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Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 12:54
I vote ban.

Online evaluations are nearly impossible of many things, especially lenses, anything glass and definitions vary.

Old-N-Feeble
21-Jan-2015, 13:07
Can you add a poll to this thread?

djdister
21-Jan-2015, 13:17
Yeah, I guess a poll would capture this pretty clearly. Regardless, I am in favor of banning equipment evaluations. For someone who wants to know, they can search sold listings on ebay, and they can search the Wanted/For Sale threads on this forum to see what people have been asking/selling the same thing for. But don't open that barn door of "How much is this worth?"

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 13:21
I don't see a way to add poll at this point.

Old-N-Feeble
21-Jan-2015, 13:25
I don't see a way to add poll at this point.

Maybe a MOD can add one?

I just looked for a "Test Forum" to see if I could created a new thread and add a Poll later but there is no Test Forum.

Have you tried clicking on "Edit Post" then "Advanced" then scroll down to the bottom to search for something like "Add Poll"?

mdarnton
21-Jan-2015, 13:26
I think we should ban all discussion on everything. As people often point out when some newbie shows up with a seemingly innocent question, ALL of it has been said before, every last question has been answered in some thread or another, Google will find it for you, and there's a line of angry people forming here to tell you how useless you are for asking, and give you the link to the discussion that happened in 2001 that you somehow foolishly missed. There are no clueless innocents--there are only people with silly questions, waiting to drain us of our sanity, one question at a time. I think we should close the site down, and let Google find the answers to every question ever asked, in it's cached archives.

I would have provided a link to the thread where this was all discussed and decided previously, but I'm too lazy. I'm sure it's already been decided in the past, though. LINK (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=I%27m+so+lazy.).

Jody_S
21-Jan-2015, 13:26
I vote no. There are literally thousands of obscure or completely forgotten lenses out there that many of us, including myself, will buy if the price is right. Banning us from discussing value will harm the practice of LF photography in a way that the current bans (politics, religion) do not.

As for the fact that people join and post threads requesting info on their "I found this in my attic" lenses,
1) yes, a number of 'sharks' will jump in and make low-ball offers,
2) the posters of the threads might be looking for exactly this sort of sale,
3) scammers gonna scam, and I won't shed a tear if a 'shark' gets taken, or if someone comes here and sells a $3000 lens for $500 because they can't be bothered to look at completed sales on eBay.
4) no one is forced to participate in such a thread, one way or another; if you don't like having your time wasted by giving out your precious rare lens expertise for free, then don't waste your time responding to these threads.
5) If a noob comes and gives away his lenses for 10% of market value, without due diligence, by accepting the first PM'd offer that came along, then he essentially trusted complete strangers on the Internet who have an obvious conflict of interest. Who does that?
6) The forum has no collective responsibility to provide accurate evaluations of lenses just because people ask, especially when they're obviously trying to make a quick buck off something they found in a yard sale for $20. That doesn't mean we have to ban the threads, just that we need to evaluate our own behavior when this happens, rather than do a spit-take with our morning coffee and jump on our keyboards expressing OUTRAGE.

I don't know if such a subject is covered on the main page, but I suggest we need a short essay explaining to non-LFers how to identify, evaluate and sell their lenses for a fair price, and anyone who comes and posts an 'attic' thread could simply be referred to that topic. This would allow many to enjoy their morning coffee to the last drop.

BrianShaw
21-Jan-2015, 13:28
I already expresed my opinion, and wonder how much my opinion would be worth if expressed again.

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 13:28
I already expresed my opinion, and wonder how much my opinion would be worth if expressed again.

I want to get off that other thread and have a sane discussion the Mods can use for input.

Dan Fromm
21-Jan-2015, 13:35
Randy, I'm sure that your heart is pure and your hands are clean but we really don't need more rules here.

It is very easy to tell a person who asks how much something is worth that it all depends on condition, to look at sold items on eBay and to use Google. This message can be delivered politely. Flames aren't needed. Its the flamers who need to be restrained.

