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Fred L
28-Dec-2014, 10:49
Am I the only one who is frustrated when large format field cameras are described in articles as 'old fashioned' ?

A National Geographic piece on favourite cameras used by their photographers describes a metal folding Wista field as such. Is this a fall back catch phrase that they think people will twig onto ? Isn't everything old fashioned ? I could say a Leica MP is old fashioned since it's not far departed from a Leica II (in working principle).

Old-N-Feeble
28-Dec-2014, 11:01
No need for frustration. I'm sure large format cameras have been labelled "old fashioned" for the last several decades... not too longer after the invention of roll film.;)

Sevo
28-Dec-2014, 11:03
Fashions come and go. I've recently had a youth identify a Nikon D2 as old-fashioned...

Jim Galli
28-Dec-2014, 11:09
There's a whole lot more idiotic stuff getting bandied around than that. Hard to argue that a camera with a bellows and film is not 'old fashioned'. Like Sevo says, even the digital world is going to get wrung through that wringer. Look at the front page of BING. How long before a picture that is truly still is rendered old fashioned. I save my ire for true idiocy.

Fred L
28-Dec-2014, 11:28
but coming from people who should know better and can surely come up with a better descriptor. but yeah, there are more important things to worry about. must be the cold meds kicking in ;)

Ari
28-Dec-2014, 11:33
There are more important things to worry about, but this is only the latest dumbing-down of NGS magazine.
I've wanted to cancel our subscription for two years, but my father enjoys reading them when he visits.

Alan Gales
28-Dec-2014, 11:51
I went out to dinner last night to a restaurant that is about to close it's doors after 90 years. We were there to celebrate my mother-in-law's 80'th birthday. At first I could not get the flash to work on my Fujifilm x100s. I eventually figured out that when the camera is in silent mode it kills the flash.

Sometimes old fashioned is a good thing. It sure beats new frustration.

Jac@stafford.net
28-Dec-2014, 12:02
Am I the only one who is frustrated when large format field cameras are described in articles as 'old fashioned' ?

Apparently yes.

Peter Mounier
28-Dec-2014, 12:15
Actually, they are Old-Fashioned if you accept the definition put forth by Merriam Webster ... 1a: of, relating to, or characteristic of a past era.
Or Dictionary.com ... 1. of a style or kind that is no longer in vogue. 2. favored or prevalent in former times.

If you're a journalist and want to convey an image of a view camera, using the word "Old-Fashioned" immediately conjures up the vision of a photographer with a folding camera on a tripod with a dark cloth. Or a news photographer with a field camera. It's effective in communicating that thought with very few words. I use the term myself to describe the type of camera I love to use.

You're a photographer, can you describe a field camera in fewer or more effective words? If someone gives you a blank look when you're talking about your cameras, don't you use those descriptors too?

Jerry Bodine
28-Dec-2014, 13:03
You're a photographer, can you describe a field camera in fewer or more effective words? If someone gives you a blank look when you're talking about your cameras, don't you use those descriptors too?

Never have. Some folks don't even think in those terms. Once while photographing a frozen waterfall from the only safe location with my Sinar Norma, surrounded by tourists (out of necessity), when I was about to come out from under the darkcloth a lady with a definite euro accent called to her husband to come see a 'real camera'. I looked at her and saw the genuine excitement in her eyes as she asked me what kind of camera I was using; I simply said "It's Swiss." She said softly, "Ooooh" and went back to her husband. He never bothered to come look.

jp
28-Dec-2014, 13:21
My little girl called it a fashion camera instead of an old fashioned camera.

Any camera that doesn't have wifi options is old fashioned.

So be it.

Will Whitaker
28-Dec-2014, 13:34
What's really obnoxious are old-fashioned photographers...
:)

jnanian
28-Dec-2014, 13:45
i don't care what NGS says ...

i saw "antiques road show / junk in the trunk" a few hours ago
and a lady had a darlot lens'ed american daguerreotype camera ( tailboard )
i don't think the appraiser called it "old fashioned" he should have !
he described the process (simplistically ) suggested the camera was from about
1850, and then told the owner it was worth about 7,500$ ..

Mark Sawyer
28-Dec-2014, 13:52
Actually, they are Old-Fashioned if you accept the definition put forth by Merriam Webster ... 1a: of, relating to, or characteristic of a past era.
Or Dictionary.com ... 1. of a style or kind that is no longer in vogue. 2. favored or prevalent in former times.


