Question for recent purchasers of the Shen Hao 8x10

[csxcnj]

Searching past posts I've always seen Shen Hao's spoken of favorably but always coming in second to Chamonix in build and finish quality. None of the posts I found are very current.

Can anyone comment on a recently purchased Shen Hao 8x10? Has the quality improved to Chamonix levels?
Or is the difference so negligible that it isn't worth worrying about?

Thanks, Bob

[vinny]

I've only owned one shenhao (a 4x5) several years ago.
I've owned two chamonix 4x5's and they are excellent except for an issue with the graflock back using roll holders. The chamonix 45n-2 has taken care of that.
Lots of guys think Chamonix's are made of carbon fiber and aluminum. It's actually wood covered in carbon fiber and it's very rigid compared to just wood alone.

[Regular Rod]

I don't have a Chamonix camera but my Shen Hao FCL810-A is a delight to behold and to use. I can only imagine one functional improvement possible for it and that would be to have a bail operated back although I have had no problems using the conventional back. It is good value for money and seems to me to be built to a very high standard. If I lost it I'd replace it with another.

RR

[Bob Mann]

I don't have a Chamonix camera but my Shen Hao FCL810-A is a delight to behold and to use. I can only imagine one functional improvement possible for it and that would be to have a bail operated back although I have had no problems using the conventional back. It is good value for money and seems to me to be built to a very high standard. If I lost it I'd replace it with another.

RR

I agree, I own one and the build quality is fine. I prefer the design of the front standard on the Shen Hao both for movements and for folding. There is a considerable price difference last time I checked - I am happy about the $$ I saved and results I am getting with the camera.

[Cletus]

I would echo Bob Man's assessment of the Shen Hao FCL-810A - I chose that camera over the Chamonix, mainly because of the front standard's superior arrangement and for some other reasons as well. To Rod's comment, I also agree that a bail back would have been nice, but I've never really regretted not having it and if an opportunity to retrofit one came up, I probably wouldn't take it now.

Another weakness (if you want to call it that) I discovered on the Shen Hao, in the front standard, is the wood cross-piece that supports the two side rails. This is the part that has the 'extension screw' or whatever it's called, that allows front swing/shift and to change the bellows extension. Shortly after I bought the camera, I turned my back for a second on a windy day and it took a fall, landing right on the front standard and this cross piece cracked. Ow! Fortunately I was working in tall grass and not concrete, or the fall damage would have been much worse, for the camera and the lens. I repaired the part with a little Gorilla Glue, but I never felt good about it after that and always worried about it. I finally replaced the wood cross-piece with a black anodized aluminum part, custom made by Hejnar Photo (on Ebay), which has been a big improvement in that area. It looks nice too and has a white engraved shift scale, as on the original piece and only cost about $200.

Overall, I don't regret the choice of saving $1K on the Shen Hao vs the Chamonix and if I had it to do over, I would definitely choose the Shen Hao again. I've actually turned into a proper Fanboy for these quality Chinese cameras, after using them for awhile now - and ironically, if this was ten years ago, I would have gone to my grave swearing I'd never trust anything out of China! I was and still am an absolute quality fanatic and these cameras fully pass any scrutiny I can give them.....FWIW.

I currently own a Chamonix 45-n2 and used to have the Shen Hao 45HZXII and it's a close call there, too. The Shen Hao has more movements (along with a LOT of little knobs) but the Chamonix (4x5) is lighter and much more elegant in its design. Overall fit and finish is very good on both cameras, but I'd admit the Chamonix has slightly better finishing on the wood itself. This really does look nice and probably gives the Chamonix an edge, but ultimately it is just cosmetic. The hardware, knobs and fittings on the Chamonix 4x5 is of higher quality than that of the Shen Hao 4x5 too, though the Shen is still quite good. To do over, I would choose the Chamonix for the 4x5, but I'd still stick with the FCL810A for 8x10. That's just me. I also have Sinar F1 4x5 and I actually use it quite a bit more than the Chamonix in that format, so everything really is relative, right?

All the hardware on the Shen Hao FCL810 has excellent fit and finish and is equal, if not even superior, to the Chamonix. Caveat is, I've only personally seen and own the Chamonix 4x5 and not the 8x10, so I'm "extrapolating" a little here. As has been said before, the wood finish on the Shen Hao FCL probably isn't quite as 'polished' as the Chamonix, but this isn't significant enough for me to be a shortcoming or complaint, only an observation. The actual precision and fit of the wood parts on the Shen are excellent and I can't find a single fault or flaw in that regard.

All in all, you couldn't go wrong with either camera from either make as they are both superb, modern cameras with modern design elements that just aren't present on earlier cameras. I'm not knocking Deardorff, but I've said many times and still believe that the Dorff' was king in it's day and that day was quite a long time ago. As low tech as a view camera is, the technology has still come a long way and I wouldn't even consider something like a Deardorff with so many contemporary offerings available now in the wood field camera market - Canham, Ritter, Ebony, etc..

These days, with so many great choices out there it can be a difficult choice to get into the LF world. For me, I'm still partial to the excellent quality and value being offered in these handmade Chinese cameras and as long as they keep making them to the standards they are now, I'll keep looking to and promoting these two brands.