Tim Meisburger
21-Jan-2015, 13:41
I'm with Jody. We are talking about brassies here, but what if I want to know the value of a super angulon in a seiko shutter? Or a new Cooke? We can discuss value all we want, but in the end it is determined by the buyer. I don't think we need to ban anything. Just encourage good manners. I know that is old fashioned, but aren't we all?

Will Frostmill
21-Jan-2015, 14:28
I don't know if such a subject is covered on the main page, but I suggest we need a short essay explaining to non-LFers how to identify, evaluate and sell their lenses for a fair price, and anyone who comes and posts an 'attic' thread could simply be referred to that topic. This would allow many to enjoy their morning coffee to the last drop.

THIS. (And make it a sticky in the Lenses subforum.)

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 14:50
Randy, I'm sure that your heart is pure and your hands are clean but we really don't need more rules here.

It is very easy to tell a person who asks how much something is worth that it all depends on condition, to look at sold items on eBay and to use Google. This message can be delivered politely. Flames aren't needed. Its the flamers who need to be restrained.

I don't make rules. I discuss them.

Taija71A
21-Jan-2015, 14:57
I don't make rules. I discuss them.

+1
___

As per the other thread, I too would suggest... That the LFPF prohibit providing 'Evaluations'. (*In order to make the Moderators Jobs *** Easier ***)
--
Best regards,

-Tim.
_________

djdister
21-Jan-2015, 15:04
So ... I'll point out three things:

1. One of the reasons this forum is considered better than others is precisely because it has some specific rules, like the "30 day wait" and the "must post an asking price" rules.

2. To adapt from a popular phrase, "Good rules make for a well run forum."

3. Circumstances evolve, and sometimes new rules are called for.

Perhaps this is one of those circumstances.

vinny
21-Jan-2015, 15:07
I have an idea, lets make up more stuff for the moderators to do.
I'd like to start by changing my username to Frank P

Vaughn
21-Jan-2015, 15:08
I did not realize there was a problem (a situation that negatively affects the forum and its users -- and that needs a solution found). Are we forced to do evaluations and/or to read them? Sorry...feeling a little sarcastic this afternoon...

koh303
21-Jan-2015, 15:16
It is very easy to tell a person who asks how much something is worth that it all depends on condition, to look at sold items on eBay and to use Google. This message can be delivered politely. Flames aren't needed. Its the flamers who need to be restrained.

As the first half of your comment never happens, and the second happens only after fire and explosions take place, it would be much to everyones benefit to have fire retardants in place to limit instances of fire.

Since the regular community of members has a hard time self regulating, more rules are not a bad thing, and in this case desperately needed.

adelorenzo
21-Jan-2015, 16:29
I enjoy photography as a hobby. That is to say I enjoy taking pictures and printing them but I also enjoy trying new gear or techniques, buying and selling, building, fixing and breaking stuff... To me it's all part of doing what I enjoy. I try to break even but generally lose a bit of money on stuff I sell but I don't worry about it, I get value out of it from using it.

I think it's fine to have the buy and sell stuff mixed in with the forum and I simply ignore what doesn't interest me. The evaluation threads don't bother me at all. This is the most knowledgeable group of people around, where else would you take it?

I like to imagine that if we were all at a camera show, quite a few people would be standing around at a table with old brass lenses and keen to offer their knowledge, opinions or make offers to purchase. I also imagine people wouldn't be nearly as rude to each other. Heck, it might even be an enjoyable and interesting conversation. Why not treat the forum the same way?

Dan Fromm
21-Jan-2015, 16:29
koh303, you're not very observant. "Value depends on condition, look at sold items on eBay, use Google" is a fairly common response to questions about how much an item is worth.

