dozens of small items from China, the $1-5 stuff with 'free shipping'. I think 2 parcels didn't arrive, and I got instant refunds when I filed the complaint within the proper delays. 1 arrived broken, I sent a pic, they sent a replacement. If I can afford to wait 3 weeks for whatever it is, I buy direct from China now. Everyone I've ever had to communicate with has been 100% professional.

This has been my experience too. I haven't bought 'dozens' but so far VERY customer service oriented. They have to make a living too, and if they can with these type of items I'm happy to oblige.

Steve

koh303
2-Feb-2015, 10:26
No experience here, but I have heard stories about things getting "lost" in the postal systems in China and Russia. Anyone with experience here care to comment ---true or false?

thats mostly consolidated reviews of people having issues. for every person who lost an item in shipping there a million who do not, and they also do not post about it online to say, all was OK. Postal service issues in russia are more common then in other parts of eastern Europe, but not nearly as bad as in Italy, where "lost" packages due to various "fees" not being assessed or paid, is the one of the highest in the OECD, from my experience, i would say, its the highest, period, but even then, i have shipped many a thing to Italy with no issue. the loss rate there is greater but over all its negligible. I think i can safely say China post is one of the best mail services in the world, if you consider the amount of people served, and the distances traveled domestically, and the rates they offer are about .1% of he cost of USPS for lesser services.

goamules
2-Feb-2015, 10:39
Selling to Chinese is a risk. If you have sold just a few times, you may not have problems. But the chance is much higher. For one, postal service there is slow, and may be unreliable. That makes is frustrating because there is NO tracking for shipment in china. It goes off into the great unknown, for days, weeks, or months. You cross your fingers and hope.

For another, many buyers there are new to the world of antiques bought online. They feel they are getting a brand new item, with a warranty, no scratches, etc. Your chances of getting a buyer that then is unhappy and tries to ask for a partial refund is high.

For another, they don't like paying the high shipping. I tried to forbid Chinese buyers on several cheap camera items. They always find a way to win anyway, usually in the last minute. Then, even though my ads say "I only ship USPS Express to overseas bidders" they balk when they get the invoice with a $50 shipping bill for a $15 film holder, or whatever. The last one (see my long post about it) then didn't want to pay for the high shipping, but didn't want to resolve the issue. It took me a lot of calls, emails, to ebay, and waiting to finally get the auction cancelled, then more time to finally get my fees recovered. Eventually, I could repost the item.

Yes, it's a LOT of trouble to sell to China, about one out of 5 sales. I used to sell to China a lot. Once I established that 1:5 problem ratio, I quit.

Kevin Crisp
2-Feb-2015, 10:48
Well, it was stories like that which concerned me. But he has a NY shipping address so off it goes.

richardman
2-Feb-2015, 13:11
Anecdotal evidence do not mean much. I send and receive many packages at my $dayjob$. Facts:
1) You can create/purchase USPS online to China, but not Russia
2) you can create fedex/UPS labels to both China and Russia.
3) If you think China's mail system is bad, you have never mailed things to Brazil and Argentina, (and probably many others)

THIS is a package from northern California to Washington STATE. The label is computer printed. It should have never gone to Southern California in the first place, and definitely should not fly east to NJ. OTOH, we must ship at least a dozen packages a week using USPS and this happens just once or twice a year. Should I hold this up as "never ship using USPS" or "never ship to Washington state"?

You don't have to ship to anybody if you don't want, but I dislike people categorizing an entire country or the whole group of people based on anecdotal "evidence."


http://imagecraft.com/pub/TMP/usps-wandering-package.JPG

goamules
2-Feb-2015, 13:26
What you call "anecdotal" I call "personal experience." The OP wanted some of either. There isn't a handy statistics site for "Chance of Problems, Shipping from US to China." There is only our experiences.

richardman
2-Feb-2015, 13:34
What you call "anecdotal" I call "personal experience." The OP wanted some of either. There isn't a handy statistics site for "Chance of Problems, Shipping from US to China." There is only our experiences.

True, but I just hate personal experiences turn into a Mob mentality :-)

Old-N-Feeble
2-Feb-2015, 14:12
I'll bet I've sold at least two dozen fairly pricey items to Chinese buyers and only one was 'almost' a problem. The others all went very well. I've probably bought a couple dozen items from Chinese sellers and only one type of item was a bad experience... and this happened twice. I will never again buy Lithium-Ion batteries from any seller in China... or anywhere overseas for that matter.

koh303
2-Feb-2015, 14:30
postal service there is slow, and may be unreliable.
USPS may be slow and IS unreliable.


