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View Full Version : Desperately searching for quality monitor....



Leszek Vogt
14-Nov-2014, 14:13
Just came back from SW (two months) and looking for a real nice monitor. All recommendations will be considered. Although I'm not looking for Eizo level, but a $450-600 range (for PC) should work well for me. Thanks.

Les

Leszek Vogt
14-Nov-2014, 14:17
Rats, forgot to add the size. Anything in 25-30" would do...anything larger would be furniture.

Les

Randy Moe
14-Nov-2014, 14:51
Look at ASUS.

I bought 2 of their first ProArt series and have not regretted it.

They have better now.

Kirk Gittings
14-Nov-2014, 15:35
Randy, I know awhile back they had some problems with one of their graphics quality monitors which made me go another direction at the time. I have not followed their offerings since. How old are yours?

Randy Moe
14-Nov-2014, 15:48
Randy, I know awhile back they had some problems with one of their graphics quality monitors which made me go another direction at the time. I have not followed their offerings since. How old are yours?

I think mine are 3 years old. I have been reading newer reviews in Photo mags and they seem to like the latest ones.

I bought one new for about $350 and a refurb of the exact same thing for $200. 3 years ago.

Of course they are not Eizo, but for me they are very good and affordable.

Mine are last of the PA23Q 23". Now out of production.

A look AMAZON (http://www.amazon.com/PA248Q-24-Inch-LED-Lit-Professional-Graphics/dp/B008DWH00K) shows 24" new ones are cheap.

I recalibrated the first one a couple times and found resetting to stock at 50% brightness was best for me.

Leszek Vogt
14-Nov-2014, 21:13
Thanks, Randy. I just might go little further into the higher resolution (2600x) and 27"...after looking at some options. I'll also look at NEC monitors.

Les

jp
14-Nov-2014, 21:53
I am real happy with my dell u2711, which dell has discontinued and probably replaced with something more affordable and better. I had to upgrade my computer's video card to handle it. I don't use dell computers though.

NEC does very nice high end monitors too, two I bought more than ten years ago are still in use like new with 5 days a week use.

Greg Miller
15-Nov-2014, 08:50
I am real happy with my dell u2711, which dell has discontinued and probably replaced with something more affordable and better. I had to upgrade my computer's video card to handle it. I don't use dell computers though.

NEC does very nice high end monitors too, two I bought more than ten years ago are still in use like new with 5 days a week use.

I have the newer U2713H. It is a very good monitor and I can recommend it. Anyone purchasing it should know that to use the hardware calibration (which is an excellent feature; allows the 14-bit LUT to be programmed) must have an X-Rite i1 Display Pro to take advantage of it.

Randy Moe
15-Nov-2014, 09:49
But who makes DELL, I doubt they make their own monitors.

ASUS, Samsung, Sony, Eizo who else makes the actual monitors?

Preston
15-Nov-2014, 10:06
I have a NEC Multisync PA272, 27". It's by far the best monitor I've owned, and although it's not an Eizo, it gets the job done. It also uses hardware calibration, so you can use either the X-Rite iOne-Pro, or use NEC's SpectraView II and their iOne-branded sensor (recommended). Now, this particular monitor is out of your stated price range, but in my opinion it would be worth saving your pennies for when you can afford it. It's quality vs. price is a good deal. Also, I've been very happy with NEC's tech support.

--P

Greg Miller
15-Nov-2014, 10:28
But who makes DELL, I doubt they make their own monitors.

ASUS, Samsung, Sony, Eizo who else makes the actual monitors?

I don't know. I'm pretty sure that they use somebody's IPS screen, then add their own proprietary hardware and software. Very similar to how Nikon uses Sony sensors in their pro line DSLR's (and adds their own processing chips and algorithms). I don't really need to know who made the sensor, only that the end result delivers a very high quality result (different than, an in many ways better than Sony cameras with the exact same sensor). That's the current state if electronics - manufacturers buy components from other vendors (often with their own custom tweaks baked in), add their own proprietary processing, and end up wiht very different products than other manufacturer using the same components.

Kirk Gittings
15-Nov-2014, 11:02
While I know Eizo makes good monitors, as a photo teacher at a university who bought them, I have seen them crappy right out of the box, uneven and incapable of a proper calibration. Returning them was no problem (and this was a few years ago), but given their price I was surprised by this.