I don't know why people blew up at the post that prompted this discussion. Me, I stayed out of it. Not my job to tell people as politely as possible that they're lazy idiots.

jnanian
21-Jan-2015, 16:40
I think we should ban all discussion on everything. As people often point out when some newbie shows up with a seemingly innocent question, ALL of it has been said before, every last question has been answered in some thread or another, Google will find it for you, and there's a line of angry people forming here to tell you how useless you are for asking, and give you the link to the discussion that happened in 2001 that you somehow foolishly missed. There are no clueless innocents--there are only people with silly questions, waiting to drain us of our sanity, one question at a time. I think we should close the site down, and let Google find the answers to every question ever asked, in it's cached archives.

I would have provided a link to the thread where this was all discussed and decided previously, but I'm too lazy. I'm sure it's already been decided in the past, though. LINK (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=I%27m+so+lazy.).

+1

== but before that we should have a poll ===

Nodda Duma
21-Jan-2015, 16:42
Wait. The discussion is about banning discussion about the usefulness and quality of the tools of the trade? That'd be like designing a lens and not holding design reviews or evaluating the performance when it is assembled! Lol!!!

I'm gonna back out of this thread now, but before I do I'm just going to say that this forum is a valuable resource for non-artist professionals like me specifically because of user evaluations of the tools of your trade. I'm smart enough (and I'm sure you all are too) to wade through the threads and determine trends...even though I'm a "newbie". Ban evaluations and you've significantly limited the broad spectrum of diverse people that the forum is useful to. It's not just the artists you thought you cater to who read this forum.

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 16:51
I think we should ban all discussion on everything. As people often point out when some newbie shows up with a seemingly innocent question, ALL of it has been said before, every last question has been answered in some thread or another, Google will find it for you, and there's a line of angry people forming here to tell you how useless you are for asking, and give you the link to the discussion that happened in 2001 that you somehow foolishly missed. There are no clueless innocents--there are only people with silly questions, waiting to drain us of our sanity, one question at a time. I think we should close the site down, and let Google find the answers to every question ever asked, in it's cached archives.

I would have provided a link to the thread where this was all discussed and decided previously, but I'm too lazy. I'm sure it's already been decided in the past, though. LINK (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=I%27m+so+lazy.).

So we never discuss again anything, as everything ever known is now available by search and we will never learn anything new past this point in time...

Great. We can now rest and let bots do it all for us.

I just saw that movie, humans are redundant.

Goodbye :)

Lachlan 717
21-Jan-2015, 16:57
I think that we need to differentiate "evaluation" from financial "worth".

I'm all for discussing the value of a piece of equipment in a practical sense; however, I do not like new Members coming in, starting one "How much is if worth" thread, and then never being heard from again. IMO, this is a serious undervaluation of the combined intellectual property of this Forum.

Ari
21-Jan-2015, 17:00
When Google becomes self-aware in 2017, it will then tell us what to do.
We won't need to ask questions any longer, so I'm in favour of keeping the line of questions open for, oh, 23.5 months or so.

fishbulb
21-Jan-2015, 17:08
I think that we need to differentiate "evaluation" from financial "worth".

I agree. If I start a thread called 'Is my lens broken/usable/rare/common/sharp/soft/good for this type of photography' it'll be a different conversation than 'What's my lens worth'

Lachlan 717
21-Jan-2015, 17:11
I agree. If I start a thread called 'Is my lens broken/usable/rare/common/sharp/soft/good for this type of photography' it'll be a different conversation than 'What's my lens worth'

Yep, and more symbiotic information should be gained.

koh303
21-Jan-2015, 17:27
Wait.
...this forum is a valuable resource for non-artist professionals like me

Wait.

How can you tell the difference between artist professionals and non artist professionals, and artist non professional?
Is there a diploma that goes along with such titles? Does this profession necessarily have to be photography or do union steel workers also qualify if they read this forum our of pure interest?

BrianShaw
21-Jan-2015, 18:36
I want to get off that other thread and have a sane discussion the Mods can use for input.

Understood. I was trying to be funny by asking for a valuation in a thread to ban valuation questions. I'm just too dry at times. Sorry.