...I used to sell to China a lot. Once I established that 1:5 problem ratio, I quit.

If you have only 5 sales that is a difficult ratio to measure, but in any case, my experience is 1:5 ratio of problematic buyers in the US, who have strange standards of what they deem acceptable for a broken, sold for parts, as it thing...

koh303
2-Feb-2015, 14:37
Anecdotal evidence do not mean much. I send and receive many packages at my $dayjob$. Facts:
1) You can create/purchase USPS online to China, but not Russia
2) you can create fedex/UPS labels to both China and Russia.
3) If you think China's mail system is bad, you have never mailed things to Brazil and Argentina, (and probably many others)

THIS is a package from northern California to Washington STATE. The label is computer printed. It should have never gone to Southern California in the first place, and definitely should not fly east to NJ. OTOH, we must ship at least a dozen packages a week using USPS and this happens just once or twice a year. Should I hold this up as "never ship using USPS" or "never ship to Washington state"?

You don't have to ship to anybody if you don't want, but I dislike people categorizing an entire country or the whole group of people based on anecdotal "evidence."


http://imagecraft.com/pub/TMP/usps-wandering-package.JPG

+1 on all - however Shipping to Russia is now once again allowed through the online site, and Ebay for FCMI as well as Priority, but not express.
OTOH - DHL Express will only send B2B when sending to Russia due to customs issues.

With respect to China, and all we do not understand about other then white anglo saxon cultures - the USPS is not even close to the level of service of some countries, and China's PO is by far superior to MANY countries. I mentioned Italy, because i send there often, but as Richard notes - various SA countries, are even worse.

W K Longcor
2-Feb-2015, 16:48
Well, based on comments here ----- I will be selling some old classic lenses soon ---and I guess I will try selling to China. Thanks one and all for your input.

Old-N-Feeble
2-Feb-2015, 16:56
Here is my current list of eBay, "Excluded shipping locations" from my listings...

PO Box (any), Cape Verde Islands, Niger, United Arab Emirates, Burkina Faso, Middle East, Congo, Democratic Republic of the, Yemen, Niue, Oman, Latvia, Russian Federation, Ghana, Lebanon, Iraq, Serbia, Turkmenistan, Armenia, Togo, Jordan, Lithuania, Turkey, Congo, Wallis and Futuna, Saudi Arabia, Moldova, Israel, Chad, Namibia, Nigeria, Kyrgyzstan, Cameroon, Central African Republic, Guernsey, Uzbekistan, Qatar, Belarus, Bahrain, Kuwait

I'm sure this is out-of-date because I haven't investigated problems for the last several months.

China is not YET on my exclusion list.

goamules
2-Feb-2015, 17:05
deleted...disregard.

koh303
2-Feb-2015, 17:13
Here is my current list of eBay, "Excluded shipping locations" from my listings...

PO Box (any), Cape Verde Islands, Niger, United Arab Emirates, Burkina Faso, Middle East, Congo, Democratic Republic of the, Yemen, Niue, Oman, Latvia, Russian Federation, Ghana, Lebanon, Iraq, Serbia, Turkmenistan, Armenia, Togo, Jordan, Lithuania, Turkey, Congo, Wallis and Futuna, Saudi Arabia, Moldova, Israel, Chad, Namibia, Nigeria, Kyrgyzstan, Cameroon, Central African Republic, Guernsey, Uzbekistan, Qatar, Belarus, Bahrain, Kuwait

I'm sure this is out-of-date because I haven't investigated problems for the last several months.

China is not YET on my exclusion list.

Interestingly enough, i have only one excluded country on my ebay listings, and that is Switzerland. After having 90-95% failure rate with that country over the years, i decided to not sell anything there any more, as the risk is too great. This has nothing to do with the shipping service, but perhaps an unbridgeable cultural gap, worse then i have seen anywhere else in the world... who would have thunk it.

Kevin Crisp
2-Feb-2015, 17:16
I certainly opened a can of chong with this one.

