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Deval
17-Apr-2014, 05:07
Is anyone going this year to the Rodney lough workshop this year. I'm going to the June 6th workshop.

vinny
17-Apr-2014, 08:53
He comes across like a cross between teg nugent and peter lik. Out of curiosity what are you expecting to learn from this MASTER OF PHOTOGRAPHY?

Deval
17-Apr-2014, 11:15
I'm not sure what engenders such negativity. Is he very politically outspoken or something like that or carry a NRA card on his forehead? I certainly understand self-promotion in a competitive field. If you aren't gonna stick up for yourself then don't expect others to. I think a lot of clientele that can afford his images certainly appreciate any titles he appends to his name.

I admire a lot of his work, particularly his non-digital. He has been commercially successful using both, but his most famous pics are done on LF. I don't think its all "marketing." I would love to have enough great work that I was proud of(and that other people like) to open a gallery one day.

That being said, I've just started out in the world of Large Format over the last year, and I have a lot left to learn and do. I've never been to Yosemite, and its been a dream to go for many years and photograph it. I think I could learn a lot from him and he would be a wonderful contact to have.

On the side, he does give large format prints from the trip as a gift.

NancyP
17-Apr-2014, 17:17
I wouldn't mind going to a workshop by Jack Dykinga, simply because I liked his book (ok, it helped me get off duff and start LF)

tgtaylor
17-Apr-2014, 17:55
I have that book! I bought it way back when I was first getting into LF and also found it inspiring. While reading it I recall being silently disapproving when he wrote that he had 6 4x5 lens. "Six!," I thought, "All you need is 3: a wide, normal, and long." Well now, 10 + years later, I have 5 LF cameras and 13! lens for them.

Thomas

Daniel Stone
17-Apr-2014, 19:55
Don't let others discourage you from going. If YOU see something offered(or believe that there could be something there) that will benefit you and your photography(or even your life in general), do it!

Life's too short to make mistakes over and over. Learning from others who have proven to be successful at creating photographs can help propel your work forward, and potentially help you from making mistakes that they did.

If you choose to go, have fun! I wish i could go!

-Dan

dsphotog
17-Apr-2014, 22:37
I'm sure you'll get great images!
Happy shooting!

biedron
19-Apr-2014, 06:52
If you go, I'd be interested in hear your thoughts on the workshop. Lough was probably one of the last "big name" LF color landscape photographers to turn digital. Seems like Lik and Dykinga caved in well before Lough

Bob

QT Luong
19-Apr-2014, 17:05
I wasn't aware that he switched to digital. If so, who is still doing color nature landscape photography in film besides Christopher Burkett ?

Kodachrome25
19-Apr-2014, 17:35
I bet there are a few out there but they are not big on web presences and deal directly with regional gallery representation. Not everyone wants or needs the limelight of being known on the web by potential competition, even though my visibility is about to change on the web big time, I have done *really* well by flying below the radar in that regard.

I have a little bit of color 4x5 for a handful of specific bodies of work but we all know color film's days are likely numbered so it is what it is. I guess that is one of the many beautiful things about black & white, you don't have to fall victim the digital monster.

biedron
19-Apr-2014, 21:53
I wasn't aware that he switched to digital. If so, who is still doing color nature landscape photography in film besides Christopher Burkett ?

Check out http://www.rodneyloughjr.com/photos/foto_folio/1 "Film: IQ180 (iso 35)"

Daniel Stone
20-Apr-2014, 14:01
I wasn't aware that he switched to digital. If so, who is still doing color nature landscape photography in film besides Christopher Burkett ?

I am ;)

Drew Wiley
21-Apr-2014, 08:17
Why wouldn't people be using film? It's made for a reason.

Vaughn
21-Apr-2014, 09:11
Is anyone going this year to the Rodney lough workshop this year. I'm going to the June 6th workshop.

Have a great workshop! It will be a dry summer, so an early June visit to Yosemite will be great! I'll be heading back to Yosemite the second week of May to attend the opening reception of a group show I am in at the AA Gallery (which will be down by the time you get there).