[Cletus]

FYI - Besides being naturally long winded, I am currently on my fourth day sitting (and sleeping) in my pickup truck, basically stranded along I-20E due to the weather and icy roads. I am quite thankful to have LTE cellular internet service though, which allows me to stay online and kill time writing lengthy post responses to questions about cameras! :eek:

[csxcnj]

Just got done with a 300 mile round trip to PA. and am tired, cold and going to bed so I'll read all the responses in detail tomorrow, but Cletus I read your last post and WOW man, hang in there. I'm guessing you have some supplies and a way to keep warm but still, stay safe.

G'night all, looking forward to reading the replies.

[csxcnj]

All, thanks for your replies. Cletus, I saw your thread on the modification you did to the front standard. Looks good and that was a pretty good price. Are you still stuck in your truck?

I'm new to large format but am enjoying 4x5 so far. Admittedly I have hardly any time to speak of under my belt with it, but my pathway with photography has been continuosly backwards. From digital only to Digital and a little film, to some film & some digital to mostly film with the type of film photography that is the most involved being the most satisfying to me. If the enjoyment I'm getting from 4x5 continues I'll be trying an 8x10 this spring.

I'd love to get a Canham or a Ritter some day but For now my budget rules and even the $700 plus savings on a Shen Hao compared to the Chamonix will make a difference.

[Regular Rod]

$700 to put towards more film!
:D
RR

[csxcnj]

$700 to put towards more film!
:D
RR

Exactly :)

[Cletus]

Just took a look, out of curiosity, at the Badger Graphic site and the FCL810-A. Looks like there's been a few changes to both price and the camera itself.

I paid right at $2K (maybe $2,050 or something) when I bought mine in...2011, I think. So I guess that's not all bad in there must be some demand, which bodes well for LF photography in general. I was trying to see what the "$700" signified, now I understand...

One of the other changes appears to be hardware related - for as long as I've been aware of this camera, which is quite a few years. All the knobs were clear aluminum 'color', with a little black rubber knurled grip ring inset into the knob. Now it appears the black rubber ring has gone away and the knobs are all solid aluminum. While I never had any trouble with the rubber rings, I'm sure after time they could loosen a bit and slip, or even be lost if one was hard on their camera.

Gotta bring up another positive point on the FCL810 now - without looking at my camera at the moment I would say that ALL of the hardware used threaded, or otherwise adjustable/replaceable hardware, instead of the permanent rivets used in many places by other makers. To me this means that if I decided I wanted to look into replacing my old style knobs with the new style - something I'll have to ask John at BG about - I wouldn't have to send my camera off somewhere to get the work done. Just wanted to add that little point to the inventory here.

Oh, and I finally made it back home to Dallas last night after a long, slow day creeping along I-20E, thanks for asking. It got above freezing for a good part of the day yesterday, allowing travel for many stranded drivers, mostly semi trucks.

[ic-racer]

I bought a new FCL810 in 2010 and there were no 'build' or 'finish' quality issues with the camera. The front standard is quite different from the Chamonix and if folds up differently, a bag bellows is available for the FCL810 and it comes with a Sinar-to-Linhof adapter lensboard. Perhaps it is the older Chamonix that had issues as they have upgraded that camera and it is now 1Kg heavier. I'd select the camera with the features you want, not the camera someone on the internet owns.

[csxcnj]

Perhaps it is the older Chamonix that had issues as they have upgraded that camera and it is now 1Kg heavier. I'd select the camera with the features you want, not the camera someone on the internet owns.

Perhaps you meant the older Shen Hao, as all reviews I have read for Chamonix have been positive, no matter how old. The Shen Hao has what I want for an 8x10 but there were a lot of older reviews that were negative compared to the Chamonix and I never found an really current reviews. That is why I'm asking recent purchasers of the SH how they like them.
Because that is the one I'd prefer.

Thanks for the comments on yours.

[ic-racer]

You probably know that the FCL810 is a relatively new model in the Shen Hao line did you read negative reviews of that one?

[csxcnj]

You probably know that the FCL810 is a relatively new model in the Shen Hao line did you read negative reviews of that one?

I've found posts about the FCL810 going back to 2006 so it doesn't seem that new.

[Sergio]

Any opinions regarding the Shen-Hao TFC 810A , for landscape pictures ?
Thanks
Sergio

[Daniel Strasshofer]

Sergio,
I do have 2 Shen Hao cameras in 8x10". The FCL810-A and the HZX810. Both cameras are superbly constructed and built. Even compared to the Chamonix 045N-1 and the Ebony 45S I owned before! Sometimes it is difficult to choose one of the cameras. Now I use the HZX810, when I want to use long lenses. The HZX can easily handle my 30" Artar! Bellows draw is 800mm and it`s stable! For the FCL810-A the max is my Fujinon-C 600mm - bellows draw is around 680mm. When I want to travel light I use the FCL810-A, it`s much lighter. The main differences in usage are coming from the construction principles. The HZX810 is a classic double extension folding camera, the FCL810-A is "Phillips-style" camera. I found out, that the classic design is quicker in setup for me and it`s a little more stable.
You can see a comparison here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/22668450@N08/11694728736/

Daniel