Old-N-Feeble
2-Feb-2015, 17:20
Interestingly enough, i have only one excluded country on my ebay listings, and that is Switzerland. After having 90-95% failure rate with that country over the years, i decided to not sell anything there any more, as the risk is too great. This has nothing to do with the shipping service, but perhaps an unbridgeable cultural gap, worse then i have seen anywhere else in the world... who would have thunk it.

WOW!! That failure rate is from how many sales to Switzerland?

koh303
2-Feb-2015, 17:30
WOW!! That failure rate is from how many sales to Switzerland?

over the years i have lost count, but after a 5 in a row about 18 months ago i decided its just silly.
Without exception, all swiss buyers had complaints, called me a liar before we had even transacted a deal, sometimes they just opened with that as part of their product query. Others complained then said service was ok, but still complained.

After a while, i started hoping it was me who was doing something wrong, then i started reading feedback left for other by those members, and found their neg/nuet/dispute rate was very high to say the least, and the fact i had thousands of transactions with folks all around the world made me think something odd might be going on here.
Are all swiss always unhappy with stuff they buy? I doubt it. Am i willing to find out why so many were? no.

Old-N-Feeble
2-Feb-2015, 17:32
over the years i have lost count, but after a 5 in a row about 18 months ago i decided its just silly.
Without exception, all swiss buyers had complaints, called me a liar before we had even transacted a deal, sometimes they just opened with that as part of their product query. Others complained then said service was ok, but still complained.

After a while, i started hoping it was me who was doing something wrong, then i started reading feedback left for other by those members, and found their neg/nuet/dispute rate was very high to say the least, and the fact i had thousands of transactions with folks all around the world made me think something odd might be going on here.
Are all swiss always unhappy with stuff they buy? I doubt it. Am i willing to find out why so many were? no.

Hmm... maybe I should add Switzerland to my blocked regions list.

Jody_S
2-Feb-2015, 20:57
I certainly opened a can of chong with this one.

Yup.

I've pointed out before that US eBay sellers of things like classic lenses, watches, and other prestige items are depressing their own auctions by a good 30% or more by refusing to ship abroad. I won't argue with sellers anymore over this, even online retailers (there's no excuse in 2015 for an online store to not specify an international shipping policy somewhere on their site). Don't want to ship abroad? Then I don't want to buy from you.

photonsoup
3-Feb-2015, 17:03
What the best way to get the best shipping rates to Asia?

I had a member of this forum ask about shipping on something I listed here. I called UPS and DHL on the phone and it was like $70.00 for a 2 lb package.

I know there has got to be a cheaper way because I have ordered cheap items with free shipping from China. Some of the things cost significantly less than it would cost me to ship the same thing back.

Old-N-Feeble
3-Feb-2015, 17:12
^^^ The problem is shipping from China to USA is cheap but vice versa is expensive. I wonder why...

Corran
3-Feb-2015, 17:41
I called UPS and DHL

There's your problem. Try the USPS. They're the best. That sounds like Global Express rates. Put it in a small box and ship it Priority and it'll be half of that.

koh303
3-Feb-2015, 18:06
There's your problem. Try the USPS. They're the best. That sounds like Global Express rates. Put it in a small box and ship it Priority and it'll be half of that.

GXG is Fedex Priority interntional, and is often very expensive.
2LB can shipped with FCMI, depending on size.

Priority mail and EMS (now called Priority Express), have flat rate envelopes and boxes. Envelopes are cheap, and you can stuff them up to 4LB, for the same silly low rate. Boxes are expensive, but you can stuff those up to 70lb for the same rate.

BTW - failure rate (IE - lost, delayed or not delivered packages is about X4 for Priority Express compared to regular Priority, go figure).

DHL has a flat rate envelope too, called small padded pouch. It is delivered anywhere in the world in 1-3 days, to the hand of the recipient, with a signature. Prices are about 30% higher then USPS, but you get what you pay for.

goamules
5-Feb-2015, 09:49
^^^ The problem is shipping from China to USA is cheap but vice versa is expensive. I wonder why...

Labor. Isn't everything cheaper in China, India, etc? Labor.

Old-N-Feeble
5-Feb-2015, 09:59
Labor. Isn't everything cheaper in China, India, etc? Labor.

Understood but packages still go through hands when they enter the USA. What's the difference going to China from Texas vs. coming from China to Texas?