Wikipedia has a much better description, and one that's sure to ease the OP's frustration... :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Fashioned

Fred L
28-Dec-2014, 14:02
THAT Old Fashioned would definitely help...with my cold ;)

Although my post wasn't entirely super serious, I usually get more inevitable questions about buying film for the cameras but that's expected if they think 120 and 35mm film are hard to find. People are surprised when I tell them large format cameras are still being made in several countries and that their prices can rival and often eclipse, the best dslr's out there. well maybe not the Leica S2....this gets their attention

Leszek Vogt
28-Dec-2014, 14:38
The funny-strange thing is, that some people are already looking at D820 and D760 (have seen it on couple of forums)...and anything current will be viewed as "old fashioned". I mean, go figure! They can call whatever it pleases them.

Les

John Kasaian
28-Dec-2014, 15:16
Embrace the "old fashioned" Like it or not, you too are ultimately headed in that direction.

Old-N-Feeble
28-Dec-2014, 17:01
Here's the REALLY funny thing about us old "effers". We were well within our technology standards for decades. These young whippersnappers... outdated in two years. LOL!!!

Jody_S
28-Dec-2014, 18:04
My 8x10 is from 1888, and the 11x14 from 1887. I'm pretty sure that goes right past 'old-fashioned' and into 'antique' territory.

Sal Santamaura
28-Dec-2014, 18:21
Am I the only one who is frustrated when large format field cameras are described in articles as 'old fashioned' ?...I'm certainly not; they are. At the Grand Canyon two weeks ago, passersby frequently asked "how old is that camera?" It was with great satisfaction that I answered every such inquiry by explaining how Ebony built it (SV Wholeplate) for me in 2007. Each person who heard my "speech" was fascinated and surprised, not to mention happy, that such things, including film for them, are still available brand new.

Richard Johnson
28-Dec-2014, 19:26
This says more about how lousy National Geographic magazine has become in recent years.

Mark Sawyer
29-Dec-2014, 02:04
My 8x10 is from 1888, and the 11x14 from 1887. I'm pretty sure that goes right past 'old-fashioned' and into 'antique' territory.

No, you're just decrepit. Welcome to the club, pull up a stool and enjoy...

Ben Calwell
29-Dec-2014, 11:32
With my wooden Wista, folks often think I'm using an "antique" camera, even though I bought it new in 1989.

Alan Gales
29-Dec-2014, 11:42
With my wooden Wista, folks often think I'm using an "antique" camera, even though I bought it new in 1989.

Ben, the original Canon 5D which was the first full frame digital camera was announced in August of 2005. Quite often I have seen it advertised as the "Classic" 5D.

By digital standards your 89 Wista probably is an antique! :)

Drew Wiley
29-Dec-2014, 12:11
I got a few camera comments this weekend. It was my annual ritual walk on the Bear Valley Trail over at Pt Reyes - one of the easiest and most popular trails in the entire Bay Area, but people spread out quickly and are always very polite and don't walk in front of the camera without asking first, and the lack of
wind and crisp winter light are really exceptional there this time of year. The trail attracts a lot of nature-loving types, so everyone seems to have had a DLSR
rather than a cell phone camera. Some tripods. Most just stared at my pack and couldn't believe that thing was just for the sake of a camera. I packed the 4x5 Norma and smaller Ries this time because of some depth of field issues I've had with the 8x10 previously. One guy simply stated, "beautiful camera!". Well, it is.

Jim Galli
29-Dec-2014, 12:26
With my wooden Wista, folks often think I'm using an "antique" camera, even though I bought it new in 1989.

Which proves that antique and old fashioned are not necessarily equivalents.

bob carnie
29-Dec-2014, 12:57
Geezz Fred , its only December , just wait til Feb 18thor so everything will piss you off.


Am I the only one who is frustrated when large format field cameras are described in articles as 'old fashioned' ?

A National Geographic piece on favourite cameras used by their photographers describes a metal folding Wista field as such. Is this a fall back catch phrase that they think people will twig onto ? Isn't everything old fashioned ? I could say a Leica MP is old fashioned since it's not far departed from a Leica II (in working principle).