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 19:10
Wait.

How can you tell the difference between artist professionals and non artist professionals, and artist non professional?
Is there a diploma that goes along with such titles? Does this profession necessarily have to be photography or do union steel workers also qualify if they read this forum our of pure interest?

I'm actually an automotive test mechanic. Self taught and paid by an OEM Tier 1 factory for 30 years. I took up the study of Art late in life as a retirement adventure. So far so good.

Jac@stafford.net
21-Jan-2015, 19:22
I agree. If I start a thread called 'Is my lens broken/usable/rare/common/sharp/soft/good for this type of photography' it'll be a different conversation than 'What's my lens worth'

With respect, even that is weak in today's digital communications. If/When we have truly high-resolution monitors it might be different, but I am not holding my breath. It is through many posts from individuals that we might accumulate a sense of brass oldies, as evinced by Jim Galli's contributions.
.

AJ Edmondson
21-Jan-2015, 20:09
I vote no. There are literally thousands of obscure or completely forgotten lenses out there that many of us, including myself, will buy if the price is right. Banning us from discussing value will harm the practice of LF photography in a way that the current bans (politics, religion) do not.

As for the fact that people join and post threads requesting info on their "I found this in my attic" lenses,
1) yes, a number of 'sharks' will jump in and make low-ball offers,
2) the posters of the threads might be looking for exactly this sort of sale,
3) scammers gonna scam, and I won't shed a tear if a 'shark' gets taken, or if someone comes here and sells a $3000 lens for $500 because they can't be bothered to look at completed sales on eBay.
4) no one is forced to participate in such a thread, one way or another; if you don't like having your time wasted by giving out your precious rare lens expertise for free, then don't waste your time responding to these threads.
5) If a noob comes and gives away his lenses for 10% of market value, without due diligence, by accepting the first PM'd offer that came along, then he essentially trusted complete strangers on the Internet who have an obvious conflict of interest. Who does that?
6) The forum has no collective responsibility to provide accurate evaluations of lenses just because people ask, especially when they're obviously trying to make a quick buck off something they found in a yard sale for $20. That doesn't mean we have to ban the threads, just that we need to evaluate our own behavior when this happens, rather than do a spit-take with our morning coffee and jump on our keyboards expressing OUTRAGE.

I don't know if such a subject is covered on the main page, but I suggest we need a short essay explaining to non-LFers how to identify, evaluate and sell their lenses for a fair price, and anyone who comes and posts an 'attic' thread could simply be referred to that topic. This would allow many to enjoy their morning coffee to the last drop.

+1 Obviously I missed something (nothing new in that) but it seems to me that Jody has it pretty well summed up!

Joel

rdenney
21-Jan-2015, 21:14
Wait. The discussion is about banning discussion about the usefulness and quality of the tools of the trade? That'd be like designing a lens and not holding design reviews or evaluating the performance when it is assembled! Lol!!!

No, of course not. It's about whether the question "how much is this worth" will be answered or allowed, not its usefulness or quality. The response when it happens would be simple deletion with the reason give as "we don't do price valuation here. see guidelines." And the guidelines would explain why, and give about two sentences worth of advice on where to start.

We get people who find what they think looks like something they saw selling for four digits on ebay coming here asking for valuations, and two things become apparent: they are trying to sell something without asking for the sale (to get around our meager attempt at preserving the for-sale forum for established members), and as soon as they do, we never see them again. But we do see the resulting conflict such as we've seen this week.

If they are asking about attributes, history, how to assess those characteristics or condition--no problem.

We are also not talking about general discussions of what a beginner might need and how much it might cost. The issue isn't the discussion of cost for buyers, but rather price for sellers.

But it's just an idea. No poll needed; this isn't a democracy. This thread will help the mods understand what bugs the members, what serves the members, and factors we need to consider when we discuss it.