BrianShaw
5-Feb-2015, 10:08
Good point, considering both are foreign countries. :o

lucaas
5-Feb-2015, 10:12
Selling to Chinese is a risk. If you have sold just a few times, you may not have problems. But the chance is much higher. For one, postal service there is slow, and may be unreliable. That makes is frustrating because there is NO tracking for shipment in china. It goes off into the great unknown, for days, weeks, or months. You cross your fingers and hope.

If you send the items via USPS priority mail, you can track your parcel at this link=> http://intmail.183.com.cn/icc-itemtraceen.jsp when it arrives in China.
If you send via USPS express mail, you can track your parcel here: http://www.ems.com.cn/english.html
Both two websites are hosted by China Post.
FCMI is not traceable on China Post websites.

koh303
5-Feb-2015, 10:30
Understood but packages still go through hands when they enter the USA. What's the difference going to China from Texas vs. coming from China to Texas?

China post has a special agreement with the USPS, which offers them an extraordinarily low rate for the reciprocal service USPS complements China post. The differences between this agreemant and the rates with any other country in the world are incredible. Making it is extremely cheap for chinese sellers to send small fully traceable parcels to the US for about 0.1$ per 100 grams (about 3oz), which get a USPS re labeling as soon as the hit the US, with a local tracking number added, it is cheaper then sending a regular letter inside the US.

The reverse is not the same, and you pay regular USPS rates. For reference, it is MUCH cheaper and in many cases faster to send things from China to the US, then from Boston to NY.

Also - all postal services in the world are linked in a way that the cost of handling incoming mail is included in the local cost of shipping outbound - so it does not matter where your package comes from, the cost is based on how much it costs to ship.

Old-N-Feeble
5-Feb-2015, 11:54
China post has a special agreement with the USPS, which offers them an extraordinarily low rate for the reciprocal service USPS complements China post. The differences between this agreemant and the rates with any other country in the world are incredible. Making it is extremely cheap for chinese sellers to send small fully traceable parcels to the US for about 0.1$ per 100 grams (about 3oz), which get a USPS re labeling as soon as the hit the US, with a local tracking number added, it is cheaper then sending a regular letter inside the US.

The reverse is not the same, and you pay regular USPS rates. For reference, it is MUCH cheaper and in many cases faster to send things from China to the US, then from Boston to NY.

Also - all postal services in the world are linked in a way that the cost of handling incoming mail is included in the local cost of shipping outbound - so it does not matter where your package comes from, the cost is based on how much it costs to ship.

That's what I figured. There's simply no other explanation. Thanks for that. This gives Chinese sellers an unfair advantage over domestic sellers in the US. I guess China is hiring Lobbyists to pay off US Senators.;)

koh303
5-Feb-2015, 12:04
That's what I figured. There's simply no other explanation. Thanks for that. This gives Chinese sellers an unfair advantage over domestic sellers in the US. I guess China is hiring Lobbyists to pay off US Senators.;)

there is no such thing as unfair advantage in an unregulated market. China has the larger buying power in the world, and has better negotiating terms then a bunch of whining americans who think they know it all about this and that. The result is that they have better resources, better infrastructure and better scale economics and practices (IE work ethics etc), and end up with the worm, or in this case the insanely better shipping options.

Not 5 years ago, the situation was 100% reversed US/China shipping.

Old-N-Feeble
5-Feb-2015, 12:27
there is no such thing as unfair advantage in an unregulated market. China has the larger buying power in the world, and has better negotiating terms then a bunch of whining americans who think they know it all about this and that. The result is that they have better resources, better infrastructure and better scale economics and practices (IE work ethics etc), and end up with the worm, or in this case the insanely better shipping options.

Not 5 years ago, the situation was 100% reversed US/China shipping.

I'm not whining about manufacturing capabilities. I'm complaining about unfair reciprocal shipping agreements. Apparently, overseas powers learned how to buy US Senators.

koh303
5-Feb-2015, 13:11
I'm not whining about manufacturing capabilities. I'm complaining about unfair reciprocal shipping agreements. Apparently, overseas powers learned how to buy US Senators.

I did not say you.

In any case - this has nothing to do with senators or bribery, there is plenty of that already.
Its simple economics of scale. The largest and fastest growing economy in the world (China), can out buy the US in every respect, which is why they get better terms. This is "free market economy", no one in the US should be surprised when it jumps up and bites them in the ass. China is the future, for better or worse, and the future has already arrived as far as USPS is concerned.