So I have access to these where I teach and quite frankly never felt like owning one was a necessity either for my personal or commercial work even for highly demanding national magazines.

Randy Moe
15-Nov-2014, 11:30
Just like most things, people usually like and defend whatever they buy, inherit or marry.

Hard to make or admit a mistake if ego defines quality or goodness.

'Take my wife, please!' Henny Youngman

Corran
15-Nov-2014, 14:13
Dell Ultrasharp...

Unless you are doing critical color work for magazines, I doubt you'll be unhappy with it. Never had any problem with colors, and I do shoot/edit a lot of work that gets published locally. Mine is great. About the only thing I can criticize is a slightly brighter area in the bottom left of the screen. Doesn't matter in usage. Older models can be found crazy cheap.

Or just about anything with an IPS panel is a good place to start.

Lenny Eiger
15-Nov-2014, 14:44
I am very unhappy with Eizo. I paid $3,000 for this thing. I was embarrassed into buying it because of my scanning business. I had been using Apple monitors before and it was time to upgrade...

A year and a few months later there are big marks on the monitor from de-laminating. I had the same things on the Apple, I got it repaired and it they back fairly quickly. I'm not particularly hopeful that it can be repaired fully to where the marks will never re-appear.

I called them and they said their spiffy 5 year warranty didn't cover de-lamination. Excuse me?!!! The cost to fix was fairly small, around $150, but if I somehow package up this 27 inch behemoth and send it to them I'll be out of commission for 3-4 weeks, including shipping time.

What am I supposed to do during this time? I am certainly not buying another thing from Eizo. They don't have loaners... which I don't understand.

I did like that it calibrated with a spectro that fit into the monitor. However, their Mac software was mediocre at best. Now that Apple has shipped its iMac with the 5k pixels, I am hoping they ship a standalone monitor, with a decent color space in the near future. Then I will buy that, it will come with a video camera, something I use multiple times a day for video conferencing, and it will be nice and sharp.

Then I will send off my Eizo to get fixed, and when it comes back I will sell the thing. Screw Eizo....

My experience is that color management is clearly oversold, having a perfect, full RGB space may or may not be useful to anyone. It hasn't been to me. I look at the print... this Eizo was not worth the money.


Lenny

Jim Andrada
15-Nov-2014, 17:32
My next monitor will probably be an NEC 30".

My problem is more about the sensors that scan the monitor - ie my eyes, than with the monitor itself. One thing that I do find bothersome about most monitors is that you can't crank the brightness down far enough to match up with the normal room illumination levels. I particularly find that overly bright monitors are bad when color grading video.

Full disclosure - NEC is my client (although not the display end of the business) and I have always been impressed with their engineering and quality control. Smart people. They still think technology matters unlike most US "stockholder (well some executive stockholders that is) value".

Peter De Smidt
15-Nov-2014, 17:42
I used a inexpensive Dell IPS monitor for a number of years. I"m sure that the newer ones are better, but it wasn't all that great. When I scored a big, color-critical, post production gig, I went with an NEC Multisync PA271W, Spectraview II, and an i1Display Pro. It's a lot more money, although I've seen specials for the package at around $1000. It is an outstanding and very easy to use system. It paid for itself with one job. My client has the same system with a 24" monitor, and it's great to know that we see the same image. (Yes, we've checked them side-by-side.)

pinup tragic
15-Nov-2014, 18:07
My little square 19" monitor died.. i loved it - so i bought a Dell 2410 ultrasharp as a massive upgrade - older tech now.. a wide gamut monitor - moved house wrapped the monitor in a blanket ( stupidly threw out the carton ) get to the new place fire up the PC - there is dust inside the panel shows as specs of dirt against the white ! - very badly designed but a super monitor

Ari
15-Nov-2014, 18:27
Another vote for Dell monitors, I've been using the same 23" monitor for six years.
If I had money or need for a new screen, I'd look at the UltraSharp series; pretty good bang for the buck, and after six years, I have no complaints about Dell monitors!

onnect17
15-Nov-2014, 21:28
Found a used NEC a few years back (in the auction site) for half the price and very happy so far. The color space covers almost all of AdobeRGB.

koh303
15-Nov-2014, 21:49
I am very unhappy with Eizo. I paid $3,000 for this thing. I was embarrassed into buying it because of my scanning business. I had been using Apple monitors before and it was time to upgrade...