Drew Wiley
29-Dec-2014, 13:21
I'd say it's NG that's behind the times. Every time they feature some sheet film use, they do something absurdly dated with it, like showing the neg edges all fuzzy,
ala 70's - trying to look trendy I guess; but it generally comes out corny.

dsphotog
29-Dec-2014, 13:52
I'd say it's NG that's behind the times. Every time they feature some sheet film use, they do something absurdly dated with it, like showing the neg edges all fuzzy,
ala 70's - trying to look trendy I guess; but it generally comes out corny.

Does anyone still print magazines?
Wouldn't it be easier to just view them digitally? ..... Nat Geo sounds old fashioned to me.

Fred L
29-Dec-2014, 15:32
Geezz Fred , its only December , just wait til Feb 18thor so everything will piss you off.

I KNOW !!! by the time we get around to the family stat holiday off in Feb, I'll probably be in full grump mode lol

tbh, coming from people who watch me use the camera out and about in Toronto or wherever doesn't phase me, they're honestly curious and almost always surprised to hear that these cameras are still being made and that film is not impossible to find. reading it in a NatGeo piece is another thing. one could suggest they're old fashioned being a dead tree publication etc.. ;)

Drew Wiley
29-Dec-2014, 16:06
NG had an interesting article on Palaeo-Indians that finally admits something I've known for decades; but the other 50% was still the same ole hearsay baloney
that never made sense to begin with. Then there was an article about Nigeria that had some good Polaroid portraits in it, and a brief one on Palaelithoic cave art. I obviously still subscribe; but I wouldn't if it were an e-magazine. I even know lot's of young folks who detest the concept of e-books; so it isn't just me.

John Kasaian
26-Jan-2015, 23:27
I prefer to describe my camera as vintage

Jac@stafford.net
27-Jan-2015, 07:40
I've a short list of things I'll buy.
One item is a genuine accordion case to carry a view camera.
It's about the moment of opening it, except in our Polish neighborhood. I wouldn't want to disappoint anyone there.
.

John Kasaian
27-Jan-2015, 08:37
i've a short list of things i'll buy.
One item is a genuine accordion case to use for a view camera.
It's about the moment of opening it, except in our polish neighborhood. I wouldn't want to disappoint anyone there.
.
roflmao!

Jmarmck
27-Jan-2015, 09:10
The one thing that all these cameras, from the 1887 11x17 to the Nikon D820, have in common is capturing the moment. What anyone else thinks is, well, their opinion and has nothing to do with the image.

On my last trip I had several comments about the Horseman monorail I was lugging around. Always the question of how old the camera was. How hard was the film to get. Why would I use such an old piece of equipment when digital was so much easier. I would simply say, "It is all about the image, not the camera." I still get well educated people asking why I use 4x5 when I have a D800e sitting right there. They assume that digital is just as good.

Kirk Gittings
27-Jan-2015, 09:30
Because a VC is new (ish) doesn't mean it isn't "old fashioned". I could buy a brand new black powder gun or long bow or grow a handlebar mustache or buy a tophat and it would still be old fashioned.

I get that question too but enjoy the interest. Its is definitely old fashioned and in this case it is a good thing.

Drew Wiley
27-Jan-2015, 09:49
Well, since I last posted, I've gotten more admirable comments on the Norma. If I'm toting a mahogany view camera people stop to admire that too, but always ask me how old it is. So I politely respond that the hardware is titanium (not exactly an antique!). With the Norma they kinda know, because it looks at the peak of modern machined quality, just like it is, prior to everything being made out of anodized aluminum etc. Like a classic motorcycle from the same era (or my Durst enlargers). I'm getting to be more of an antique at this point than any of my cameras!

jb7
27-Jan-2015, 09:55
I have no problem with having my camera described as 'old-fashioned' - because that's what it is.
I think it's important to distinguish the word 'fashion' as a verb, meaning 'to make' and not a noun, meaning ''a trend'.

I would have a problem with someone calling my camera 'old' though, and that's a question I get asked more often. Even if the camera is a 1990's Arca F-Line...

Not because the camera isn't old, but because those people who use cameras which actually have some age to them would not be very happy.

drew.saunders
27-Jan-2015, 11:31
When people ask me how old my 2008 Ebony is, I just tell them "It was made in oh eight" and let them guess the century!

Moopheus
27-Jan-2015, 11:52
My Speed Graphic must be old fashioned--whenever you see one in a movie, everyone is wearing a hat.