My first workshop was with Bruce Barnbaum back in 1985. I hope you get as much out of your workshop experience as I did!

Vaughn

Stephen G Bennett
21-Apr-2014, 22:16
You'll have a good time at the workshop with Rodney. I went to his Colorado Color workshop September 2008, and received some encouraging pushes on attention to in-frame composition and attention to light quality. I was shooting 35mm at the time, and it was watching Rodney make a photo of the Crystal Mill with his 8x10 which set me on the LF path, and I've never looked back. No matter who you're going there with, Yosemite is a life-changing place!
Steve Bennett

vinny
22-Apr-2014, 04:21
I actually think he's got some great work and obviously dedicated a lot of time to his craft. It's the way he describes himself that makes me not want to meet him or spend $3k for a couple days with him. There are plenty of photographers who teach workshops in yosemite.

Deval
22-Apr-2014, 06:56
Thanks for the feedback. I'm still very excited about it. I'm thinking of taking some Velvia 100 and Ektar 100, possibly tmax. I have a 3-stop singh-ray grad and a 3-stop reverse grad. I'm thinking of getting an 81a or b, some type of polarizer, and maybe a 25 or 29 for black and white. Any other filters/brands that you would recommend for a trip like this.

I understand if this reply belongs in another thread, but I would love to get some feedback

vinny
22-Apr-2014, 07:09
since there aren't many even horizons (such as those on lakes), those grads won't do you a ton of good. I'd take a two stop soft edge grad though. If you can only have one 81, I'd get an 81b. A orange filter rather than a red #25 would be my choice as well since there's lots of greenery that a red filter often darkens too much.

Kirk Gittings
22-Apr-2014, 11:05
since there aren't many even horizons (such as those on lakes), those grads won't do you a ton of good. I'd take a two stop soft edge grad though. If you can only have one 81, I'd get an 81b. A orange filter rather than a red #25 would be my choice as well since there's lots of greenery that a red filter often darkens too much.

Experienced advice.

Drew Wiley
22-Apr-2014, 11:23
There can be a surprisingly large amt of smoke haze in Yos Valley in the Summer, either from campfires, control burns, or wildfires. Sometimes a red filter is very
valuable to have along if you need to cut thru the haze.

ROL
23-Apr-2014, 08:12
Thanks for the feedback. I'm still very excited about it. I'm thinking of taking some Velvia 100 and Ektar 100, possibly tmax. I have a 3-stop singh-ray grad and a 3-stop reverse grad. I'm thinking of getting an 81a or b, some type of polarizer, and maybe a 25 or 29 for black and white. Any other filters/brands that you would recommend for a trip like this.

I understand if this reply belongs in another thread, but I would love to get some feedback

Ignoring Drew's relentless hardon for red filters, why is it that you think you need such strong filtration for B/W?

Drew Wiley
23-Apr-2014, 08:42
Actually, conifers and most other trees transmit quite a bit of red light. Just look what infrared film does to foliage. And after the chlorophyll departs from deciduous
leaves in the fall, what color are they? ... But I made reference to red filtration in Yos V. because many people seem to envision the place winter-postcardy in the
Summer, which it isn't. The atmosphere can be pretty heavy. Maybe that's why I like Watkin's rendition of the place better than AA's. His old blue-sensitive emulsions
look more realistic, and give a better impression of space. Anybody for a deep blue filter???

Deval
23-Apr-2014, 10:57
Ignoring Drew's relentless hardon for red filters, why is it that you think you need such strong filtration for B/W?

I don't own any of the colored filters yet. I know ansel did red, and he did Yosemite pretty well. I'm assuming the white/grey peaks of yosemite against a dark sky would give a pretty dramatic high contrast scene...I'd be happy to pick up an orange filter though as well.

Is the cyan cast from Ektar 100 a product of the scanning, or does anyone know if the emulsion itself tends to lean that way. Removing it isn't difficult in PS or LR, but annoying nonetheless. Any filter to correct to improve that? I don't have a darkroom or access to a darkroom.

Vaughn
23-Apr-2014, 11:45
While I do not use filters much (I generally prefer lighter skies in my images), I have noticed that an orange filter tends to have a stronger affect on skies than red (sky-blue, or cyan, being opposite of orange on the color wheel).