Rick "reading the comments" Denney

ic-racer
21-Jan-2015, 21:19
I vote ban.

No need for a ban. If someone wants to waste their time giving free pricing advice, so what. What we need is a "Ignore Thread" button (like they have on APUG) to use as an alternative to "Ignore User."

Randy Moe
21-Jan-2015, 21:21
I vote Rick. ^^^

Nodda Duma
21-Jan-2015, 22:43
Wait.

How can you tell the difference between artist professionals and non artist professionals, and artist non professional?
Is there a diploma that goes along with such titles? Does this profession necessarily have to be photography or do union steel workers also qualify if they read this forum our of pure interest?

I'm not sure you have a point... Or if you are vehemently agreeing with mine, or if you simply have no grounding in reality??

My point obviously was that you simply do not know who is reading. I think in that case you vehemently (or strenuously) agree.... .... .. . .which is great! I think...

Louis Pacilla
22-Jan-2015, 08:17
I think that we need to differentiate "evaluation" from financial "worth".

I'm all for discussing the value of a piece of equipment in a practical sense; however, I do not like new Members coming in, starting one "How much is if worth" thread, and then never being heard from again. IMO, this is a serious undervaluation of the((((( combined intellectual property of this Forum))))).

Amen brother! Amen!

Dan Fromm
22-Jan-2015, 09:26
IMO, this is a serious undervaluation of the combined intellectual property of this Forum.

Lachlan, nearly everything we know is in the public domain and can be found without much effort. "Wottle it fetch?" questions make me think that the people who ask them undervalue their ability to work things out for themselves.

Jac@stafford.net
22-Jan-2015, 09:36
Lachlan, nearly everything we know is in the public domain and can be found without much effort. "Wottle it fetch?" questions make me think that the people who ask them undervalue their ability to work things out for themselves.

Sometimes people ask in order to become engaged with similarly minded others. A short-cut would be to pre-parse and send 'em to http://collectiblend.com/

But to your point, I've found many young adults who consider web searches all there is important to find/know. Advances in so-called artificial intelligence, especially 'friendly' ones which bend over backwards to be compliant might breed a New Stupid.

Aren't you happy to be over fifty? :)

(I am jumping from 68 to 70. I'd rather be 70 twice than 69 once.)

goamules
22-Jan-2015, 09:43
I've been thinking about this long and hard. I should weigh in, since the moderator said this isn't a democracy. There are two types of valuations.

1. The outsider who joins to find out what an old lens/camera is worth to sell it. Jody's inputs weighed on me the most. If most of us found an item we don't know about, our online options are to join an expert forum, or throw it to the market on Ebay. If I found an antique violin, I'd join a violin forum. Now I'm realizing there is nothing wrong with them coming here. We are the experts. We can at least say it's valuable, somewhat useful, or worthless. Putting a dollar amount is always a difficult thing. It depends if you are buying, selling, or a sideline observer. You would get three dollar amounts from those three.

Here's a scenario. A guy finds 5 wooden box cameras, and figures out they are "large format". He finds this forum, and asks, "are these [1. Pony Premos ...2. 35mm enlargers] worth anything, or should I throw them away?" Possible forum answer: ["Yes, they are somewhat collectible, you might get a little money.....No, they are not worth the shipping amount."]

Another scenario. The guy has a valuable camera or lens. Buyers find out it's for sale because he comes here. LF forum members get first shot, and an advantage over Ebay. What's wrong with that? Back to valuations. As the PMs fly behind closed doors, several people (buyers, sellers, spectators) weigh in with values of $500, $1500, $3000. Of course, buyers don't like the high "estimates", and sellers don't like the low ones. Better answers would be: "Check Ebay sold lists, but yes, in 30 days you should sell it here!"

2. The owner who wants to learn, and might perhaps be convinced to learn to photograph. These people want to know what something is worth, just because. They aren't selling, but like to have a feel for what their possessions are worth. Nothing wrong with that either. Again, this forum should not be an appraisal service. But we can give rough value statements like "those are extremely valuable...those are very common, but good....etc."