Of course LF cameras are old-fashioned--they haven't been 'current fashion' for many decades. They're still in use, and you can still buy them new, but they're definitely old-fashioned.

tgtaylor
27-Jan-2015, 11:56
I get asked that question quite a bit also - especially when I'm out with the 8x10. But I tell respond that these are new models which can still be purchased new which is the case for all of my LF cameras except for the ROBOS. The design with the bellows I agree is "old fashioned" but a bellows is necessary, I tell them for the camera to deliver the optical precision which it is designed for. True, I continue, it takes a film back but it could just as easily take a digital back if you have the money for one. As far as the camera is concerned, it could care less if you have film or a digital back.

Thomas

ic-racer
27-Jan-2015, 12:05
The 'old-fashioned camera' label is nothing new. 1948 reference to E. Weston's 'old-fashioned view camera.' http://youtu.be/J8S4HoxuDzw?t=7m39s

tgtaylor
27-Jan-2015, 12:54
With respect to cameras, "old fashioned" was/is a designation employed by the general public lacking the familiarity and understanding of how cameras work.

Thomas

Drew Wiley
27-Jan-2015, 13:16
It always amazes me how much respect a view camera gets in this area, but how many sneers it gets once I cross our little demographic "continental divide"
between the coast and our version of the Midwest, the Central Valley. Welcome to watered-down coffee, soggy pancakes, "environmentalists" being routinely
burned at the stake, and being suspected of being a government spy for using a tripod. Once past that, up in the Sierras, you garner respect once again for the
ability to lug the things over the hills. Of course, someone might mistake you for a five-legged deer and shoot you. But having your head stuffed at taxidermy shop and mounted on a nice lacquered wall shield ain't so bad as long as they take the trouble to match the wood finish to your camera, with it neatly atop the fireplace mantle beside you. And you'll be in company with their other big game trophies, like the angus bull they mistook for a black bear.

John Kasaian
27-Jan-2015, 13:45
My Speed Graphic must be old fashioned--whenever you see one in a movie, everyone is wearing a hat.

Of course LF cameras are old-fashioned--they haven't been 'current fashion' for many decades. They're still in use, and you can still buy them new, but they're definitely old-fashioned.
Since the general population of the US is growing disproportionately older, and as a result, balder, I wouldn't be at all surprised if hats (real hats) came back in fashion. Then your Speeder will look state of the art LOL!

Drew Wiley
27-Jan-2015, 15:09
I still have all my hair, and it would be quite an inconvenience to have to wear a XXXXX Stetson hat just to read Zone V, and an even more expensive XXXXXXXX
cowboy hat to shade the lens for Zone VIII exposures, etc What if the film has a range of twelve Zones. That's a lot of hats to wear at one time! I should go back and read that hat and beard chapter of AA's Basic series just to make sure I understood the Zone System correctly in the first place!

John Kasaian
28-Jan-2015, 08:53
I still have all my hair, and it would be quite an inconvenience to have to wear a XXXXX Stetson hat just to read Zone V, and an even more expensive XXXXXXXX
cowboy hat to shade the lens for Zone VIII exposures, etc What if the film has a range of twelve Zones. That's a lot of hats to wear at one time! I should go back and read that hat and beard chapter of AA's Basic series just to make sure I understood the Zone System correctly in the first place!
LOL!
I'm waiting for someone to post the question--"who made the cowboy hat Ansel Adam's wore?" Or that "Weston had to wear a Bailey because he couldn't afford a Resistol" The soft-focus fans might trade in their cowboy hats for Atget inspired berets. The EU might even see a surge in the demand for Borsalinos. Ten new magazines dedicated to tutorials explaining digital hat filtration will appear at the supermarket news stands.
Freestyle might start selling accessory Mickey Mouse ears for Holgas.
This could have global implications, Drew!

Drew Wiley
28-Jan-2015, 09:41
I know that EW couldn't afford a real Dorff, so used a knockoff. Therefore he couldn't have afforded a Stetson either. These facts explain much of the reason why he was unable to adopt the Zone System. You have to have the right gear. That's why I have real US Kelty packs and want to replace the ash handle on my broken old ice axe, even though there's not much ice still left up there! Something in the universe will work correctly again, even though I'm actually using modern trekking poles these days. The fate of light physics is now dependent upon us. If we fail to uphold our role in all of this, the entire world risks no longer looking upside down !!