I grew up with a couple of Carleton Watkins prints of the Sierras, and perhaps have been influenced by them a bit. And I like a little atmospheric distance in images.

But if you get some thunderstorms (a little early, but you never know), a filter might be nice to have.

4x10 platinum print of Yosemite Valley (no filter) and Watkins 16x20 contact print (safe to assume no filter) taken above the American River at Cape Horn.

Drew Wiley
23-Apr-2014, 12:13
If you're taking Ektar color film, I'd strongly recommend having along an 81A light amber filter for correcting blue balance under overcast or shaded conditons.

ROL
25-Apr-2014, 10:01
I don't own any of the colored filters yet. I know ansel did red, and he did Yosemite pretty well. I'm assuming the white/grey peaks of yosemite against a dark sky would give a pretty dramatic high contrast scene...I'd be happy to pick up an orange filter though as well.

With all due respect, you only know what others think they know about Adams and his technique. Adams rarely used strong filtration. He obtained his particular vision through the application of exposure and printing. If all you know is what you stated, you know nothing of the man or his technique. Please read Adams' The Negative, as many times as necessary. With the notable exception of one unfortunately infamous photograph, Monolith, he almost never used red or orange filters in his interpretation and visualization of natural landscapes. Unless you are planning on a hike up to the Diving Board to parrot that work, as many have, I would suggest leaving the reds and oranges at home. AA's dark skies in his fine art prints, which by the way are not nearly as common as most believe, and contrast, were in the main arrived at through application of specific exposure technique, light contrast filtration, and expertise in the darkroom.

You need nothing more than a good understanding of light, application of proper exposure principles, and a medium, or at most, deep yellow filter, and perhaps a polarizer. You may find a green filter of limited value for separating out greens that late in the Spring. Any other filter would only be of use for specific artistic interpretation. Red, and to some degree orange, filters will wipe out the lovely mid tones your panchromatic film is capable of rendering, resulting in unrealistically harsh compositions. Your stated muse, AA, refers to this in his teachings as "soot and chalk" on many, many occasions.

There has, over the last few years, been a sustained presence in internet photography forums of the complete misunderstanding of the use of red filters, both by Adams, and in general. In part, I have come to believe that this has been both a subtle and ignorant campaign by shooters who, looking for short cuts to a certain "look", eschew and defame proper exposure technique and appreciation of light. Among these are Zone System deniers, who having failed to learn or commit to its concepts, advise others to achieve that Ansel look by slapping on red filters. Chief among these, I discovered a few month back, are Roger and Frances (http://rogerandfrances.com/subscription/ps%20zone.html), whose revile for the ZS knows no bounds. Their posted image examples are testament to the chalk and soot consequences of indiscriminate use of red filters. I don't personally care what system of exposure/development one uses, but you have no business using overly strong filtration without a thorough understanding of light, your materials, and the specific visualization to use them.

I have no idea whether or not Lough teaches exposure technique, or even whether he is a capable monochrome photographer, but if he is unable to set you straight on the principles of proper filtration, I would advise skipping the workshop and exploring Yosemite on your own – as Adams did.

Drew Wiley
25-Apr-2014, 10:13
Hmmm ... those inky black skies on AA's more famous "dramatic" shots just came from darkroom manipulation, using graded papers????? That would be quite a trick. I don't think I have a single example of a "soot and chalk" print in my entire collection of personal work. More often than trying to create a "dramatic sky" with a red filter, it's actually a wonderful means of enhancing midtone microtonality in things like rock texture, differentiating different parts of a scene which might otherwise merge in value. Same goes for deep green or blue filters when judiciously used. The whole point of tools is to use them wisely; and this does take testing and sheer
experience actually printing images. Gotta start somewhere. Take some of the same shots both with and without filtration just to get an idea.