One thing that does bother some, is giving someone a lot of background history, use, quality, parameters only to see the seller take those words, verbatim, and put it in their Ebay listing. I think people feel that if they give all that information, they should have a shot at buying it. So that's why some people don't instantly answer a newbies broad, ambigious "tell me all about this thing" with detailed paragraphs. But some do. It all depends on what motivates you. Buyer, seller, or spectator....

Dan Fromm
22-Jan-2015, 11:59
Sometimes people ask in order to become engaged with similarly minded others. A short-cut would be to pre-parse and send 'em to http://collectiblend.com/
But to your point, I've found many young adults who consider web searches all there is important to find/know. Advances in so-called artificial intelligence, especially 'friendly' ones which bend over backwards to be compliant might breed a New Stupid.

Aren't you happy to be over fifty? :)

Ah, but our "wottle it bringers" haven't even done the web searches. Against web searches, for many things, not just photographic equipment, Google isn't particularly good at finding usable references. One still has to go to a good library.

Um, being over fifty has advantages over dying that young but I can't say that getting older is pure joy. In many ways I'm not what I was when I was 50 or even 60 and my old friends are dying off. Went to a memorial service this week ... Its time to find a few more new friends.

Michael R
22-Jan-2015, 13:47
Why wouldn't someone just skip a thread/question he finds bothersome, repetitive, irritating, etc.?

cowanw
22-Jan-2015, 13:55
+ 1000

Jac@stafford.net
22-Jan-2015, 14:02
Ah, but our "wottle it bringers" haven't even done the web searches. Against web searches, for many things, not just photographic equipment, Google isn't particularly good at finding usable references. One still has to go to a good library.

Even our libraries (we have three in this small town) use a proprietary web-based search to find anything in the collection and periodicals, many of the latter are strictly-web served now.

It is sad, too, that some good photo books have been stolen, and others defaced by self-appointed censors.

Peter De Smidt
22-Jan-2015, 15:37
Why wouldn't someone just skip a thread/question he finds bothersome, repetitive, irritating, etc.?

Exactly. And if someone makes a rude post, that's already against the rules.

Jac@stafford.net
22-Jan-2015, 16:27
More rules invite more opinion, increasing traffic, and if ratified the rule becomes yet another burden for moderators, more expense.

Jac who does not want a moderator on every corner, but WHAT IS MY OPION WORTH? Google that.

TXFZ1
22-Jan-2015, 16:45
Seems to me there is always someone wanting to push the limits of the rules. The rule is a month waiting period before listing or viewing. What about bbsers that have paid the time allotment dues but post FS ads for others. They are listing a sale, allowing the the other to not even have to wait, yet take no responsibility for the listing or sale. Should these also be banned? Seems no different than posting evaluation threads in general.

David

HMG
22-Jan-2015, 20:52
I vote ban.

Online evaluations are nearly impossible of many things, especially lenses, anything glass and definitions vary.

I don't disagree with your point regarding online evaluations. But I question the need for a ban. We can start banning things right and left, but it seems to me that if a post has no value it will get few responses.

Now I could see it if we are getting a lot of members signing up solely for the purpose of a quick, free evaluation. And thereby using a lot of limited resources (computer, administrator, and moderator bandwidth). But I don't see a lot of those posts. Maybe I'm just glossing over them.

As stated earlier in this thread, good rules make for a good forum (or something to that effect). But too many rules make for a dull forum.