A year and a few months later there are big marks on the monitor from de-laminating. I had the same things on the Apple, I got it repaired and it they back fairly quickly. I'm not particularly hopeful that it can be repaired fully to where the marks will never re-appear.

I called them and they said their spiffy 5 year warranty didn't cover de-lamination. Excuse me?!!! The cost to fix was fairly small, around $150, but if I somehow package up this 27 inch behemoth and send it to them I'll be out of commission for 3-4 weeks, including shipping time.

What am I supposed to do during this time? I am certainly not buying another thing from Eizo. They don't have loaners... which I don't understand.

I did like that it calibrated with a spectro that fit into the monitor. However, their Mac software was mediocre at best. Now that Apple has shipped its iMac with the 5k pixels, I am hoping they ship a standalone monitor, with a decent color space in the near future. Then I will buy that, it will come with a video camera, something I use multiple times a day for video conferencing, and it will be nice and sharp.

Then I will send off my Eizo to get fixed, and when it comes back I will sell the thing. Screw Eizo....

My experience is that color management is clearly oversold, having a perfect, full RGB space may or may not be useful to anyone. It hasn't been to me. I look at the print... this Eizo was not worth the money.


Lenny

If this problem of de laminating happened on both the mac and eizo, maybe the problem is not with the monitor? Did not likr the mac softwsre? Why are you still using a mac?

I have never seen a delaminated screen, but i have seen many dell and nec and lacie monitors shipped with 3 dead pixels, which is below the standard 5 dead pixel limit the warranty covers. After years of staring into a screen i can safely say that switching to an eizo changed my life. It did not break thr bank, and recently at PPE an eizo rep showed me a 27 inch monitor which costs 700$ or so. It is not a coloredge, but has by far the best specs on paper at least.

NEC are equally good, but the price usually make them less relevant.

Btw, square eizo monitors in 19 and 21 inch sizes are considerably cheaper then wide screens, so one could get 2 monitors and use extended desctop for more productivity.

HMG
15-Nov-2014, 22:04
FWIW, dellrefurbished.com sells lease returns, including some Ultrasharp monitors. They periodically run 30 to 40% off specials and free shipping specials. I stick with items in "Grade A" condition (though have only bought laptops, not monitors).

Lenny Eiger
16-Nov-2014, 12:20
If this problem of de laminating happened on both the mac and eizo, maybe the problem is not with the monitor? Did not likr the mac softwsre? Why are you still using a mac?

C'mon, this is a ridiculous contention. De-lamination is not caused by software, or hardware that sits next to it... it's a manufacturing defect.

I've been on the mac for 30 years. I have no interest at all in a mac vs pc discussion, but my personal opinion is that mac is many years ahead of the Windoze operating systems. I have both, and I have no interest in making my life miserable. In the 30 years I have had 20-30 monitors and only 2 have failed.

I'm glad for anyone that likes their Eizo, I am simply reporting that I have had a bad experience with them. My next monitor will be an Apple monitor, with a real warranty.

Lenny

8x10 user
16-Nov-2014, 14:06
I had good experiences with Lacie color reference monitors. Most (or all) of them are rebranded monitors but the quality control is much higher at Lacie then with lets say samsung. Lacie sells monitors with a nice rebranded gretag spyder and their software is very nice... Infact it can be used to calibrate and profile any monitor on mac and windows (I calibrate for everyone I know) and the software is just as good on both platforms (mac or PC). There are a number of custom and preset options to choose from. The software allows you to factor in the ambient color temperature of the room and it has a lot lot more patches then the crappy samsung software.

My Lacie is a 730, which is based on the samsung 30xl. I also own a samsung branded 20xl and it is crap. The blacks are reddish, and the mount is off so it is crooked. I can see why samsung discontinued the product.

koh303
16-Nov-2014, 20:40
C'mon, this is a ridiculous contention. De-lamination is not caused by software, or hardware that sits next to it... it's a manufacturing defect.