Drew Wiley
25-Apr-2014, 10:56
Stunning "naturalistic" shots of Yos Valley were being taken before AA was even born, with what would today be equivalent of extreme filtrations. Blue sensitive film
was equivalent to using a very deep blue tricolor filter on pan film today. Later, ortho film was equivalent to using a deep green. And there's no law against having
fun in the learning curve. One doesn't have to crawl barefoot through Tibet to find some guru, then sit cross-legged on a bamboo mat for twenty year meditating
how many Zones exist in the cosmos, then spent fourteen years with a densitometer, just to find out you really haven't learned anything yet.

karl french
25-Apr-2014, 11:29
Wow, now I'm getting tired of BOTH of you.

Bruce Barlow
26-Apr-2014, 06:18
When I was in Yosemite last year, the smoke was so think that photography was pretty pointless. I left the park by 11 the same day. I was angry and sad, unable to make the requisite postcards.

On my way out, I turned on the road to Hetch-Hetchy, having never seen it. Instead, I saw where the fire had destroyed the forest, with the ground a light grey from ashes, and the trees black, including all the big, gorgeous Ponderosa pines. I was stopped from reaching the reservoir by a Ranger, because the fire was still out-of-control there. He said that the damage was unbelievable, and that it would take decades for the forest to recover.

Made my bad mood about photography seem pretty petty. Dope-Slapped by the Universe. What a great day, to learn such a lesson!

Jmarmck
26-Apr-2014, 06:32
The Valley floor is about 4,000 ASL, which is enough to increase UV radiation. The moisture and morning smoke (some mornings there are worse than LA) will add a cast as well. Ye ole Ektachrome also has that blue cast. A warming filter with any color would be an advantage. Personally, I like the darker skies if only to make the snowy peaks standout. I used a polarizer most of the time.

Vaughn
26-Apr-2014, 09:51
I have also been in the Valley a few times when there have been large fires going above it. Talk about being under a huge warming filter! One advantage is that people left the campground in droves due to afternoon down-canyon winds filling the Valley with very thick smoke, but the early morning up-canyon winds made for clear air in the Valley for the first part of the day.

From the YNP website:

In Yosemite Valley, campfires are permitted only between 5 pm and 10 pm from May through September. At other times of the year and in out-of-Valley campgrounds, fires are permitted at any time.

So that will help with a lot of the morning smoke issues. As long as there are no wildfires happening down canyon, then the Valley should have good mornings during the summers. I have been camping in the Valley this past Feb and then just last week or so. No problem with smoke. Air was still for most of the time. I'll be there again the second week-end of May, so I will see what the air quality situation is!

Drew Wiley
28-Apr-2014, 08:18
Yosemite Valley lies at a relatively low elevation, where there is always some intrusion of ordinary summer smog and pollen haze. Allowing campfires in summer seems
downright idiotic, but that's what visitors want. Control burns or wildfires also tend to channel a certain amt of smoke into the Valley. If you don't like that, just head uphill. After all, the road tops out clear up at Tioga Pass, and it's not that bad a drive at all. The air is nearly always clear at that altitude, and there's plenty of classic Park photo subjects all around. If you're expecting one of those fluffy winter shots of the Valley, go in the winter!

NancyP
29-Apr-2014, 07:34
Yes, I don't see why people don't use one of the convenient isopropane stoves, which are safer in terms of ability to start a forest fire, and are easier to cook with anyway.

vinny
29-Apr-2014, 08:38
Yes, I don't see why people don't use one of the convenient isopropane stoves, which are safer in terms of ability to start a forest fire, and are easier to cook with anyway.
they don't crackle, give off much light, and sure as shit don't smell like campfire!

Vaughn
29-Apr-2014, 10:24
they don't crackle, give off much light, and sure as shit don't smell like campfire!

And in Yosemite Valley, mostly likely 80% or more of the campfires are not made to cook with (not counting marshmellows).

Drew Wiley
29-Apr-2014, 11:04
Why I almost never camp in public campgrounds. There's just nothing quite like being in the "great outdoors" along with 30,000 other people on
a hot summer nite, wheezing and coughing with fires all around, staying awake with boom boxes and loud drunken laughter everywhere. At least
when the deer hunters are out camping in fall color, it gradually quiets down once they are inebriated enough to either pass out or accidentally shoot themselves or one another. The deer are generally safe.