Of course, my favorite (unimplemented) rule would be to close any thread when it reaches 5 pages. As this (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?119398-questions-for-people-who-regularly-shoot-nudes) thread shows, a thread of about 5 pages is the limit of civility. :)

Tim Meisburger
23-Jan-2015, 04:50
No real problem here. The forum has existed fine without a ban for fifteen years. Appropriate rules and standards are already in place. No ban.

djdister
23-Jan-2015, 05:54
So ... if the forum continues to allow price evaluation threads, if the usual question comes up "How much is this thing that I [found|borrowed|stole|bought for scrap] worth?" and one person cites an exceedingly low price valuation, would anyone have a problem if another person says that is way below what it is actually worth, and cites a higher price valuation? So the [helpless|clueless|chum] person asking for a simple price evaluation will get a world of opionions, some of which may be pretexting for offers to buy at said low price valuation. Seems to me that anyone who cites a price valuation for some photo gear, antique or not, sight unseen or not, should be required to preface their comments with a disclaimer too. There are some unfortunate people who believe everything they read on Internet forums - crazy, I know! But on the subject of Large Format photography, this forum is more informative than most, except when price valuation discussions come up, and there may be other motives behind one person's opinion of value.

jnanian
23-Jan-2015, 13:15
extremely snipped, sorry dan

One still has to go to a good library.

whats a library, whats a book? i only use google as my library.
do you mean ebook?

Old-N-Feeble
23-Jan-2015, 15:49
If I'm selling a lens then it's worth one.......... hundred.......... billion.......... dollars.

If I'm buying a lens then it's worth one.................................................... dollar.

Larry Gebhardt
24-Jan-2015, 07:25
I assumed missed the original thread that started this issue. For clarification are we discussing valuations or evaluations? Where valuations are discussions of how much something is worth, and evaluations are are how something works and might also include discussions of value.

I personally don't have much issue with either one, but discussions of valuation do frequently cross the line into "for sale" posts so I see why they should be moderated based on the stated rules of the forum (not all of which I agree with, but do try to follow).

djdister
24-Jan-2015, 08:00
I assumed missed the original thread that started this issue. For clarification are we discussing valuations or evaluations? Where valuations are discussions of how much something is worth, and evaluations are are how something works and might also include discussions of value.

I personally don't have much issue with either one, but discussions of valuation do frequently cross the line into "for sale" posts so I see why they should be moderated based on the stated rules of the forum (not all of which I agree with, but do try to follow).

The issue is most definitely price valuations.

FrankS
24-Jan-2015, 08:17
Why wouldn't someone just skip a thread/question he finds bothersome, repetitive, irritating, etc.?

Here is the answer to the question. Simply practice personal choice to not engage in threads you find irksome. Allow everyone the same option.

Ari
24-Jan-2015, 12:27
Here is the answer to the question. Simply practice personal choice to not engage in threads you find irksome. Allow everyone the same option.

Frank, please stop being so rational and logical.

Randy Moe
24-Jan-2015, 12:36
Definition of evaluation in English:
NOUN

The making of a judgment about the amount, number, or value of something; assessment: (http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/evaluation)

FrankS
24-Jan-2015, 12:57
Frank, please stop being so rational and logical.

Thanks Ari, but let's give credit to Michael R who stated the obvious logical solution first. :)

BrianShaw
24-Jan-2015, 13:01
Thanks Ari, but let's give credit to Michael R who stated the obvious logical solution first. :)

Finally. I thought I recognized those words and was about to refer you to an academic honesty review. :o :D

FrankS
24-Jan-2015, 13:08
Finally. I thought I recognized those words and was about to refer you to an academic honesty review. :o :D

:)

Racer X 69
10-Feb-2015, 14:22
When Google becomes self-aware in 2017, it will then tell us what to do.

Google already is and does.

I quit using Google some time back and now use a search engine that claims to not track my searches. So far it appears to be working.

Down with Google!

Racer X 69
10-Feb-2015, 14:38
Does this profession necessarily have to be photography or do union steel workers also qualify if they read this forum our of pure interest?

For 30 years I was a Union Electrical Worker (http://www.ibew.org/), and now I am a Union Aerospace Machinist (http://www.iam751.org/).

Does that mean I cannot pursue my hobby of photography?

Does that mean I cannot peruse this forum, and when having failed to find the answers I seek cannot post a question?