I've been on the mac for 30 years. I have no interest at all in a mac vs pc discussion, but my personal opinion is that mac is many years ahead of the Windoze operating systems. I have both, and I have no interest in making my life miserable. In the 30 years I have had 20-30 monitors and only 2 have failed.

I'm glad for anyone that likes their Eizo, I am simply reporting that I have had a bad experience with them. My next monitor will be an Apple monitor, with a real warranty.

Lenny

only 2 have failed, one was a mac, and one was an eizo. The only eizo you had failed, hence it must be 1 of 1 failure rate compared to your mac 1 out of 18-28 failure rate. Both were your 2 last monitors (?), and both had the same exact failure. Maybe you have changed something in what you have been doing in 30 years to have this problem, or it could have been a coincidence you bought two defective screens one after the other.

In my opinion a 5 year warranty is better then a 4 year warranty which would be better then a 1, 2 or 3 year warranty.

I have tried to find out what screen delamination is, as i have never seen or hear about that, and what i found is that 2010-2011 vintage mac screens are prone to that problem. I tried but could not find a similar reference to Eizo monitors with that issue. Still the statistics above cannot lie.

For the price, i would rather have an Eizo/NEC. Each and every one of those i have seen installed changed the life of the person using it (including me). The perceived high price of these is a small price to pay for the inherit benefit they offer to your eyes and brain.

Shootar401
16-Nov-2014, 21:26
I have an Eizo ColorEdge 24". The best $1,800 I ever spent on a monitor. The HP Dreamcolors are very nice also.

I believe NEC makes the IPS display for the Eizo, Not sure about the HP

Lenny Eiger
16-Nov-2014, 22:15
only 2 have failed, one was a mac, and one was an eizo. The only eizo you had failed, hence it must be 1 of 1 failure rate compared to your mac 1 out of 18-28 failure rate. Both were your 2 last monitors (?), and both had the same exact failure. Maybe you have changed something in what you have been doing in 30 years to have this problem, or it could have been a coincidence you bought two defective screens one after the other.

This is just silly. I have plenty of other monitors around here that are fine. The monitor was the first mac product that ever failed on me. I wouldn't suggest that macs never break for anyone else. In my other life, I am a computing professional... I'm sorry but your arguments simply don't hold water. If you knew anything about delamination you would understand it is a manufacturing defect, and not controlled by he computer. here's a thesis: http://drum.lib.umd.edu/bitstream/1903/4125/1/umi-umd-3916.pdf


In my opinion a 5 year warranty is better then a 4 year warranty which would be better then a 1, 2 or 3 year warranty.For the price, i would rather have an Eizo/NEC. Each and every one of those i have seen installed changed the life of the person using it (including me). The perceived high price of these is a small price to pay for the inherit benefit they offer to your eyes and brain.

A warranty, no matter how long, that doesn't cover the most common failure, is not much use. I would venture to say that some monitors are better than others, that's for certain, but this one is not better enough to warrant the price, in my opinion.

I just found out that the newer 5k monitors will be a long wait, apparently they have to wait for the Skylake chip, the one that comes after Haswell, about 1.5-2 years. Ugh. However the Thunderbolt display is long overdue for an upgrade, at about twice the time between all previous upgrades.

The NEC and the Apple Thunderbolt are in the same price range. If Apple puts out a new one with a reasonable color space, I'll get it...

8x10 user
17-Nov-2014, 12:55
If you were closer I'd offer to lend you one of my monitors while the Eizo gets fixed.

I would definitely complain to the company and tell them that the should fix it for free. For the price you paid I'd say its the least they can do. Let them know about this thread and how their poor handling of this issue is hurting their reputation. If you have to, go to the BBB.

8x10 user
26-Nov-2014, 21:37
There is a Sony Artisan on the LL forum for a low price. It might be a good back up monitor for you. It is located in LA.

Lenny Eiger
2-Dec-2014, 09:23
There is a Sony Artisan on the LL forum for a low price. It might be a good back up monitor for you. It is located in LA.

Thanks, that is a great monitor. However, its huge, and I am enjoying the space on my desk. Two weeks ago I cleared it off, put everything in Evernote. The impossible is apparently possible!

Appreciate you keeping me in mind...

Lenny